Old cars on track days
Discussion
drakart said:
A friend of mine has tracked his 1924 Bentley 3 4 1/2 Le Mans.
There are certainly no seat belts on that!
I know several people who race in the VSCC with Bentleys, Bugattis and the like. I suspect some of the more extreme examples would keep quite a few modern cars honest - a well driven ERA must still be pretty rapid by the standard of normal production sports cars. There are certainly no seat belts on that!
It was mostly a matter of curiosity, but in the back of my mind was the idea of getting my father's Silverstone on track. It's straightline performance is about the same as an MX5 or something, so shouldn't be a great danger on an appropriate track day. Whether or not you'd want to venture out without seatbelts is a different matter, of course. I know I tend to argue against the idea of immediately kitting track cars out with full cages and huge brakes, but I might draw the line at being launched into the scenery.
[quote] a well driven ERA must still be pretty rapid by the standard of normal production sports cars. quote]
I would say that an ERA would pull most modern cars pants down, laptime wise. I am a regular VSCC visitor and love nothing more to see vintage cars being used as they should. I am not a fan of musuems, the chap with the bentley has a lot of them and many other lovely old cars (over 20). He drives them all hard and they are more reliable for the regular use...
quote]I would say that an ERA would pull most modern cars pants down, laptime wise. I am a regular VSCC visitor and love nothing more to see vintage cars being used as they should. I am not a fan of musuems, the chap with the bentley has a lot of them and many other lovely old cars (over 20). He drives them all hard and they are more reliable for the regular use...
drakart][quote said:
a well driven ERA must still be pretty rapid by the standard of normal production sports cars. quote]
I would say that an ERA would pull most modern cars pants down, laptime wise. I am a regular VSCC visitor and love nothing more to see vintage cars being used as they should. I am not a fan of musuems, the chap with the bentley has a lot of them and many other lovely old cars (over 20). He drives them all hard and they are more reliable for the regular use...
Yep. It sticks in my mind that someone did fifth wheel tests on a Type 35 and it recorded a 0-60mph time of about 6 seconds! That would be hillarious if you pulled up at the lights next to a hot hatch or a luke-warm Impreza. quote]I would say that an ERA would pull most modern cars pants down, laptime wise. I am a regular VSCC visitor and love nothing more to see vintage cars being used as they should. I am not a fan of musuems, the chap with the bentley has a lot of them and many other lovely old cars (over 20). He drives them all hard and they are more reliable for the regular use...
drakart said:
Chris71 said:
a well driven ERA must still be pretty rapid by the standard of normal production sports cars.
I would say that an ERA would pull most modern cars pants down, laptime wise. I am a regular VSCC visitor and love nothing more to see vintage cars being used as they should. I am not a fan of musuems, the chap with the bentley has a lot of them and many other lovely old cars (over 20). He drives them all hard and they are more reliable for the regular use... Edited by Steve Spider on Wednesday 11th November 11:40
Steve Spider said:
drakart said:
Chris71 said:
a well driven ERA must still be pretty rapid by the standard of normal production sports cars.
I would say that an ERA would pull most modern cars pants down, laptime wise. I am a regular VSCC visitor and love nothing more to see vintage cars being used as they should. I am not a fan of musuems, the chap with the bentley has a lot of them and many other lovely old cars (over 20). He drives them all hard and they are more reliable for the regular use... 
A well modified "classic" or vintage will be fine on a trackday.
I have a Triumph Vitesse with the usual track mods (2.6 straight 6, decambered, big brakes and adjustable suspension, caged hernessed ect) and it's pretty quick even by modern standards.
I had an Esprit Turbo before this and can honestly say this is more fun.
Lots of people use classics like MGBs and midgets, GT6's, TR's just depends what your expectations are.
I did a trackday at Oulton on Saturday with Club Triumph /Mazda Mx5 club, and the MG owners club and we all had a hoot, some other modernish cars in there too - 205gti, Saab turbo which the old track prepared cars had the legs of.
I know these are classics rather than vintage but two guys used 1947 MG TD's and flew round.
I would say if you want to use a vintage join an owners club like MGOC or such as some will have track days for cars of the period so you don't get that 600hp Skyline breathing down your neck while adjusting your goggles lol.
The MGOC mix up modern MGF's and stuff with classics too and a track prepped car will still beat most warmish road cars.
Take a look at the lap times for the "Top Hat Masters" series and you will see how competitive these oldies are.
If you like I can post some pictures of the stuff that attended but here's a short brief.
TR6
Elva
Race and road Midgets
4.6 V8 MGB's
TR8's
2 x 1947 MGTD's (one had 140bhp supercharged)
2500PI's
Standard 10
Dolomite Sprint
2.0 PI Spitfires
That day was MG / Triumph based but really good atmosphere with lots of spannering and tweaking going on during lunch.
