Is it worth it?

[dr_gn]

So I've got a 1996 Marin Mount Vision frame - had it from new, and built it up. It's now on it's second or third iteration of components, none of which are by any means state of the art (Pace RC-36 EVO III forks, Hope C2 Brakes, SRAM X-9 Shifters & rear mech, TR-1 shock, Carbon Bars and Post, X-lite stem etc etc). It does the job. Here it is in all its retro glory on my first ride of the year last weekend:



99% of my biking is in XC in the Peak District. I bought the Marin becasue all I wanted was something a bit more comfy than a hardtail, and with a single pivot for the minimum possible maintenence. My question is: if I bought an average, mid range 2010 XC bike, would I notice a big difference in performance? (and I mean in real terms, after a few weeks' riding in gritstone mud when everything is no longer 'new'). For example, would it allow me to ride further through less fatigue? Presumably not unless it was *significantly* lighter? Mines about 13kg, about 29 lbs.

A friend of mine has just spazzed several thousand pounds on Heckler, (which I believe is a heavier bike than mine). The latest Hope brakes on it don't seem anything like as good as my old ones, and are way more complicated. There's more travel, but...I hardly ever use all the travel on mine. I dunno..I read reviews in magazines and wonder if they just rave about these new bikes because

a) The companies advertise in their mags, and
b) They have to write something.

I have a pet hate of Hecklers because they get such worryingly good reviews, but seem such cripplingly bad value for money. The guys at work who are way more into mountain biking than me (racing/building their own frames etc) call Santa Cruz bikes "Boutique Frames".

Something tells me it's time to upgrade, but I have a nagging doubt that if I got a new bike, by the time the novelty had worn off, I'd be several thousand pounds poorer for no real benefit.

Any thoughts? Anyone recently upgraded? I don't trust the bike mags for an unbiased opinion.

Cheers,

Dr_GN

[Nick_F]

Not unless the frame is bent, broken or incompatible with more up-to-date BB, brakes and forks/shock.

[Gooby]

The fastest guy I know rides a '96 Pace hard tail with about 15mm useable travel in the forks. He hits a rock garden at full speed and comes out smiling. I see him hit the rock garden and slam on the hope brakes and slowly let plush 140mm suspension iron out the bumps and meet him he other side thinking he is crazy but really happy I did it.

There is only one way to answer this, try a few bikes that take your fancy, if you feel better about your ride then buy it.

There have not been many revolutions in bike design in recent years. It have been a gradual impovement so you may well notice a change in the quality of the ride.

Edited by Gooby on Wednesday 20th January 10:10

[L100NYY]

I have to admit to having the same thoughts running through my head too.

I currently have a mid 90's GT STS carbon and I love it to bits, I'm thinking that maybe upgrading/refreshing is the way to go as I can't really fault the bike itself. The only thing that is swaying me to a new steed is to get a lightweight hardtail to go alongside the GT.

Decisions, decisions.......

[zapbrannigan]

L100NYY said:

I have to admit to having the same thoughts running through my head too.

I currently have a mid 90's GT STS carbon and I love it to bits, I'm thinking that maybe upgrading/refreshing is the way to go as I can't really fault the bike itself. The only thing that is swaying me to a new steed is to get a lightweight hardtail to go alongside the GT.

Decisions, decisions.......

'tis also my current dilemma: I am slowly convicing myself that you can never have too many bikes...

[L100NYY]

zapbrannigan said:

L100NYY said:

I have to admit to having the same thoughts running through my head too.

I currently have a mid 90's GT STS carbon and I love it to bits, I'm thinking that maybe upgrading/refreshing is the way to go as I can't really fault the bike itself. The only thing that is swaying me to a new steed is to get a lightweight hardtail to go alongside the GT.

Decisions, decisions.......

'tis also my current dilemma: I am slowly convicing myself that you can never have too many bikes...

I don't have the time to ride one let alone two

[dr_gn]

Nick_F said:

Not unless the frame is bent, broken or incompatible with more up-to-date BB, brakes and forks/shock.

That's what I wanted to hear! (Sort of).

I got a Superstar Components ceramic bearing external BB last year, which has been great. The Pace forks are a good match for the rear end, and, like the Hope brakes, are easy to maintain and are virtually indestrucatable (another thing I like).

I guess with a new frame, all my old components would be junk, and I'd end up with stuff that would probably last not very long. It all gets a bit expensive.

[Zippee]

No TBH. I ride a 1999 Stumpie FSR XC and apart from shocks I find hardly any difference to new bikes. Geometrys are pretty much the same and I'd be hard pressed to tell the difference on most components. When I raced in the early 90s I'd regularly beat people on bikes that cost 3 or 4 times that of mine.

[dr_gn]

Zippee said:

No TBH. I ride a 1999 Stumpie FSR XC and apart from shocks I find hardly any difference to new bikes. Geometrys are pretty much the same and I'd be hard pressed to tell the difference on most components. When I raced in the early 90s I'd regularly beat people on bikes that cost 3 or 4 times that of mine.

