Owning a STI vs. WRX. Costs etc.

[Merlot]

Posted a similar thread in GG last week, but I think perhaps this is the best sub-forum to post in.

Since moving house in the summer, I now do about 95% of my mileage on back-road country B-roads. Quite twisty, some large inclines, hairpin bends and other wonderfulness. My total mileage is about 6-7k miles per year.

Although completely out of character for me, I really fancy a Subaru Impreza as I think it would be very much the right tool for the job, and would be great fun on the commute into work. I am also looking for a car which will double as an interest/hobby (as sad as that might sound).

I much prefer Q-cars, and would normally look at something like the Audi S4 BiTurbo, so naturally my favourite Impreza is the bug eyed 5-door wagon, 2001/2002. These seem to come up for sale in my preferred colours (Green, black & dark blue) at around £5k, with 80k miles on the clock. Seems good value to me. Howver, I have noticed that similar aged/mileaged STI models are not much more, and I keep hearing that the STI is a much better over all car - not just quicker with more power, but a better and more reliable engine etc. However, I also realise that they are more expensive to run.

I'm trying to build up a picture of the overall costs of running one of these cars per year.

Insurance for me (I'm 25) is £730 for the WRX Wagon, or £760 for the STI (Both fully comp, max protected no claims etc).

Fuel - I'm expecting the WRX to do about 23mpg over all. Is this realistic? What would the STI be like in comparison? Does the STI need to be run on 98/99 RON?

Servicing - I've spoken to a few local specialists, and as my mileage is <7.5k, they reccomend a yearly service which would usually cost about £225-£250 excluding any work that is needed. The bigger services are about £350ish and the cambelt service is £500. Is this about right? Again, would the STI be much more?

I'm not sure if I could live with the massive wing and extrovert nature of the STI, but it needs to be considered.

[SmoothRB]

Notoriously weak gearboxes.

Just saying.

My buddies at the local performance garage get 'em in all the time to take the 'boxes out. It's a running joke for them.

The EVO engine and box is WAY tougher.

Edited by SmoothRB on Thursday 24th December 18:37

[Merlot]

SmoothRB said:

Notoriously weak gearboxes.

Just saying.

My buddies at the local performance garages get 'em in all the time to take the 'boxes out.

The EVO engine and box is WAY tougher.

Is that both the WRX and STI boxes?

I don't like the Evo's looks at all, the Scoob is just about bearable!

[SmoothRB]

Merlot said:

SmoothRB said:

Notoriously weak gearboxes.

Just saying.

My buddies at the local performance garages get 'em in all the time to take the 'boxes out.

The EVO engine and box is WAY tougher.

Is that both the WRX and STI boxes?

I don't like the Evo's looks at all, the Scoob is just about bearable!

Same car fundamentally.

If you are not going to be doing 5 grand launches or 7 grand clutch kicks into 2nd you may be ok but then a buddy of mine had a box go and he wasn't a hooligan. lol

There was an Evo being tuned at my local garage the other day w/ 376 HP at the wheels. Obviously that is with a few mods but the engine was unopened.

[Animal]

Merlot said:

I keep hearing that the STI is a much better over all car - not just quicker with more power, but a better and more reliable engine etc. However, I also realise that they are more expensive to run.

I'm trying to build up a picture of the overall costs of running one of these cars per year.

Insurance for me (I'm 25) is £730 for the WRX Wagon, or £760 for the STI (Both fully comp, max protected no claims etc).

Fuel - I'm expecting the WRX to do about 23mpg over all. Is this realistic? What would the STI be like in comparison? Does the STI need to be run on 98/99 RON?

Servicing - I've spoken to a few local specialists, and as my mileage is <7.5k, they reccomend a yearly service which would usually cost about £225-£250 excluding any work that is needed. The bigger services are about £350ish and the cambelt service is £500. Is this about right? Again, would the STI be much more?

I'm not sure if I could live with the massive wing and extrovert nature of the STI, but it needs to be considered.

STi is different, not necessarily better or worse. Much faster than a standard WRX, much faster than most things when modded but stiffer suspension and more conspicuous.

Fuel: My WRX averages 23 mpg, which is 230-270 miles on a tank depending on how empty I let it get. I always use Shell V-Power (99 RON). STi will be thirstier - 20-21 mpg?

Servicing: Cost should be the same, parts aside.

