Motorsport Careers
Discussion
Having been an avid PHer for a fair while, this is actually my first forum post on the PH forum, so apologies if this topic has arisen before.
I am a student currently studying mathematics at Imperial College London looking to do a masters at Oxford to specialise in Fluid Dynamics. I have been verging on obsessed with motorsport all my life, my father has always raced for as long as I can remember at an amateur level in the Castle Combe Saloons in a G40 and now in a Mk1 Leon, I used to do karting from a young age, cannot remember the last F1 race I missed, can recall every race from the golden era of BTCC, the 90's, (and have attended a few F1 and BTCC races) I read racecar engineering magazine every month, do trackdays in my father's M3 CSL at such cricuits as Spa, the Ring, Oulton, Combe and more and having passed my ARDS a few years ago, I know managed to save enough money to buy my own Fiesta which I now race in the Combe Saloons, which I enjoy so much, its beyond belief.
I must say sorry for banging on and on a bit, but I just wanted to outline my enthusiasm when it comes to motorsport and hopefully you can imagine my determination to get a career in motorsport, whether it is the top end like NASCAR, BTCC or F1 (thats the dream!) or something much lower level. I would love to go into the world of aerodynamics or strategy, effectively using what I've learnt in my degree and implementing within the world of motorsport. I also have some experience in data logging using Motec and implementing data analysis which could prove useful in the future!!
However, I truly am finding it extremely difficult to find any doorways into careers in motorsport. There are very few, if any, student placement/internships type programmes on offer, most likely due to the current economic situation! Effectively, I am slightly using this forum post as a bit of a plea, to all fellow PHers who may have any contacts who may be interested in an enthusiastic lad (who although has made himself out as a bit of an anorak in this post, but actually has the social skills to have a conversation!) who has great aspirations in the world of motorsport, and is happy to work at the bottom of the heap, making tea and working for free, willing to travel great distances purely to gain some experience from people who have managed to make a living out of the industry.
Reeeeeeeeeally sorry for having banged on for so long, I hope that if just one PH brother notices this post and takes 30 seconds to respond, then it may have been worth it!
Chab
PS. I reckon my Fiesta racecar could rinse the mapped 335d at the lights!
I am a student currently studying mathematics at Imperial College London looking to do a masters at Oxford to specialise in Fluid Dynamics. I have been verging on obsessed with motorsport all my life, my father has always raced for as long as I can remember at an amateur level in the Castle Combe Saloons in a G40 and now in a Mk1 Leon, I used to do karting from a young age, cannot remember the last F1 race I missed, can recall every race from the golden era of BTCC, the 90's, (and have attended a few F1 and BTCC races) I read racecar engineering magazine every month, do trackdays in my father's M3 CSL at such cricuits as Spa, the Ring, Oulton, Combe and more and having passed my ARDS a few years ago, I know managed to save enough money to buy my own Fiesta which I now race in the Combe Saloons, which I enjoy so much, its beyond belief.
I must say sorry for banging on and on a bit, but I just wanted to outline my enthusiasm when it comes to motorsport and hopefully you can imagine my determination to get a career in motorsport, whether it is the top end like NASCAR, BTCC or F1 (thats the dream!) or something much lower level. I would love to go into the world of aerodynamics or strategy, effectively using what I've learnt in my degree and implementing within the world of motorsport. I also have some experience in data logging using Motec and implementing data analysis which could prove useful in the future!!
However, I truly am finding it extremely difficult to find any doorways into careers in motorsport. There are very few, if any, student placement/internships type programmes on offer, most likely due to the current economic situation! Effectively, I am slightly using this forum post as a bit of a plea, to all fellow PHers who may have any contacts who may be interested in an enthusiastic lad (who although has made himself out as a bit of an anorak in this post, but actually has the social skills to have a conversation!) who has great aspirations in the world of motorsport, and is happy to work at the bottom of the heap, making tea and working for free, willing to travel great distances purely to gain some experience from people who have managed to make a living out of the industry.
Reeeeeeeeeally sorry for having banged on for so long, I hope that if just one PH brother notices this post and takes 30 seconds to respond, then it may have been worth it!
