Jumping out of gear
Discussion
My 4.2 cerbera is starting to do this quite a bit now, first couple of times put it down to maybe not having engaged gear lever properly, but now its definitely a problem, seems to happen in 5th mainly when pressing on at substantial speeds which can be quite disconcerting!
I have heard 5th gear is a bit of an achilles heel on these cars, wonder if it might just be down to gear box oil level?
Any ideas welcome.
I have heard 5th gear is a bit of an achilles heel on these cars, wonder if it might just be down to gear box oil level?
Any ideas welcome.
Oh dear and bad luck mate. This I understand is not an uncommon issue. I don't know what age or mileage you car is but mine did the same thing at around 32K. Although mine let go all at once. I understand that the circlip on the shaft which holds 5th gear can push off.
I removed the box myself and found someone to fix it. It's a standard T5 box and you will probably need a 5th gear set. Thats a 33 tooth on the mainshaft and a matching lay gear which is a 53 tooth.
Can't remember the pice of the parts but think it was £60 to £80. I seem to remember I got the whole job done for about £500.
When you have the box fixed there are I understand 2 fixes. Sometimes they machine the Circlip groove and fit 2 Circlips and I've also heard Super gluing the Circlip in place is enough. I went for the first but to be honest I don't really know if they did it. Choose carfully who does the work.
Good Luck
Mike
I removed the box myself and found someone to fix it. It's a standard T5 box and you will probably need a 5th gear set. Thats a 33 tooth on the mainshaft and a matching lay gear which is a 53 tooth.
Can't remember the pice of the parts but think it was £60 to £80. I seem to remember I got the whole job done for about £500.
When you have the box fixed there are I understand 2 fixes. Sometimes they machine the Circlip groove and fit 2 Circlips and I've also heard Super gluing the Circlip in place is enough. I went for the first but to be honest I don't really know if they did it. Choose carfully who does the work.
Good Luck
Mike
M3John said:
Glad you brought this up as sometimes mine doesn't actually `jump` out of gear but more so slides out of 5th every now and then very discreetly. Completely fine in all the others. Is this the same problem do you think?
Well, I guess you could describe it as sliding out of 5th gear, almost as the gear was not engaged properly on the shift up, you suddenly feel the revs drop as it pops out, so to speak.Mike Hawthorn said:
Oh dear and bad luck mate. This I understand is not an uncommon issue. I don't know what age or mileage you car is but mine did the same thing at around 32K. Although mine let go all at once. I understand that the circlip on the shaft which holds 5th gear can push off.
I removed the box myself and found someone to fix it. It's a standard T5 box and you will probably need a 5th gear set. Thats a 33 tooth on the mainshaft and a matching lay gear which is a 53 tooth.
Can't remember the pice of the parts but think it was £60 to £80. I seem to remember I got the whole job done for about £500.
When you have the box fixed there are I understand 2 fixes. Sometimes they machine the Circlip groove and fit 2 Circlips and I've also heard Super gluing the Circlip in place is enough. I went for the first but to be honest I don't really know if they did it. Choose carfully who does the work.
Good Luck
Mike
Mike, thanks for the info, when you say yours "let go all at once" do you mean you lost 5th gear completely so as it could not be engaged at all, or do you mean the whole box failed?I removed the box myself and found someone to fix it. It's a standard T5 box and you will probably need a 5th gear set. Thats a 33 tooth on the mainshaft and a matching lay gear which is a 53 tooth.
Can't remember the pice of the parts but think it was £60 to £80. I seem to remember I got the whole job done for about £500.
When you have the box fixed there are I understand 2 fixes. Sometimes they machine the Circlip groove and fit 2 Circlips and I've also heard Super gluing the Circlip in place is enough. I went for the first but to be honest I don't really know if they did it. Choose carfully who does the work.
Good Luck
Mike
5th is weak on the T5. It's twice as thin as the other four cogs. When mine went I had the Quaif gearset
from the Gearbox man fitted. Their gearset is much better, fith is full size with the maincase enlarged so it all
fits in, and runs on needle bearings. There are a load of other little tweaks done at the same time. The bad news is your going to spend 1500 pounds
for the upgrade.
from the Gearbox man fitted. Their gearset is much better, fith is full size with the maincase enlarged so it all
fits in, and runs on needle bearings. There are a load of other little tweaks done at the same time. The bad news is your going to spend 1500 pounds
for the upgrade.
Nickccc said:
5th is weak on the T5. It's twice as thin as the other four cogs. When mine went I had the Quaif gearset
from the Gearbox man fitted. Their gearset is much better, fith is full size with the maincase enlarged so it all
fits in, and runs on needle bearings. There are a load of other little tweaks done at the same time. The bad news is your going to spend 1500 pounds
for the upgrade.
