newbie defector
Discussion
just defected from the world of cerbera and bought a pre serp griff 500 today. Drove it 180 miles home and have a massive smile. Blimey is it different from a cerb!
Thanks to all those who responded to my Tyre width thread last week. I will be buying some 17" wheels and R888's shortly followed by large brakes.
hours of fun ahead
Jes
Thanks to all those who responded to my Tyre width thread last week. I will be buying some 17" wheels and R888's shortly followed by large brakes.
hours of fun ahead
Jes
Hugh, 4 days without a TVR was all I could manage! hence the new toy
the differences mmm - I have bought a track modified and well looked after griff and i've only had 3 or 4 hours in the griff on the road none on a track but first impressions are...
The cerb had power steering but this griff doesn't so the reaction time of the rack is slower inevitably but the steering feeback is good. Might have to fit power steering to speed it up but not sure yet.
The cerb is hugely quicker in a straight line especially above about 80mph and given the way the engine performs much easier to drive fast in higher revs, particulaly through bends.
The griff pulls much better from low revs so it matters less how you choose to drive it. i.e. it will be more forgiving if I drive like an arse in the wrong gear. The griffs torque spread is better so it will be easier to go quick on circuits where the gearing is wrong for a cerb-like Curborough and Mira.
the griff feels less planted and much more twitchy-that is probably mostly down to its set up but it does have nitrons and poly bushes which the cerb did. i wll sort that fairly easily though with ride height changes, corner weighting, damper settings, anti roll bar tweaks etc.
The griff feels lighter (it is by 170kg) but there is a greater weight transfer front to rear and consequently front/rear grip levels, under change in throttle/braking in bends probably due to the shorter wheel base.
It also tries harder to plough straight on when nailing it exiting a corner than the cerb did - again that is probably set up or possibly tyres (the griff is on Toyo T1R but the cerb was on R888) but time will tell.
The chassis on the griff also feels less rigid but a roll bar will fix that.
The decatted griff also IMHO sounds better than the cerb.
Overall I really like the griff, it is more go kart like and acts and feels very similar to my old wedge (400se) it seems to be predictable and you can certainly steer it on the throttle. it's going to be fun learning how to do it properly.
not sure about wheels yet - i want a set of 17 x 7.5 I think as light as i can reasonably get for sensible money with 235's front and 255's rear probably 40's to maximise grip and reduce rolling radius to improve acceleration. Depends what Toyo can provide in which compound though-not done my homework on that yet.
Hugh - dont worry I will not be a contender in the championship this year - I am just going to have some fun and play around a bit to try and make it quick and reliable. I will come and see you guys though at the odd event.
cheers
Jes
the differences mmm - I have bought a track modified and well looked after griff and i've only had 3 or 4 hours in the griff on the road none on a track but first impressions are...
The cerb had power steering but this griff doesn't so the reaction time of the rack is slower inevitably but the steering feeback is good. Might have to fit power steering to speed it up but not sure yet.
The cerb is hugely quicker in a straight line especially above about 80mph and given the way the engine performs much easier to drive fast in higher revs, particulaly through bends.
The griff pulls much better from low revs so it matters less how you choose to drive it. i.e. it will be more forgiving if I drive like an arse in the wrong gear. The griffs torque spread is better so it will be easier to go quick on circuits where the gearing is wrong for a cerb-like Curborough and Mira.
the griff feels less planted and much more twitchy-that is probably mostly down to its set up but it does have nitrons and poly bushes which the cerb did. i wll sort that fairly easily though with ride height changes, corner weighting, damper settings, anti roll bar tweaks etc.
The griff feels lighter (it is by 170kg) but there is a greater weight transfer front to rear and consequently front/rear grip levels, under change in throttle/braking in bends probably due to the shorter wheel base.
It also tries harder to plough straight on when nailing it exiting a corner than the cerb did - again that is probably set up or possibly tyres (the griff is on Toyo T1R but the cerb was on R888) but time will tell.
The chassis on the griff also feels less rigid but a roll bar will fix that.
The decatted griff also IMHO sounds better than the cerb.