If you're set on an STi you could just tone it down by changing the spoiler and wheels... Either flog the originals to recoup some of the cost or keep them to return the car to standard when you sell?

Whichever one you buy, suggest you get one that's already got a PPP fitted, because Impreza owners always want to go faster...

[SmoothRB]

SmoothRB said:

Merlot said:

SmoothRB said:

Notoriously weak gearboxes.

Just saying.

My buddies at the local performance garages get 'em in all the time to take the 'boxes out.

The EVO engine and box is WAY tougher.

Is that both the WRX and STI boxes?

I don't like the Evo's looks at all, the Scoob is just about bearable!

Same car fundamentally.

If you are not going to be doing 5 grand launches or 7 grand clutch kicks into 2nd you may be ok but then a buddy of mine had a box go and he wasn't a hooligan. lol

There was an Evo being tuned at my local garage the other day w/ 376 HP at the wheels (that's ATW not ghey crank HP). Obviously that is with a few mods but the engine was unopened.

[Syndrome]

SmoothRB said:

Notoriously weak gearboxes.

Just saying.

My buddies at the local performance garage get 'em in all the time to take the 'boxes out. It's a running joke for them.

The EVO engine and box is WAY tougher.

Edited by SmoothRB on Thursday 24th December 18:37

Absolute bullst. The 6 speed box in the STI is bulletproof. If you don't go above about 350 BHP and dont do too much launching and tracking, the boxes are fine. I think the OP has got the costs about right. The STI will give you about 25 MPG tops, and although you can run a UK STI on standard unleaded it's best not to if you can avoid it. The servicing costs the OP quoted are about right as well, just remeber to shop around for the best price and get quotes from indys and main agents.

Edited by Syndrome on Friday 25th December 13:25

[SmoothRB]

Syndrome said:

Absolute bullst. The 6 speed box in the STI is bulletproof. If you don't go above about 350 BHP and dont do too much launching and tracking, the boxes are fine. I think the OP has got the costs about right. The STI will give you about 25 MPG tops, and although you can run a UK STI on standard unleaded it's best not to if you can avoid it. The servicing costs the OP quoted are about right as well, just remeber to shop around for the best price and get quotes from indys and main agents.

Edited by Syndrome on Friday 25th December 13:25

Ok it may be stronger but bulletproof? Why no launches then?

Oh yeah hope the STi you get wasn't effected by the spun con-rod bearing issue, or the turbo prone to cracking and spraying (flammable) oil all over the Engine bay.

lol

[Merlot]

Syndrome said:

SmoothRB said:

Notoriously weak gearboxes.

Just saying.

My buddies at the local performance garage get 'em in all the time to take the 'boxes out. It's a running joke for them.

The EVO engine and box is WAY tougher.

Edited by SmoothRB on Thursday 24th December 18:37

Absolute bullst. The 6 speed box in the STI is bulletproof. If you don't go above about 350 BHP and dont do too much launching and tracking, the boxes are fine. I think the OP has got the costs about right. The STI will give you about 25 MPG tops, and although you can run a UK STI on standard unleaded it's best not to if you can avoid it. The servicing costs the OP quoted are about right as well, just remeber to shop around for the best price and get quotes from indys and main agents.

Edited by Syndrome on Friday 25th December 13:25

Thanks, I'm a very mechanically sympathetic driver so unless there is an underlying issue with a component, I wouldn't expect to break it through normal usage. I wouldn't intend doing any full bore starts.

[Syndrome]

SmoothRB said:

Ok it may be stronger but bulletproof? Why no launches then?

Oh yeah hope the STi you get wasn't effected by the spun con-rod bearing issue, or the turbo prone to cracking and spraying (flammable) oil all over the Engine bay.

lol

Eh ?? I've certainly not heard of any UK STI with major con rod bearing issues or turbo cracking issues. If there have been isolated failures I haven't heard of those either. I know the bottom ends can give up on JDM cars which are mapped for 100 RON fuel, but the UK cars don't usualy suffer unless you over tune them (then you kind of get what you expect) or don't get them serviced properly.

Full bore launches are okay as long as you don't do it all the time, and are aware that you are potentialy unleashing 300+ BHP into a stationary drivetrain, which not many unmodified road cars will appreciate.

