So, it looks like the Iraq war was illegal....
Discussion
M-J-B said:
Does that mean that we could now take Tony and a few fellow mates to a court of law in a civil action as they have clearly broken international law?
Have to prosecute breaches of international law in international courtsM-J-B said:
And what was the point of the enquiry if there is not action to be taken regardless of the consequences.... 
Jobs for the boys, whitewash, all the usual stuff reallytimlongs said:
M-J-B said:
Does that mean that we could now take Tony and a few fellow mates to a court of law in a civil action as they have clearly broken international law?
And what was the point of the enquiry if there is not action to be taken regardless of the consequences....
Source?And what was the point of the enquiry if there is not action to be taken regardless of the consequences....
Jack Straw appears to have said 'f
k it, let's go in' because he wasn't convinced the law was clear.I thought he was a responsible government minister?
Muntu said:
It has not been declared illegal by any court. Any "illegality" is only opinion at present.
Hope that clears things up
Opinion? - quote:Hope that clears things up
"Jack Straw rejected advice in the run up to war that invading Iraq without UN backing would break international law, the Iraq inquiry heard.
Mr Straw's chief legal adviser at the time, Sir Michael Wood, told the then foreign secretary it would "amount to the crime of aggression".
I would suggest it's a done deal and regardless of the final published result, and as I suggested originally, it was illegal.
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 21:53
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
It has not been declared illegal by any court. Any "illegality" is only opinion at present.
Hope that clears things up
Opinion? - quote:Hope that clears things up
"Jack Straw rejected advice in the run up to war that invading Iraq without UN backing would break international law, the Iraq inquiry heard.
Mr Straw's chief legal adviser at the time, Sir Michael Wood, told the then foreign secretary it would "amount to the crime of aggression".
I would suggest it's a done deal and regardless of the final published result, and as I suggested originally, it was illegal.
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 21:53
Muntu said:
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
It has not been declared illegal by any court. Any "illegality" is only opinion at present.
Hope that clears things up
Opinion? - quote:Hope that clears things up
"Jack Straw rejected advice in the run up to war that invading Iraq without UN backing would break international law, the Iraq inquiry heard.
Mr Straw's chief legal adviser at the time, Sir Michael Wood, told the then foreign secretary it would "amount to the crime of aggression".
I would suggest it's a done deal and regardless of the final published result, and as I suggested originally, it was illegal.
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 21:53
Edited to add he was told the facts as they were, not offered an 'opinion'.
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 22:00
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
It has not been declared illegal by any court. Any "illegality" is only opinion at present.
Hope that clears things up
Opinion? - quote:Hope that clears things up
"Jack Straw rejected advice in the run up to war that invading Iraq without UN backing would break international law, the Iraq inquiry heard.
Mr Straw's chief legal adviser at the time, Sir Michael Wood, told the then foreign secretary it would "amount to the crime of aggression".
I would suggest it's a done deal and regardless of the final published result, and as I suggested originally, it was illegal.
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 21:53
Muntu said:
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
It has not been declared illegal by any court. Any "illegality" is only opinion at present.
Hope that clears things up
Opinion? - quote:Hope that clears things up
"Jack Straw rejected advice in the run up to war that invading Iraq without UN backing would break international law, the Iraq inquiry heard.
Mr Straw's chief legal adviser at the time, Sir Michael Wood, told the then foreign secretary it would "amount to the crime of aggression".
I would suggest it's a done deal and regardless of the final published result, and as I suggested originally, it was illegal.
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 21:53
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 22:06
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
M-J-B said:
Muntu said:
It has not been declared illegal by any court. Any "illegality" is only opinion at present.
Hope that clears things up
Opinion? - quote:Hope that clears things up
"Jack Straw rejected advice in the run up to war that invading Iraq without UN backing would break international law, the Iraq inquiry heard.
Mr Straw's chief legal adviser at the time, Sir Michael Wood, told the then foreign secretary it would "amount to the crime of aggression".
I would suggest it's a done deal and regardless of the final published result, and as I suggested originally, it was illegal.
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 21:53
Edited by M-J-B on Tuesday 26th January 22:06
M-J-B said:
Jack Straw appears to have said 'fk it, let's go in' because he wasn't convinced the law was clear.
I thought he was a responsible government minister?
Isn't that a definition of oxymoron?k it, let's go in' because he wasn't convinced the law was clear.I thought he was a responsible government minister?
Oh, and isn't that one of the same responsible ministers on the team that prevented proper supplies being readied in sufficient time so as 'word' of their predetermined course of action wouldn't get out?
Rather than keep quoting each other -
Jack Straw's advisor's both believed the invasion was illegal based on international law....
He took the view they were being 'dogmatic' and he claimed he had won previous 'unlawful' decisions in the courts so he chose to ignore them both.
Seems to me they were basing their 'opinions' on 'facts' and they knew the government were wrong, both morally and lawfully.
Jack Straw's advisor's both believed the invasion was illegal based on international law....
He took the view they were being 'dogmatic' and he claimed he had won previous 'unlawful' decisions in the courts so he chose to ignore them both.
Seems to me they were basing their 'opinions' on 'facts' and they knew the government were wrong, both morally and lawfully.
I think that they realised that there was potential for the decision to be viewed as both illegal, and legal, depending on who one talked to. I would suggest that the government concluded that it was legal. Blair is a trained barrister by all accounts.
After all, hopefully we are not yet at the banana replublic stage yet, and our leaders have the requisite IQ to realise that they could end up in an international law court should they get things disastrously wrong.
Nopbody has yet been taken to court on this one, and thus any opinions on the legality or otherwise are precisely that, opinions
After all, hopefully we are not yet at the banana replublic stage yet, and our leaders have the requisite IQ to realise that they could end up in an international law court should they get things disastrously wrong.
Nopbody has yet been taken to court on this one, and thus any opinions on the legality or otherwise are precisely that, opinions
Might be worth remembering Jack Straw is a capable lawyer too and had support from the Attorney General for a view not in line with the advice of the mandarins. Advice is just that and not mandatory for decision makers to follow provided it is weighed. 'Legality' can only be declared by courts of appropriate jurisdiction however....
It's not a matter of opinion that the war in Iraq was illegal, its a matter of it contaviening international law, which it did. Wars of aggression are illegal as far as international law is concerned (not suprising really). It was NOT sanctioned by the UN. George W Bush and Tony Bliar are war criminals as a result. It's not that hard to understand really.
Whether people think the war was justified regardless is of course another matter. However, tell the surviving relatives of the resulting MILLION plus dead iraqis that it was a good idea and justified regardless of the facts, I'm somewhat sceptical that they would agree.
Whether people think the war was justified regardless is of course another matter. However, tell the surviving relatives of the resulting MILLION plus dead iraqis that it was a good idea and justified regardless of the facts, I'm somewhat sceptical that they would agree.
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