Veneering question
Discussion
Normally with a zinc coating it will need some sort of an etch primer , so the glue will adhere to it.
At our works we used to use an adhesive made by 'bostik'. We used brown primer to coat the metal first, let it dry , then use the adhesive.
It held even when emersed in thousands of gallons of water!
At our works we used to use an adhesive made by 'bostik'. We used brown primer to coat the metal first, let it dry , then use the adhesive.
It held even when emersed in thousands of gallons of water!
I've always wondered why a metal dash in the first place, especially considering it was veneered and the heat/contract issue between wood and metal.
I'm considering replacing mine with a wooden backing plate, which has been discussed recently(ish) on here.
Can anyone speculate why the steel back was used?
I'm considering replacing mine with a wooden backing plate, which has been discussed recently(ish) on here.
Can anyone speculate why the steel back was used?
My veneer and backplate parted company three years ago. When I removed the dash I stripped off the veneer with a kitchen knife, almost in one go. I had a retired veneerer living near me and he was aghast to find the dash had not even been keyed. He thought it was a wonder the two items had stayed in the same county.
Following his advice I 'practiced' on a free bit of veneer he had - burr oak, lovely wood - on a dash blank I made out of 4mm birch ply. With the glue, formaldehyde two-pack, and veneer the eventual thickness was 5mm. This first attempt was meant to be temporary but in fact I so liked the wood that it stayed for about 18 months. When I replaced it with the original dash reveneered I tried to split the original one I'd done but it was impossible. The glue proved considerably stronger than the wood. Not a problem one has with veneer on steel.
The problem with all steel dash with wood veneer is the different coefficient of expansion. Also, with the sun on a dash one bit can warm up considerably faster than another. All this puts strain on the glue. All you need is one weak point and that's it.
The instruments actually help the veneer. My neighbour reckoned that without them the veneer would have parted company with the dash considerably earlier.
That said, the original dash looked ok to the casual glance after ten years. The lower dash on my Chim had been restuck in various places a number of times with different adhesives, including superglue.
The curve of the dash made the whole thing very strong when fitted. I was thinking along the lines of additional supports but these were not required.
I would suggest that if you are going for a steel blank then it would be a good idea to get one of the professional reveneerers to do it as they have special clamps to hold it when it is setting.
There's a bit on this on the Griff and Chim Resource: www.rv8r.co.uk. It doesn't add much more to what I said above but does have some pictures. When you see the clamp I had to fabricate you will realise what I meant.
It is lovely working with the veneer, getting the finish right slowly. It takes time but when you do the final rubdown with 2400 wet and dry before polishing it to the finish shine it is a real kick. Not so much so the second time you do the final rubdown of course. Every little blemish shows, and the better you have done elsewhere, the more the slightest error shows. Character building. I discovered you can't throw a quarter sheet of wet and dry very far even if you are in a real temper.
I've since replaced the steel dash but have promised myself that I will do it again, this time on wood.
I've heard of one chap French polishing a dash.
Following his advice I 'practiced' on a free bit of veneer he had - burr oak, lovely wood - on a dash blank I made out of 4mm birch ply. With the glue, formaldehyde two-pack, and veneer the eventual thickness was 5mm. This first attempt was meant to be temporary but in fact I so liked the wood that it stayed for about 18 months. When I replaced it with the original dash reveneered I tried to split the original one I'd done but it was impossible. The glue proved considerably stronger than the wood. Not a problem one has with veneer on steel.
The problem with all steel dash with wood veneer is the different coefficient of expansion. Also, with the sun on a dash one bit can warm up considerably faster than another. All this puts strain on the glue. All you need is one weak point and that's it.
The instruments actually help the veneer. My neighbour reckoned that without them the veneer would have parted company with the dash considerably earlier.
That said, the original dash looked ok to the casual glance after ten years. The lower dash on my Chim had been restuck in various places a number of times with different adhesives, including superglue.
The curve of the dash made the whole thing very strong when fitted. I was thinking along the lines of additional supports but these were not required.
I would suggest that if you are going for a steel blank then it would be a good idea to get one of the professional reveneerers to do it as they have special clamps to hold it when it is setting.
There's a bit on this on the Griff and Chim Resource: www.rv8r.co.uk. It doesn't add much more to what I said above but does have some pictures. When you see the clamp I had to fabricate you will realise what I meant.
It is lovely working with the veneer, getting the finish right slowly. It takes time but when you do the final rubdown with 2400 wet and dry before polishing it to the finish shine it is a real kick. Not so much so the second time you do the final rubdown of course. Every little blemish shows, and the better you have done elsewhere, the more the slightest error shows. Character building. I discovered you can't throw a quarter sheet of wet and dry very far even if you are in a real temper.
I've since replaced the steel dash but have promised myself that I will do it again, this time on wood.
I've heard of one chap French polishing a dash.
I'm not planning to do the veneer myself but wanted to make sure the pro's had something to work with. I've some changes to the dial holding method so hope it doesn't interfere with their clamps.
I thought about wood and might give it a try sometime as fixing blocks etc on the back are a whole lot easier to fix on. I wonder if damp would be an issue as the backing would probably need to be ply?
I thought about wood and might give it a try sometime as fixing blocks etc on the back are a whole lot easier to fix on. I wonder if damp would be an issue as the backing would probably need to be ply?
sunwharf said:
I'm not planning to do the veneer myself but wanted to make sure the pro's had something to work with. I've some changes to the dial holding method so hope it doesn't interfere with their clamps.
I thought about wood and might give it a try sometime as fixing blocks etc on the back are a whole lot easier to fix on. I wonder if damp would be an issue as the backing would probably need to be ply?
There were one or two little difficulties with wood. The ply was too thick to go into the slots at the bottom of the dash. The heater controls were a little bit of a pain to fit, but in general it was do-able. I did it so it can't be all that complicated.I thought about wood and might give it a try sometime as fixing blocks etc on the back are a whole lot easier to fix on. I wonder if damp would be an issue as the backing would probably need to be ply?
The pros do an excellent job. I saw reveneering being completed by a chap in watford - advertises in Sprint - and I was impressed. I feel certain that he would give you an honest estimate of how long a dash should last. They aren't cheap but you should expect to pay for quality.
One advantage of a wooden dash is that you can modify the dash, with lights or extra dials, and still be able to replace the original if you want to resell.
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