Overall I really like the griff, it is more go kart like and acts and feels very similar to my old wedge (400se) it seems to be predictable and you can certainly steer it on the throttle. it's going to be fun learning how to do it properly.
not sure about wheels yet - i want a set of 17 x 7.5 I think as light as i can reasonably get for sensible money with 235's front and 255's rear probably 40's to maximise grip and reduce rolling radius to improve acceleration. Depends what Toyo can provide in which compound though-not done my homework on that yet.
Hugh - dont worry I will not be a contender in the championship this year - I am just going to have some fun and play around a bit to try and make it quick and reliable. I will come and see you guys though at the odd event.
cheers
Jes
Edited by jesfirth on Friday 12th February 02:03
Hope you enjoy the new car Jes.
Agree with your observations on the main differences between the two cars. Completely different machines, in an ideal world, you'd want 1 of each! I moved from a 4ltr pre-cat Griff, to a 4.2 Cerb, then the current Griff 500.
- The Griff is defo more twitchy when beaking, in acceleration & in the bends. I assume it's due to the shorter Wheelbase. The Cerb was always easier & more forgiving. Go into a corner a bit too quick and you can lift off in the Cerb...DON'T EVER do that in a Griff
Go in too fast in the Griff and the advice is "be brave & hang on"! The upside is it is more rewarding when you get it right.
- Steering more positive / direct in the Cerb. In fact, pre-cat (no power assistance) was better than the 500. Somebody correct me but I think lock-to-lock, the Cerb is 2.0 turns, non-power Griff 2.2 turns & power-assisted Griff 2.5 turns.
- Always found the Cerb to rev quicker & more freely. Feels more race car like but the low-down grunt in the Griff means you can pull off a quick overtake without changing down or preparing whereas the Cerb needs to be ready and in the right revs.
- Could never decide which sounded best. You just can't beat the Griff V8 burble and I love a louder modified exhaust. That said, you can't help a childish chuckle from making the Cerb Pop & Bang when lifting off
- The Cerb was quicker in my novice hands. It's lightning fast & easier to drive so point to point just that bit quicker. However, on a sunny day, you can't beat having the roof off. The cerb is deceptively fast, so much so it's surprising when you glimpse at the speedo sometimes. However, the Griff is no slouch & always feels fast! In fact, have given a few Sports Bikes a shock when they look behind a still see the Shark-like grin of a Red Griff still looming large after a few miles!!!
One suggestion, park the roof in the garage...you only need it when leaving at the garage for your MOT. If it rains, just don't stop
Steve.
Agree with your observations on the main differences between the two cars. Completely different machines, in an ideal world, you'd want 1 of each! I moved from a 4ltr pre-cat Griff, to a 4.2 Cerb, then the current Griff 500.
- The Griff is defo more twitchy when beaking, in acceleration & in the bends. I assume it's due to the shorter Wheelbase. The Cerb was always easier & more forgiving. Go into a corner a bit too quick and you can lift off in the Cerb...DON'T EVER do that in a Griff
Go in too fast in the Griff and the advice is "be brave & hang on"! The upside is it is more rewarding when you get it right.- Steering more positive / direct in the Cerb. In fact, pre-cat (no power assistance) was better than the 500. Somebody correct me but I think lock-to-lock, the Cerb is 2.0 turns, non-power Griff 2.2 turns & power-assisted Griff 2.5 turns.
- Always found the Cerb to rev quicker & more freely. Feels more race car like but the low-down grunt in the Griff means you can pull off a quick overtake without changing down or preparing whereas the Cerb needs to be ready and in the right revs.
- Could never decide which sounded best. You just can't beat the Griff V8 burble and I love a louder modified exhaust. That said, you can't help a childish chuckle from making the Cerb Pop & Bang when lifting off
- The Cerb was quicker in my novice hands. It's lightning fast & easier to drive so point to point just that bit quicker. However, on a sunny day, you can't beat having the roof off. The cerb is deceptively fast, so much so it's surprising when you glimpse at the speedo sometimes. However, the Griff is no slouch & always feels fast! In fact, have given a few Sports Bikes a shock when they look behind a still see the Shark-like grin of a Red Griff still looming large after a few miles!!!