On the ERA - don't know your budget but open wheels (specially open twin rears) aren't allowed on any trackdays im aware of but I don't think you will be going that far eh?
I have a Triumph Vitesse with the usual track mods (2.6 straight 6, decambered, big brakes and adjustable suspension, caged hernessed ect) and it's pretty quick even by modern standards.
I had an Esprit Turbo before this and can honestly say this is more fun.
Lots of people use classics like MGBs and midgets, GT6's, TR's just depends what your expectations are.
I did a trackday at Oulton on Saturday with Club Triumph /Mazda Mx5 club, and the MG owners club and we all had a hoot, some other modernish cars in there too - 205gti, Saab turbo which the old track prepared cars had the legs of.
I know these are classics rather than vintage but two guys used 1947 MG TD's and flew round.
I would say if you want to use a vintage join an owners club like MGOC or such as some will have track days for cars of the period so you don't get that 600hp Skyline breathing down your neck while adjusting your goggles lol.
The MGOC mix up modern MGF's and stuff with classics too and a track prepped car will still beat most warmish road cars.
Take a look at the lap times for the "Top Hat Masters" series and you will see how competitive these oldies are.
If you like I can post some pictures of the stuff that attended but here's a short brief.
TR6
Elva
Race and road Midgets
4.6 V8 MGB's
TR8's
2 x 1947 MGTD's (one had 140bhp supercharged)
2500PI's
Standard 10
Dolomite Sprint
2.0 PI Spitfires
That day was MG / Triumph based but really good atmosphere with lots of spannering and tweaking going on during lunch.
On the ERA - don't know your budget but open wheels (specially open twin rears) aren't allowed on any trackdays im aware of but I don't think you will be going that far eh?
Edited by racingsnake on Thursday 12th November 12:29
racingsnake said:
On the ERA - don't know your budget but open wheels (specially open twin rears) aren't allowed on any trackdays im aware of but I don't think you will be going that far eh?
Hmm... Talbot Lago or one of the larier Bugattis maybe? They've got as many seats and the same wheel configuration as a Caterfield. (Might be labouring the point a little though, yes!)
Was amazed at just how fast some of the really old stuff is. I grew up with vintage cars so I'm no stranger to the drama they produce, but I didn't realise how respectable they are against the clock - albeit in a straightline. A guy at the place I used to work had a highly modified Wolsey Hornet Special (the 1930s sports car, not the '60s monstrosity) and that produced about 100bhp/litre supercharged. Its performance figures - at 1300cc - were about the same as my (1990s) TVR S3.
I guess people assume modern cars will be quick. Some people realise that slightly older classics - 50s/60s/70s cars like Big Healeys, classic Ferraris etc - needn't be slow. At the extreme though, I think very few people would expect this:
To be as quick 0-60 as this:
Okay, enhanced retro tyres, perfectly dry tarmac, good launch etc... you get the idea though!
This is my 40 year old MGB, somewhat modified, but so much fun mixing it with the modern stuff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWa4n7iVCm8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWa4n7iVCm8
ERAs have a weight of less than a tonne and have up to 280hp. That makes a quick car!
i remember being a passenger in a Bentley Speed Six, the way it went from 90-100mph was amazing! The gear changes aren't that quick, but once in top gear those things fly!
Anyone who thinks that old cars/racing cars are slow need to come to a race meeting!
i remember being a passenger in a Bentley Speed Six, the way it went from 90-100mph was amazing! The gear changes aren't that quick, but once in top gear those things fly!
Anyone who thinks that old cars/racing cars are slow need to come to a race meeting!
drakart said:
I remember being a passenger in a Bentley Speed Six, the way it went from 90-100mph was amazing! The gear changes aren't that quick, but once in top gear those things fly!
My boss' Derby Bentley with no mechanical mods and a fairly substantial touring body will more or less out accelerate my Focus away from the traffic lights! One of the 2-seat re-engineered supercharged 8-litre jobbies must be terrifying.I remeber being at a VSCC event and hearing the commentator explain that he'd been driving along at about the limit on the motorway when one of the Edwardian behemoths overtook him! Now that's impressive... Of course, to the Max Power brigade, anything made before 1960 probably looks the same, so just how ancient it is would be a bit lost on them if you out accelerated their Corsa in something made less than two decades after the death of Queen Victoria.
Chris71 said:
.. Of course, to the Max Power brigade, anything made before 1960 probably looks the same, so just how ancient it is would be a bit lost on them if you out accelerated their Corsa in something made less than two decades after the death of Queen Victoria.....
Edited by fergus on Thursday 12th November 19:50
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