[Johnyanorak]

Seems like a subaru / evo debate seems to be firing up

Subarus seem to be all noise no go i have owned and drove a good few

Just TRY an evo on ur country lanes and see which you prefer

yes in my history ive had my subaru WRX STI gearbox go more than 3 times and the conrod bearings etc etc etc

my evo just liked 2 eat cluthes , fast road clutch on 340bhp would slip after 2 dumps..
it was more worth it tho.

[Syndrome]

Johnyanorak said:

Seems like a subaru / evo debate seems to be firing up

Subarus seem to be all noise no go i have owned and drove a good few

Just TRY an evo on ur country lanes and see which you prefer

yes in my history ive had my subaru WRX STI gearbox go more than 3 times and the conrod bearings etc etc etc

my evo just liked 2 eat cluthes , fast road clutch on 340bhp would slip after 2 dumps..
it was more worth it tho.

I've tried Evos, They're not that much quicker and the interiors are hideous. Evo feels like a competition car which has been detuned, Scoobys feel like road cars which have been tuned up. I'd take the scoob every day over the Evo. I know a few people who drive Evos as well and (without wanting to tar all evo drivers with the same brush) the ones I know are particularly conceited, and seem to have some sort of deficiency. One thing I do actualy like about driving scoobs is the fact that a lot of other scoob drivers will give you a friendly wave when you pass them. If i had to choose one over the other for track use, I'd go for the Evo, but I'd trailer it to the track with a tarp over it in case someone saw it.

[Hol]

Most EVO boys you will talk to only know a helluva lot of dissinformation about Scoobies, (based on what some other numpty has told them) - as shown above.

Mind you, most Subaru owners will also think that EVO's need a FULL service every 4500 miles* and that they have chocolate brake disks and clutches.

If you talk to any of us who have feet in both camps and actually assess cars on driving them (and not based on aversion to something that used to wipe their a**e when they drove a chavved Saxo, or whatever they thought was cool/fast at the time).

The cost of running an STI or a WRX these days is roughly the same as parts such as brakes and filters are roughly the same now. But, the WRX would give another couple MPG in standard form as its only 218bhp and obviously more BHP is more petrol.

But, the cost of running an EVO would be about the same.





(*4500 miles is only the Diff adjustment on the GSR).

I have been a member of the MLR longer than I have any scooby forums, but I have owned more Scoobies in those 10 years, because I prefered the particular ones I bought after driving them.
I also tried Supras and a GTR, but didn't get on with them.

If you roughly do smooth roads and low miles and want a bit of help in the cornering department, get an Evo. If you want something easier on the teeth, just as fast, but needing a bit more driver input, choose the STI.

The one thing you should do, is drive both.

[nottyash]

My 2001 bugeye WRX did 27mpg on motorways, and I used only normal 95ron fuel, as it said on the fuel cap.
Its only if you remap that you need higher octane stuff, it made no difference whatsoever(I tried both quite frequently).
If you buy a Jap import you will need the higher octane stuff as they use higher octane fuel in Japan.

Servicing was not bad, I used a reliable indy garage, Things like aftermarket brakes/ mintex pads were cheap on ebay as the standard ones are crap.
I think they roll too much too, but Ive heard you can change the anti roll bars for about £300.
Ive not driven a UK STI Impreza, so cant help with fuel costs/ Brakes/ handling of them.

[P-1]

I've got a 2005 WRX PPP and I love it to bits. I chose it over the STI because I prefer more subtle motors but it's down to the individual I guess. Always run it on 97 RON minimum and you'll get better economy that way too. As someone said earlier, try and get a PPP (with certificate to prove its genuine).

[omgus]

Not wanting to get into a EVO/Scoob debate, both cars have strong points, but the OP did say one thing that tips it heavily into having a Scoob. I know because it is what tipped me into having a scoob over an EVO.

Merlot said:

I much prefer Q-cars, and would normally look at something like the Audi S4 BiTurbo, so naturally my favourite Impreza is the bug eyed 5-door wagon, 2001/2002.

To all EVO owners out there, i love your cars, i think the way they can hit daft power figures so easily is hugely entertaining, BUT, until i can buy an EVO Wagon i will have my Impreza.

OP I would suggest an STI, if the money isn't much different and you can bear the higher running costs. Also most will have been modded, so it is worth making a list of mods you want, and a list of mods you don't want then work from that.

For the record if you are planning to drive it hard, one of the mods you really want is a big brake kit.