Hi Nick, did your box behave with similar symptoms before you had it rebuilt? if so how long did it last until you ended up with no fith gear? from the Gearbox man fitted. Their gearset is much better, fith is full size with the maincase enlarged so it all
fits in, and runs on needle bearings. There are a load of other little tweaks done at the same time. The bad news is your going to spend 1500 pounds
for the upgrade.
Did the 1500 quid include removing the box from the car and refitting or was that just for the actual box rebuild itself?
If I understand correctly the T5 is the same box used in the Sierra Cosworth, did they suffer with the same fith gear problems? I would have thought some of the tuned Cossies must have been easily exceeding AJP levels of torque.
Edited by Erich Stahler on Thursday 31st December 18:16
No you'll have to take the box to them.
http://www.gearboxman.co.uk/
Mine didn't slip out, I was racing Graham at the first Fighting Torque, banged it into top under full load
and it shattered the cog.
I'm not to sure about the Cossie, think it's more the torque and the known weakness that kills them.
http://www.gearboxman.co.uk/
Mine didn't slip out, I was racing Graham at the first Fighting Torque, banged it into top under full load
and it shattered the cog.
I'm not to sure about the Cossie, think it's more the torque and the known weakness that kills them.
Nickccc said:
No you'll have to take the box to them.
http://www.gearboxman.co.uk/
Mine didn't slip out, I was racing Graham at the first Fighting Torque, banged it into top under full load
and it shattered the cog.
I'm not to sure about the Cossie, think it's more the torque and the known weakness that kills them.
Sorry about all the questions, I take it you went for one of the T5 Gearkits, they list two for TVRs, a close and wide ratio kit, which one did you go for? http://www.gearboxman.co.uk/
Mine didn't slip out, I was racing Graham at the first Fighting Torque, banged it into top under full load
and it shattered the cog.
I'm not to sure about the Cossie, think it's more the torque and the known weakness that kills them.
I see they are offering them at almost 900 quid, so about 600 quid includes labour and machining the housing to take the larger gears presumably?
I'm particularly interested in hearing is how your car drives now with the up rated box, apart from its robustness does it feel any different on a track or during a spirited road drive?
Thanks
Pete
I went for the close ratio version.
You will loose a bit of top end speed, though it'll still get you to 167 mph, which is quite enough realy.
Where you gain however is during accelleration, through the gears you will be shifting a bit more often,
though I feel the ratios are far better suited to the engine. When you plant your foot down the connection
between pedal engine and rear wheels is seamless.
I also had the semi helical gears, a little bit more noise, though nothing to intrusive.
I think the best thing is for you to have a go in mine, I have to go down to Austec soon
to check in about the Tasmin racer, so if you check your diary we can meet up and you can have a go, it realy needs to be dry though or you won't be able to get a feel for just how quick it will pick up speed.
It's not just machining the case and fitting that GBM does, there are oil mods case strenghtening and shot peening.
Give them a bell for the full spec.
You will loose a bit of top end speed, though it'll still get you to 167 mph, which is quite enough realy.
Where you gain however is during accelleration, through the gears you will be shifting a bit more often,
though I feel the ratios are far better suited to the engine. When you plant your foot down the connection
between pedal engine and rear wheels is seamless.
I also had the semi helical gears, a little bit more noise, though nothing to intrusive.
I think the best thing is for you to have a go in mine, I have to go down to Austec soon
to check in about the Tasmin racer, so if you check your diary we can meet up and you can have a go, it realy needs to be dry though or you won't be able to get a feel for just how quick it will pick up speed.
It's not just machining the case and fitting that GBM does, there are oil mods case strenghtening and shot peening.
Give them a bell for the full spec.
Edited by Nickccc on Friday 1st January 18:48
Nickccc said:
I went for the close ratio version.
You will loose a bit of top end speed, though it'll still get you to 167 mph, which is quite enough realy.
Where you gain however is during accelleration, through the gears you will be shifting a bit more often,
though I feel the ratios are far better suited to the engine. When you plant your foot down the connection
between pedal engine and rear wheels is seamless.
I also had the semi helical gears, a little bit more noise, though nothing to intrusive.
I think the best thing is for you to have a go in mine, I have to go down to Austec soon
to check in about the Tasmin racer, so if you check your diary we can meet up and you can have a go, it realy needs to be dry though or you won't be able to get a feel for just how quick it will pick up speed.
It's not just machining the case and fitting that GBM does, there are oil mods case strenghtening and shot peening.
Give them a bell for the full spec.
