John Moores University Liverpool; Automotive Engineering?
Discussion
Hey guys,
Some of you may remember a thread I started about Lougborogh University, and Automotive Engineering. The feedback was very positive about the course, and the UNI and it also seems to be liked by Employers.
Now, LJMU also has an Automotive Engineering Course; The grades are lower than LB and Brunel etc (Theyre BBC, JMU is something like 240 UCAS points) and I only found out recently that I couldve actually got in this year with the grades I got (CCD).. But I'm taking a year out to bring my grades up.
I'm at a dilema, I love the sound of LB; The facilities, the place itself etc but I haven't got a chance to see it yet. 'BUT' all of my good friends are at John Moores this year, and from spending the last few days in the city.. It's a real nice place.
I haven't got a chance to see the actual Uni as I'm going home soon though.
Basically what I'm wondering is; is a degree a 'degree'? Or is it likely that when coming to getting a job, someone from LB could be favoured over a LJMU graduate?
I'm not 100% how long JMU have been doing the Automotive Engineering degree, but they don't seem to do the full Formula Student Project.. I think they may only go as far as designing parts for a racecar and not actually building/racing one. It's something that I'd like to be a part of.
I'm not sure if there are any JMU Engineering Grads here who could maybe shed some light on how it went after the degree. Or even anyone who would have an idea about it?
At the minute, it feels like I'm gonna have to either choose the Degree w/ Better job prospects, or 3 or 4 years with my friends. That mightn't be the case at all, but I'm just wondering.
I'll be submitting an application to both universities anyways through UCAS.
Some of you may remember a thread I started about Lougborogh University, and Automotive Engineering. The feedback was very positive about the course, and the UNI and it also seems to be liked by Employers.
Now, LJMU also has an Automotive Engineering Course; The grades are lower than LB and Brunel etc (Theyre BBC, JMU is something like 240 UCAS points) and I only found out recently that I couldve actually got in this year with the grades I got (CCD).. But I'm taking a year out to bring my grades up.
I'm at a dilema, I love the sound of LB; The facilities, the place itself etc but I haven't got a chance to see it yet. 'BUT' all of my good friends are at John Moores this year, and from spending the last few days in the city.. It's a real nice place.
I haven't got a chance to see the actual Uni as I'm going home soon though.
Basically what I'm wondering is; is a degree a 'degree'? Or is it likely that when coming to getting a job, someone from LB could be favoured over a LJMU graduate?
I'm not 100% how long JMU have been doing the Automotive Engineering degree, but they don't seem to do the full Formula Student Project.. I think they may only go as far as designing parts for a racecar and not actually building/racing one. It's something that I'd like to be a part of.
I'm not sure if there are any JMU Engineering Grads here who could maybe shed some light on how it went after the degree. Or even anyone who would have an idea about it?
At the minute, it feels like I'm gonna have to either choose the Degree w/ Better job prospects, or 3 or 4 years with my friends. That mightn't be the case at all, but I'm just wondering.
I'll be submitting an application to both universities anyways through UCAS.
- Long post is long.. And I'm on my iPhone too, so excuse any confusing or bad grammar..
sday12 said:
PapaHett said:
It's a real nice place.
You'll have more fun in LPL that LB, socially that is.We stayed at the Adelphi hotel here in Liverpool, right smack bang in the middle of the city.. And there's a block of modern student accomadation right next door where a load of my mates are staying! It's quality!
I studied Maritime Studies at JMU 10+ years ago, great city, great night life etc... do companies see JMU as a serious uni... i don't know, it's not that well known. On the plus side the professors were very, very good, facilities top class, tutorials very supportive. I don't know anything at all about LB though so can't compare.
Is this the degree where you mess around with race cars, and everyone thinks they're going to work at Ferrari ? This is the one they did at Preston anyhoo, a friend of mine started it and the first year was Maths, maths, lots of Physics and maths, did I mention maths ? He didn't research what it all entailed and bombed out after a few months after not being able to keep up.
Salsera said:
I studied Maritime Studies at JMU 10+ years ago, great city, great night life etc... do companies see JMU as a serious uni... i don't know,
Most still remember it as Liverpool Poly 
Cant comment on the course, but as others have said, Liverpool has lots of modern halls and judging by the number of students at night, plenty of socialising. no doubt somebody will post something silly about being robbed.....................Ignore them
sneijder said:
Is this the degree where you mess around with race cars, and everyone thinks they're going to work at Ferrari ? This is the one they did at Preston anyhoo, a friend of mine started it and the first year was Maths, maths, lots of Physics and maths, did I mention maths ? He didn't research what it all entailed and bombed out after a few months after not being able to keep up.