[SmoothRB]

omgus said:

Not wanting to get into a EVO/Scoob debate, both cars have strong points, but the OP did say one thing that tips it heavily into having a Scoob. I know because it is what tipped me into having a scoob over an EVO.

Merlot said:

I much prefer Q-cars, and would normally look at something like the Audi S4 BiTurbo, so naturally my favourite Impreza is the bug eyed 5-door wagon, 2001/2002.

To all EVO owners out there, i love your cars, i think the way they can hit daft power figures so easily is hugely entertaining, BUT, until i can buy an EVO Wagon i will have my Impreza.

OP I would suggest an STI, if the money isn't much different and you can bear the higher running costs. Also most will have been modded, so it is worth making a list of mods you want, and a list of mods you don't want then work from that.

For the record if you are planning to drive it hard, one of the mods you really want is a big brake kit.

So you don't want get into the debate of Evo vs Scoob, then you devote several paragraps to said debate lol?

The only good thing about the Scoob is it is a bit cheaper, all the performance mech I know (and I mean proper mechs not 18 y/o YTS types who may have once put a cannon 'zaust on a Saxo) tell me the Evo is way stronger mechanically...a better can in every departement.

Yep ok I guess asthetics are subjective, but you could de-spoiler your evo and go with a mild body kit.

Edited by SmoothRB on Sunday 27th December 11:37

[omgus]

SmoothRB said:

omgus said:

Stuff

So you don't want get into the debate of Evo vs Scoob, then you devote several paragraps to said debate lol?

The only good thing about the Scoob is it is a bit cheaper, all the performance mech I know (and I mean proper mechs not 18 y/o YTS types who may have once put a cannon 'zaust on a Saxo) tell me the Evo is way stronger mechanically...a better can in every departement.

Yep ok I guess asthetics are subjective, but you could de-spoiler your evo and go with a mild body kit.

Edited by SmoothRB on Sunday 27th December 11:37

1 paragraph to the debate, the paragraph about the bodyshape, strangely after that i tried to stay on topic which i know isn't a very PH thing to do.

I was trying to give to OP advice in answer to his question, as it sounds like he has followed similar vein of thought to myself when i chose to get my Wagon.

:Sarcastic:Smooth i get that you want to show how much better EVO's are, i can under stand that the fact that some people want a little more refinement and refuse to drive everywhere at ten tenths annoys you, but then some of us just want a car that we want and that can do nearly what an EVO does, but with a little less compromise and a much better soundtrack and often that is a scooby.:sarcasticoff:


OP i would advise you drive an EVO as well, they are stunning machines and if i hadn't of needed mine to be a daily driver it would have been a much closer decision.

[SmoothRB]

omgus said:

1 paragraph to the debate, the paragraph about the bodyshape, strangely after that i tried to stay on topic which i know isn't a very PH thing to do.

I was trying to give to OP advice in answer to his question, as it sounds like he has followed similar vein of thought to myself when i chose to get my Wagon.

:Sarcastic:Smooth i get that you want to show how much better EVO's are, i can under stand that the fact that some people want a little more refinement and refuse to drive everywhere at ten tenths annoys you, but then some of us just want a car that we want and that can do nearly what an EVO does, but with a little less compromise and a much better soundtrack and often that is a scooby.:sarcasticoff:


OP i would advise you drive an EVO as well, they are stunning machines and if i hadn't of needed mine to be a daily driver it would have been a much closer decision.

Yeah true Scoobies sound ok for a 4 banger, still I wouldn't ever buy a car just because of the sound of the 'zaust.

[trophies]

omgus said:

Not wanting to get into a EVO/Scoob debate, both cars have strong points, but the OP did say one thing that tips it heavily into having a Scoob. I know because it is what tipped me into having a scoob over an EVO.

Merlot said:

I much prefer Q-cars, and would normally look at something like the Audi S4 BiTurbo, so naturally my favourite Impreza is the bug eyed 5-door wagon, 2001/2002.

To all EVO owners out there, i love your cars, i think the way they can hit daft power figures so easily is hugely entertaining, BUT, until i can buy an EVO Wagon i will have my Impreza.

OP I would suggest an STI, if the money isn't much different and you can bear the higher running costs. Also most will have been modded, so it is worth making a list of mods you want, and a list of mods you don't want then work from that.

For the record if you are planning to drive it hard, one of the mods you really want is a big brake kit.

You can buy an evo wagon....The time is now!