Similarly, I find that my original Hope C2's are equal or superior to the latest multi-piston versions. At least until very recently, there was no adjustment for lever position, and you sometimes had to almost pull the lever to the bars to stop. Surely, if you can lock the wheels with one finger (as with mine) then the braking power is limited by the tyre grip. So why massively over-complicate a good system? There also seems a trend towards thin discs and tiny pads - which wear out very quickly in anything but bone dry conditions.

Like you say, it seems the same with suspension geonetry.

I reckon it's all just a big marketing con to be honest.

[JimexPL]

Had similar thoughts also. I've only been using a bike to ride around London over the last few years (a fairly subtle Rockhopper in grey with avid v brakes), but put some mtb tyres back on it over the winter to go for a few rides and I've caught the bug again.
Dusted off my old steed - a 2001 Marin Rock springs with first gen hope minis and took it for a ride. I'd forgotten how good it was!
Rather than changing the bike, I'll probably look at replacing the fork, as that's the only thing that perhaps lets it down when compared with a current £1200-£1800 equivalent.

Perhaps you should clean the pace forks up, hang them on a wall and treat yourself to a new set. Manitou R7s would be my choice.

[dr_gn]

JimexPL said:

Perhaps you should clean the pace forks up, hang them on a wall and treat yourself to a new set. Manitou R7s would be my choice.

If they were significantly better (which would really mean *lighter* since the EVOIII's still work absolutely fine), and were a good match for my rear shock then I'd definitely consider them.

My olde original Pace RC-35 elastomer forks are still going strong on my missus's mountain bike (maybe becasue she never rides it). Even after a combined 15 years worth of Peak District mud, neither pair of Pace forks show any significant signs of wear. Greaseports are the way forward! Granted, I've been through a few stanchion seals...but I just wonder if in 2025 I'd still have the Manitou R7's??

Edited by dr_gn on Wednesday 20th January 19:14

[schuey]

I have a '98 Marin Rift Zone,(model below the Mount Vision at the time),like the o.p it has been through many new bits,although it is still on its original back wheel!I have just ordered some new wheels from superstar today though! Its still going strong,and is light as a feather at about 28 lbs-I used to race DH on it too!!!! Just on the lookout for a new frame as I am far too poor to buy a new bike,however this one has been so good it seems a shame to get rid so I know how you feel! I reckon If I had a new shock and forks it would be perfect but then I may as well get the new bike if I am going to spend that much. Mine has disc mounts etc so apart from the looks it hasn't aged as such,although some cheeky tw@t pointed out that it should be in a museum whilst I was out in the snow at Dalby a few weeks back!
[pic][/pic]

[dr_gn]

schuey said:

I have a '98 Marin Rift Zone,(model below the Mount Vision at the time),like the o.p it has been through many new bits,although it is still on its original back wheel!I have just ordered some new wheels from superstar today though! Its still going strong,and is light as a feather at about 28 lbs-I used to race DH on it too!!!! Just on the lookout for a new frame as I am far too poor to buy a new bike,however this one has been so good it seems a shame to get rid so I know how you feel! I reckon If I had a new shock and forks it would be perfect but then I may as well get the new bike if I am going to spend that much. Mine has disc mounts etc so apart from the looks it hasn't aged as such,although some cheeky tw@t pointed out that it should be in a museum whilst I was out in the snow at Dalby a few weeks back!
[pic][/pic]

I was looking on EBay for a new frame, and year or two year old Marin full sus frames go quite cheaply. Would then be a case of just swapping parts for me (assuming a later frame would be 'better' - whatever that means!

My pal had a '98 Rift Zone (then, recently got the Heckler I was on about). Has yours had a new swingarm? Looks like the one from the B-17 doesn't it? I thought the '98 Rift Zone had a box section polished swingarm?

You might find this site interesting/depressing:

http://www.retrobike.co.uk/

Cheers,

[schuey]

Well spotted,it does have a new swing arm! I found a big crack in the large diameter round bit of tube that joins both sides of the swingarm together,and Marin replaced it for free. I had just bought those forks that are on it at the time so I asked them what the chances were of getting the orange swingarm from the Team FRS DH bike of the day to match! They kindly said yes for no extra charge. Just changed the forks but the newer ones have ruined the handling as they have too much travel so bugger up the geometery,a longer travel/more modern frame would be the answer to that though,the frame was only really capable of taking a 100mm fork.
I had noticed the prices of more recent Marin frames on ebay,I am watching a few now. If I went back in time I would buy one again,it's been a great bike,they only thing I would change is the size,Marin frames seem to be huge compared to everything else.

My boss has a Mount Vison almost identical to yours,carbon Pace forks the lot. Its mint just hanging on his garage wall!