Nick, thanks for all the info, need to do a bit more investigation but the idea of a quality upgrade rather than just a like for like repair is tempting. You will loose a bit of top end speed, though it'll still get you to 167 mph, which is quite enough realy.
Where you gain however is during accelleration, through the gears you will be shifting a bit more often,
though I feel the ratios are far better suited to the engine. When you plant your foot down the connection
between pedal engine and rear wheels is seamless.
I also had the semi helical gears, a little bit more noise, though nothing to intrusive.
I think the best thing is for you to have a go in mine, I have to go down to Austec soon
to check in about the Tasmin racer, so if you check your diary we can meet up and you can have a go, it realy needs to be dry though or you won't be able to get a feel for just how quick it will pick up speed.
It's not just machining the case and fitting that GBM does, there are oil mods case strenghtening and shot peening.
Give them a bell for the full spec.
Edited by Nickccc on Friday 1st January 18:48
I would be interested to see how yours drives with the upgrade. As for when I am off work all next week and free and day except for the 7th, alternatively any Saturday morning I suppose, anyway let me know when would be good for you.
Pete.
Erich
Sorry I've taken a while to return not had a lot of time the last couple of days.
When mine went it was rather odd. The car had been fine all day and we stopped at friends for a couple of hours. When I left all was fine but the 6 or 7 miles to the duel carrageway is all country lanes so I never got into top. (I'm sure you know how it is) When i did get into 5th I could hear what can only be described as a "Clanging" sound from the transmission tunnel. While slowing to pull over it went away and only returned when I engaged 5th. I drove the 60 miles home in 4th. When I got home I tried pulling away in 5th to see how it would deal with that sort of pressure and abuse. It jumped out as I expected.
At which point I pulled the box out.
I don't remember any problems with the box up until this time although I must admit I might have "lite the rear up" when leaving our friends. I don't know if this could have contributed to the failure but it may ring a bell with you.
Good luck
Mike
Sorry I've taken a while to return not had a lot of time the last couple of days.
When mine went it was rather odd. The car had been fine all day and we stopped at friends for a couple of hours. When I left all was fine but the 6 or 7 miles to the duel carrageway is all country lanes so I never got into top. (I'm sure you know how it is) When i did get into 5th I could hear what can only be described as a "Clanging" sound from the transmission tunnel. While slowing to pull over it went away and only returned when I engaged 5th. I drove the 60 miles home in 4th. When I got home I tried pulling away in 5th to see how it would deal with that sort of pressure and abuse. It jumped out as I expected.
At which point I pulled the box out.
I don't remember any problems with the box up until this time although I must admit I might have "lite the rear up" when leaving our friends. I don't know if this could have contributed to the failure but it may ring a bell with you.
Good luck
Mike
Mike Hawthorn said:
Erich
Sorry I've taken a while to return not had a lot of time the last couple of days.
When mine went it was rather odd. The car had been fine all day and we stopped at friends for a couple of hours. When I left all was fine but the 6 or 7 miles to the duel carrageway is all country lanes so I never got into top. (I'm sure you know how it is) When i did get into 5th I could hear what can only be described as a "Clanging" sound from the transmission tunnel. While slowing to pull over it went away and only returned when I engaged 5th. I drove the 60 miles home in 4th. When I got home I tried pulling away in 5th to see how it would deal with that sort of pressure and abuse. It jumped out as I expected.
At which point I pulled the box out.
I don't remember any problems with the box up until this time although I must admit I might have "lite the rear up" when leaving our friends. I don't know if this could have contributed to the failure but it may ring a bell with you.
Good luck
Mike
I don't get any clanging sounds from the transmission tunnel but it does sound very similar to what's happening with mine. Sorry I've taken a while to return not had a lot of time the last couple of days.
When mine went it was rather odd. The car had been fine all day and we stopped at friends for a couple of hours. When I left all was fine but the 6 or 7 miles to the duel carrageway is all country lanes so I never got into top. (I'm sure you know how it is) When i did get into 5th I could hear what can only be described as a "Clanging" sound from the transmission tunnel. While slowing to pull over it went away and only returned when I engaged 5th. I drove the 60 miles home in 4th. When I got home I tried pulling away in 5th to see how it would deal with that sort of pressure and abuse. It jumped out as I expected.
At which point I pulled the box out.
I don't remember any problems with the box up until this time although I must admit I might have "lite the rear up" when leaving our friends. I don't know if this could have contributed to the failure but it may ring a bell with you.
Good luck
Mike
Had problems with mine a couple of times. In both cases I found something (a pen and a packet of gum) had come out of the cubby hole under the dash and ended up in the gear lever "well" hidden up under the tunnel cover. This was causing selection and jumping out problems.
Cheap fix though!!!
Cheap fix though!!!
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