Chab
PS. I reckon my Fiesta racecar could rinse the mapped 335d at the lights!
Edited by Chab on Sunday 10th January 12:24
Drop me a PM and I may be able to help. Although my motorsport background is in sponsorship / marketing I have some contacts within aero / design / chassis design who may be of interest.
You will NOT get any response from the F1 people but well worth trying another avenue and getting experience which is what will open doors over the next 5-6 years.
You will NOT get any response from the F1 people but well worth trying another avenue and getting experience which is what will open doors over the next 5-6 years.
My suggestion is to find a team that runs cars of your liking and to start working for them. Getting your hands dirty is a reliable way to gain experience. I've seen Britcar @ Spa-Francorchamps last year and that looked like nice series with a lot of different cars to gain some experience.
Also, no matter what, visit the expo in Birmingham next week. Sell your neighbours dog if you have to, it's VERY important to know what's going on in the scene. Plus, there are a lot of people racing in different series and cars there you can have a chat with.
But the most important thing is this. You haven't specified which direction you want your career to go. If you have not figured that out I suggest you do that first. There are a lot of dreamers around professional motorsport and anyone making a living on racing isn't really fond of that. So getting a clear direction and some experience to match will certainly help your case.
Also, no matter what, visit the expo in Birmingham next week. Sell your neighbours dog if you have to, it's VERY important to know what's going on in the scene. Plus, there are a lot of people racing in different series and cars there you can have a chat with.
But the most important thing is this. You haven't specified which direction you want your career to go. If you have not figured that out I suggest you do that first. There are a lot of dreamers around professional motorsport and anyone making a living on racing isn't really fond of that. So getting a clear direction and some experience to match will certainly help your case.
Tomaz
Thank you ever so much for the advice, I've seen quite a bit of Britcar around circuits in the UK, and I would love to work for one of the competing teams, getting my hands dirty, because as you say, it would be fantastic experience, however this is really what i am finding difficult! The opportunity to work for one of these race teams, even voluntarily (which I would be more than happy to do), is extremely hard to come by.
I am definitely going to the Autosport show next week, always go ever year, love it, and you're right, I am just going to have to try anything to sell myself to the race teams there.
In terms of a career direction, maybe I didn't make it quite clear above, but aerodynamics is my main area of interest as it would be a great opportunity to implement what I study at uni into the motorsport industry. Effectively, I would love to become the next Adrian Newey, however I would not want to be blinkered on F1 too much, which is evidently the most competitive echelon of motorsport to get into. I would love to be involved in Formula BMW, F2, FPA, to name but a few; I realise I'm not focusing on one specific career direction, I just want to keep my options open within motorsport and to stay flexible to any experience that may become available.
Thank you ever so much for the advice, I've seen quite a bit of Britcar around circuits in the UK, and I would love to work for one of the competing teams, getting my hands dirty, because as you say, it would be fantastic experience, however this is really what i am finding difficult! The opportunity to work for one of these race teams, even voluntarily (which I would be more than happy to do), is extremely hard to come by.
I am definitely going to the Autosport show next week, always go ever year, love it, and you're right, I am just going to have to try anything to sell myself to the race teams there.
In terms of a career direction, maybe I didn't make it quite clear above, but aerodynamics is my main area of interest as it would be a great opportunity to implement what I study at uni into the motorsport industry. Effectively, I would love to become the next Adrian Newey, however I would not want to be blinkered on F1 too much, which is evidently the most competitive echelon of motorsport to get into. I would love to be involved in Formula BMW, F2, FPA, to name but a few; I realise I'm not focusing on one specific career direction, I just want to keep my options open within motorsport and to stay flexible to any experience that may become available.
the problem you have if you wish to be in aero is that most race teams running cars in say fpa or bmw have very strict rules and do no development work in terms of the aero package, although you could potentially work for a manufacturer such as lola designing cars. Its all about a choice in either being a mechanic or not really. If you dont want to be you need to look at work experience with manufacturers. If you want to be a mechanic you need to go and get your hands dirty.