I'm fully aware of what the Engineering degree is like, I've been to a few Maths lectures.. And it's pretty heavy stuff! I like maths though. I'm going to be doing Mechanical regardless, but I'm thinking about doing Automotive instead.Also, thought I should just add that my Brothers a 2nd year student at JMU (Pharmacy), not that the status of the degree will matter too much to him; My mums a pharmacist and owns a chemist, so he'll more than likely be taking that over.
I was looking at The University of Liverpool too, they have a Mechanical Engineering Degree (BEng; BBB), it's not automotive.. But it might be worth thinking about. They're ranked almost identical to Queens Belfast; which is the one local Uni I'd consider going to (Northern Ireland).
A few points to consider:
Oh and in Liverpool they all make a strange quacking sound which I'm told passes for language.
- Don't go where you mates are. Go somewhere different and make some new ones - your experience will be far richer for it.
- L'boro is a superb uni and has an excellent reputation within industry. JMU - old polly isn't it? L'boro is part of the Russle group which counts for a lot these days.
- There is an excellent social life at L'boro so that lads that used to work for me told me - it's a sporting uni so there are lots of very fit boys and girls.
- If you participate in a sport, you can test yourself against some of the best sportsmen and women.
- L'boro town is a s
thole though.
Oh and in Liverpool they all make a strange quacking sound which I'm told passes for language.
Edited by rhinochopig on Tuesday 24th November 12:04
PapaHett said:
sneijder said:
Is this the degree where you mess around with race cars, and everyone thinks they're going to work at Ferrari ? This is the one they did at Preston anyhoo, a friend of mine started it and the first year was Maths, maths, lots of Physics and maths, did I mention maths ? He didn't research what it all entailed and bombed out after a few months after not being able to keep up.
I'm fully aware of what the Engineering degree is like, I've been to a few Maths lectures.. And it's pretty heavy stuff! I like maths though. I'm going to be doing Mechanical regardless, but I'm thinking about doing Automotive instead.Also, thought I should just add that my Brothers a 2nd year student at JMU (Pharmacy), not that the status of the degree will matter too much to him; My mums a pharmacist and owns a chemist, so he'll more than likely be taking that over.
I was looking at The University of Liverpool too, they have a Mechanical Engineering Degree (BEng; BBB), it's not automotive.. But it might be worth thinking about. They're ranked almost identical to Queens Belfast; which is the one local Uni I'd consider going to (Northern Ireland).
Take the University of Liverpool, Mech Eng, course. Liverpool Uni has a good rep and the course has a good rep. Future employers will care more that you did the Mech Eng course there than you did an Automotive Eng course at JML. Whatsmore the wider Mech Eng. course will let you look in the aero world aswell as just the auto world and frankly you will learn more that way.
Right now you know precisely jack s
t about engineering and once you have completed your degree...whichever one it is...you will still know jack st about engineering, neither one of them will get you your first (or probably) second job. The second one will open more doors for you though and thats all you need to care about at that stage of your career.PapaHett said:
Hey guys,
I'm not 100% how long JMU have been doing the Automotive Engineering degree, but they don't seem to do the full Formula Student Project.. I think they may only go as far as designing parts for a racecar and not actually building/racing one. It's something that I'd like to be a part of.
My advice is don't base your choices on formula student, there are other equally exciting projects to do. also it probably isn't what you think it is, whilst yes you completely build the car from scratch it isn't then raced wheel to wheel, it is competed in auto test type events http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SH3H5bsvI0gI'm not 100% how long JMU have been doing the Automotive Engineering degree, but they don't seem to do the full Formula Student Project.. I think they may only go as far as designing parts for a racecar and not actually building/racing one. It's something that I'd like to be a part of.
DJC said:
PapaHett said:
sneijder said:
Is this the degree where you mess around with race cars, and everyone thinks they're going to work at Ferrari ? This is the one they did at Preston anyhoo, a friend of mine started it and the first year was Maths, maths, lots of Physics and maths, did I mention maths ? He didn't research what it all entailed and bombed out after a few months after not being able to keep up.
I'm fully aware of what the Engineering degree is like, I've been to a few Maths lectures.. And it's pretty heavy stuff! I like maths though. I'm going to be doing Mechanical regardless, but I'm thinking about doing Automotive instead.Also, thought I should just add that my Brothers a 2nd year student at JMU (Pharmacy), not that the status of the degree will matter too much to him; My mums a pharmacist and owns a chemist, so he'll more than likely be taking that over.
I was looking at The University of Liverpool too, they have a Mechanical Engineering Degree (BEng; BBB), it's not automotive.. But it might be worth thinking about. They're ranked almost identical to Queens Belfast; which is the one local Uni I'd consider going to (Northern Ireland).