One suggestion, park the roof in the garage...you only need it when leaving at the garage for your MOT. If it rains, just don't stop
Steve.
Steve, Toyo do still owe me a set of tyres, its just working out what I want - decisions, decisions.
Gurston will be interesting especially as the cerb was far too long for the hairpin so the griff should be much quicker through that bend, Unfortunately I am probably only going to be able to do the occasional local airfield type event this year, so wont be at gurston though.
Gurston will be interesting especially as the cerb was far too long for the hairpin so the griff should be much quicker through that bend, Unfortunately I am probably only going to be able to do the occasional local airfield type event this year, so wont be at gurston though.
Oh go on come to Gurston. If the car is still new to you and you have not had a chance to sort the handling and get some proper tyres and you carry 50Kg of ballast there is a very slim chance I may be able to get up the hill faster than you. Go on you know you want to, far better bacon rolls at Gurston than some mobile catering van at an airfield. Allegedly last year you had never seen the hill before and I seem to remember you had a quick glance at it from the start line and put in four ridiculously quick times. Come and have a go in the Griff and we can see if it was the driver or the car.
Come on Jes, I herby throw my new flame proof gloves on the floor.
Come on Jes, I herby throw my new flame proof gloves on the floor.
Hi Jes, and welcome.
Just about all the deficiencies you described can be removed, except the rake/stability. And that can be massively improved. The lift off snap can be sorted too. Brake oversteer is something else, but I use that.
There are many Griffs out there with all the bits, that just aren't fast, but I'm sure with your experience you work out where that comes from. If I can help...I'd love to.
As i've said, I reckon you'll love the driving style...it'll go with your own "loose" style.
I'm slightly envious of your next couple of years...
Its why I've never moved, the way it drives and the car look!
We are next out at Oulton on the 24th...£80.
http://www.tvrmonster.com/forum2/index.php?action=...
Just about all the deficiencies you described can be removed, except the rake/stability. And that can be massively improved. The lift off snap can be sorted too. Brake oversteer is something else, but I use that.
There are many Griffs out there with all the bits, that just aren't fast, but I'm sure with your experience you work out where that comes from. If I can help...I'd love to.
As i've said, I reckon you'll love the driving style...it'll go with your own "loose" style.
I'm slightly envious of your next couple of years...
Its why I've never moved, the way it drives and the car look!
We are next out at Oulton on the 24th...£80.
http://www.tvrmonster.com/forum2/index.php?action=...
Edited by Guillotine on Saturday 13th February 09:42
The Cerb is defo a different monster from the Griff, my Cerb was factory spec on 18 spiders and I hadn't got round to setting it up and the standard seats were no good for me when wearing a helmet as the only way I could drive it was when I was lying all the way back in the seat, so not good, Unfortunately I didn't get the chance to see what it was capable of when set up because I binned it at Oulton.
The best compliment I can give my set up Griff is that it feels very much like my standard Sagaris.
Not bad for the price of Nitrons and decent set up.
The best compliment I can give my set up Griff is that it feels very much like my standard Sagaris.
Not bad for the price of Nitrons and decent set up.
Hi Andy,
You are right about the loose style. My only problem is that the non power steering just doesnt react fast enough to input-other than that I reckon I just need to tweak it all.
I cant make the 24th, Tim also invited me out on the 20th but I cant make that either.
I reckon a couple of months and I will get to the odd event though.
I will give you a call and pick your brains on geometry if thats ok?
thanks
Jes
You are right about the loose style. My only problem is that the non power steering just doesnt react fast enough to input-other than that I reckon I just need to tweak it all.
I cant make the 24th, Tim also invited me out on the 20th but I cant make that either.
I reckon a couple of months and I will get to the odd event though.
I will give you a call and pick your brains on geometry if thats ok?
thanks
Jes
Sorry Jes, I do apologise, plainly I misunderstood the exact etiquette of issuing a glove based challenge and hereby absolve you of any requirement to respond. Research indicates that a glove based challenge requires, as you say, contact with the opponents face. Only when the item of apparel is a gauntlet is it thrown to the ground. A small but vitally important difference.
Have fun in the Griff
Have fun in the Griff
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