nto really sure why I didnt mention this earlier, but my main passion as far as aero is concerned is the LMP LMS racecars, I even did a brief dissertation at the end of last year of parts of their aerodynamics for uni, specifically ground effect using flat bottoms, tunnels etc. Again it is a dream, but I would love to be involved in the development and testing of these cars
have you considered looking at the companies who make things like the aero tunnels and the test equipment in the short term rather than the obvious approach to teams etc? i dont doubt its competitive out there in terms of engineering jobs at these sort of places but you could attack the problem from another angle, get in the facility, then talk to teams from there. personally i would find that more fun as you never know what might come into the wind tunnel from week to week/
Chab said:
nto really sure why I didnt mention this earlier, but my main passion as far as aero is concerned is the LMP LMS racecars, I even did a brief dissertation at the end of last year of parts of their aerodynamics for uni, specifically ground effect using flat bottoms, tunnels etc. Again it is a dream, but I would love to be involved in the development and testing of these cars
You like making things difficult for yourself don't you!!There is only a handful of people that do aero for LMP cars, compared to hundreds working in F1 aero departments. Getting into F1 aero is relatively simple due to the size of the departments meaning there is often opportunity for Junior roles where you can build up more experience. LMP outfits will generally use an experienced aerodynamicist with a proven record (if they are funded...)
Start from the bottom and work your way up.
If you go in with a large team you will be making the Tea's and watching. Grass roots club motorsport you will be a valued member of the team if your any good. Do a free season with travel and expenses paid for then you can ask for a weekend salary the following season.
I started with Caterhams, Formula Ford, then moved onto running super touring cars and sportscars just at weekends and when i could throughout my A levels and degree.
Best way to start and you will understand what a 10mm spanner is, how race weekends work, and have practical knowledge of what to do and not to do which a lot of graduates dont have.
If you go in with a large team you will be making the Tea's and watching. Grass roots club motorsport you will be a valued member of the team if your any good. Do a free season with travel and expenses paid for then you can ask for a weekend salary the following season.
I started with Caterhams, Formula Ford, then moved onto running super touring cars and sportscars just at weekends and when i could throughout my A levels and degree.
Best way to start and you will understand what a 10mm spanner is, how race weekends work, and have practical knowledge of what to do and not to do which a lot of graduates dont have.
Chab said:
nto really sure why I didnt mention this earlier, but my main passion as far as aero is concerned is the LMP LMS racecars, I even did a brief dissertation at the end of last year of parts of their aerodynamics for uni, specifically ground effect using flat bottoms, tunnels etc. Again it is a dream, but I would love to be involved in the development and testing of these cars
Telephone Nick Wirth at Wirth Technology as his company designed the Acura LMP that did quite well in the ALMS in the US. He is an approacheable enough guy, if you can get through reception I am sure he would spend a few minutes offering you advice.As his company is relatively small he might even offer you work experience. It would be much more fun than F1 as I believe his company do all manner of motorsport pojects so if you are lucky you could get a lot of variety.
In F1 you can end up looking at a very small part of the car, very often for a very long time and only hope to make negligeable areo gains on the area you work on.
If you don't ask you don't get, so don't be shy. Try and talk to as many people as you can. With a bit research all the names are there on the web.
Edited by marine boy on Thursday 7th January 23:41
Well being a racer myself on an amateur level, I would love to have a role which involves being at the track all the time, but in the same respect, I would gladly put the time in at the factory if I was needed, in order to earn the privilege to be at the track!
Oh and it's quite ironic, spoke to my father briefly yesterday and he also advised me to get in contact with Nick Wirth at Wirth Technologies, as you also think this may be a good idea, I am definitely on the case now, fingers crossed he may be interested in having me around!
Oh and it's quite ironic, spoke to my father briefly yesterday and he also advised me to get in contact with Nick Wirth at Wirth Technologies, as you also think this may be a good idea, I am definitely on the case now, fingers crossed he may be interested in having me around!