From what my friend mentioned, there was nothing to do with things with four wheels until the final year. Sorry if my post sounded a bit negative BTW, it wasn't meant to be.
Take advise about where to study from here but have a word with the universities about the courses. Don't be listening to me prattling on about what my mate said four years ago !
Take advise about where to study from here but have a word with the universities about the courses. Don't be listening to me prattling on about what my mate said four years ago !
I'm afraid that employers of graduate Engineers tend to make judgements about the quality of your degree based on your institution. These are not decisions made without a basis in truth.
If you look at the University league tables you'll see Loughborough are higher ranked than LJM, and require higher grades. The relative postion of institutions in this league table is also probably reflected in the thinking of employers, i.e. most employers would rather employee someone with a degree from Cambridge than LJM, all other things being equal, and with a spectrum of perceived 'quality' in between.
Some employers (I won't name names) simply won't consider applications from outside what they consider to be the group of top universities.
Go for the best university you can get into, based on league tables.
I'd also echo the comment about Mechanical vs automotive engineering. Since Auto is essentially a subset of Mechanical, all you are doing by choosing it is restricting your choice of employer upon graduation. I have deep suspicions about any dgree calling itself Automotive Engineering, and I suspect some employers will too. If you can, go round a good automotive employer and ask people working there what degree they did - you'll probably find most are Mechanicals.
I can confirm that you'll find most engineering degrees do contain lots and lots of Maths and Physics in their first year or two (I teach it). For good reason - if you cannot describe something Mathematically then you're not doing Engineering, you're tinkering. Maths and Sciences are essential to proper Engineering.
If a course does not involve lots of Maths and Science at its start, I'd avoid it because no employer will take it seriously.
The good news is most Univeristies are used to Engineering students disliking Maths so lay on extra support.
If you look at the University league tables you'll see Loughborough are higher ranked than LJM, and require higher grades. The relative postion of institutions in this league table is also probably reflected in the thinking of employers, i.e. most employers would rather employee someone with a degree from Cambridge than LJM, all other things being equal, and with a spectrum of perceived 'quality' in between.
Some employers (I won't name names) simply won't consider applications from outside what they consider to be the group of top universities.
Go for the best university you can get into, based on league tables.
I'd also echo the comment about Mechanical vs automotive engineering. Since Auto is essentially a subset of Mechanical, all you are doing by choosing it is restricting your choice of employer upon graduation. I have deep suspicions about any dgree calling itself Automotive Engineering, and I suspect some employers will too. If you can, go round a good automotive employer and ask people working there what degree they did - you'll probably find most are Mechanicals.
I can confirm that you'll find most engineering degrees do contain lots and lots of Maths and Physics in their first year or two (I teach it). For good reason - if you cannot describe something Mathematically then you're not doing Engineering, you're tinkering. Maths and Sciences are essential to proper Engineering.
If a course does not involve lots of Maths and Science at its start, I'd avoid it because no employer will take it seriously.
The good news is most Univeristies are used to Engineering students disliking Maths so lay on extra support.
Hey, I'm probably biased as a Lufbra grad so not sure how objective I can be on the debate but should be able to confirm a few things about the course for you.
At lboro Auto is taught along side Aero for the first couple of years for basics like Structures, fluid dynamics, maths etc with specialist car related modules. The third and 4th years are much more Auto focused but still with some cross over. The course is accredited by the IMechE so covers every thing that's needed for Mech. Eng. but with vehicle or plane related case studies (most of the time)
There is also 'MIRA week' to consider. The department hires large parts of MIRA for the students to uses for some course work. I did 3 reports on drive-by noise testing, vehicle braking and some performance testing. There's also a non assesed wind tunnel activity in the Full size tunnel there (the one on this weeks TG) that's good fun. How many other unis offer this kind of activity?
If you've got any questions just ask.
At lboro Auto is taught along side Aero for the first couple of years for basics like Structures, fluid dynamics, maths etc with specialist car related modules. The third and 4th years are much more Auto focused but still with some cross over. The course is accredited by the IMechE so covers every thing that's needed for Mech. Eng. but with vehicle or plane related case studies (most of the time)
There is also 'MIRA week' to consider. The department hires large parts of MIRA for the students to uses for some course work. I did 3 reports on drive-by noise testing, vehicle braking and some performance testing. There's also a non assesed wind tunnel activity in the Full size tunnel there (the one on this weeks TG) that's good fun. How many other unis offer this kind of activity?
If you've got any questions just ask.
Edited by Established 1984 on Tuesday 24th November 12:15
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