Edited by Chab on Friday 8th January 11:26
marine boy said:
Chab said:
nto really sure why I didnt mention this earlier, but my main passion as far as aero is concerned is the LMP LMS racecars, I even did a brief dissertation at the end of last year of parts of their aerodynamics for uni, specifically ground effect using flat bottoms, tunnels etc. Again it is a dream, but I would love to be involved in the development and testing of these cars
Telephone Nick Wirth at Wirth Technology as his company designed the Acura LMP that did quite well in the ALMS in the US. He is an approacheable enough guy, if you can get through reception I am sure he would spend a few minutes offering you advice.As his company is relatively small he might even offer you work experience. It would be much more fun than F1 as I believe his company do all manner of motorsport pojects so if you are lucky you could get a lot of variety.
In F1 you can end up looking at a very small part of the car, very often for a very long time and only hope to make negligeable areo gains on the area you work on.
If you don't ask you don't get, so don't be shy. Try and talk to as many people as you can. With a bit research all the names are there on the web.
Edited by marine boy on Thursday 7th January 23:41
As others have said, start low and work upwards. There are plenty of smaller teams who need people to chip in and its all good experience.
By getting involved, you also then meet people and open doors to other opportunities.
There is always an element of 'right place, right time' as I know from experience but you've got the right idea when it comes to ASI in going along to speak to people.
When something comes up, you just need to grab it with both hands.
By getting involved, you also then meet people and open doors to other opportunities.
There is always an element of 'right place, right time' as I know from experience but you've got the right idea when it comes to ASI in going along to speak to people.
When something comes up, you just need to grab it with both hands.
Is true - the only knowledge I had of motorsport up to a couple of years ago was watching it on TV and spectating at races but got the opportunity to help out on a friend of a friends race team - I absolutely love it! I've done 2 seasons in Britcar now & a few races in LMA Eurosaloons - highlight for me so far has been re-fuelling for a team at the Britcar 24hr race where we won our class.
I've chatted to a couple well known people at race meets, Adrian Newey, Jonathan Palmer for example. Adrian Newey races in Britcar & his team has been in the garage next to us a few times - the opportunities are out there so as people have said, offer free help & it'll get you started. I love my weekends, cant wait for the season to start again & would love to do it as my full time job but dont know how to go about it really, just have to keep trying and see what avenues open up - never know who I'll meet at the next race
I've chatted to a couple well known people at race meets, Adrian Newey, Jonathan Palmer for example. Adrian Newey races in Britcar & his team has been in the garage next to us a few times - the opportunities are out there so as people have said, offer free help & it'll get you started. I love my weekends, cant wait for the season to start again & would love to do it as my full time job but dont know how to go about it really, just have to keep trying and see what avenues open up - never know who I'll meet at the next race
marine boy said:
Chab said:
nto really sure why I didnt mention this earlier, but my main passion as far as aero is concerned is the LMP LMS racecars, I even did a brief dissertation at the end of last year of parts of their aerodynamics for uni, specifically ground effect using flat bottoms, tunnels etc. Again it is a dream, but I would love to be involved in the development and testing of these cars
Telephone Nick Wirth at Wirth Technology as his company designed the Acura LMP that did quite well in the ALMS in the US. He is an approacheable enough guy, if you can get through reception I am sure he would spend a few minutes offering you advice.As his company is relatively small he might even offer you work experience. It would be much more fun than F1 as I believe his company do all manner of motorsport pojects so if you are lucky you could get a lot of variety.
In F1 you can end up looking at a very small part of the car, very often for a very long time and only hope to make negligeable areo gains on the area you work on.
If you don't ask you don't get, so don't be shy. Try and talk to as many people as you can. With a bit research all the names are there on the web.
Edited by marine boy on Thursday 7th January 23:41
You wouldnt believe it, a friend of a friend of a.... of a friend of a friend has just started getting heavily involved with Nick Wirth at Virgin/Manor and there may be a possibility of me getting some kind of work/experience with them! Just shows, to get to these places, luck and who you know are always factors!
Oh and I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from getting in contact with me offering experience or advice! Everything helps!
Thank you to everyone who has replied to this forum post, really has all been helpful advice! See you at the Autosport Show if youre going!
Oh and I'm not trying to dissuade anyone from getting in contact with me offering experience or advice! Everything helps!
Thank you to everyone who has replied to this forum post, really has all been helpful advice! See you at the Autosport Show if youre going!
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