Stick-on reg plates

[manox]

Hi Guys,

Just wondering if anyone knows the legality of vinyl front plates? It'll be going on an import mx-5 if that makes any difference?!

Also does anyone know where i can get them from? Some tip end drove into mine and cracked it all.... never liked the standard black surround any how.

Cheers, Andy

[redstu]

Probably " illegal" but let's hope someone that actually knows answers because they look better than standard on some cars.

[dylan0451]

'well the man in the shop was selling them, so they must be legal, officer?'

not sure if they 100% kill the women, kittens, children, haiti victims - but i think a very unhappy BiB could cause you some problems

mine's been on for about 4-5 years through previous owners, seems to have passed mot's and a few rozzers that've pulled up next to me at the lights haven't noticed or appeared to care

touch wood

at the end of the day it's readable via a forward facing speed camera so i think that's all that matters

[kambites]

I might be wrong, but I think the law says something along the lines of "the number plate must be mounted as close to vertical as reasonably possible".

[rhinochopig]

My Westy had vinyl from new. It was almost horizontal. In the 5 years I owned it I was never stopped and the police had plenty of opportunity.

[OllieWinchester]

Had no problems with mine on the Eunos in two years.

[Taffer]

Never had any problems with the vinyl plates on the MX5 from the Police, but the council car parks in Glasgow have number plate readers, mounted near the ground looking up. This meant that they couldn't 'see' the plate on the top edge of the bonnet. Every time I went to these car parks it took a bit longer for the barrier to go up, as presumably it requires the bloke in the office to manually check the cameras and raise the barrier.

[Opel-GT]

This site contains information about stick on plates.

Craigs Plates

you can also order them from here.

[flemke]

TVR Moneypit said:

I have had pulls by the plod in both the Chim and the Disco, both of which have stick on vinal plates, (the Chim as 3/4 size). I did ask a copper about the one on the CHim and he said that strictly speaking it was illegal as it doesn't have the DOT number on the bottom, but that no copper he knew would bother to do you for such a trivial offence.

"DOT number"? Perhaps you mean the BSI number?
I may be wrong, but I believe the requirement to display that number depends on when the reg plate (not the car) was manufactured, and that requirement was not always in force. The standard was composed in '98, IINM, and reg plate rules were revised in '01, so one of those dates may have been the start. Many Chims were made before then, so perhaps your plate predates that rule.

On the broader subject of stick-on reg plates, one of the many disgusting and pathetic features of this 5hithole of a country is that citizens are forced to pay money to discover what are the laws imposed upon them. In the case of the rules on reg plates, you need to shell out a mere £43 to BSI to learn what's required on your reg plate.
A few months ago, a PHer kindly posted a link to that super-secret information, but unfortunately the link only worked for a limited period of time.
As regards stick-on plates, IIRC the points that could be problematical were:
- The plate backing has to be rigid. One might be able to argue that the rigid bodywork to which a stick-on was affixed should be considered "backing", or whatever the term was. However,
- the plate has to be, I think the term was, a "substantially flat" plane . Now, one could argue that "substantially flat" means "anything more than 50% flat", or one could argue that it means "essentially flat". It could not mean "actually flat", because a huge % of all front reg plates in the UK are not actually flat.
- Also, all the characters on the plate must be legible when viewed from an acute side angle of X degrees. Some stick-on plates will pass the test, but perhaps not all would do.
- There is something about the verticality of the plate, but it was less restrictive than the above may be. It was something like, "the plate must be legible to a person standing before it".

[manox]

Cheers for the knowledge guys!

Bloody hell Flemke... you know your beans!!

[hornetrider]

Stick on plates ftw. No probs MOT time or with plod.

[hairykrishna]

The police have never bothered me about the one on the front of the kit car. At the same time they never bothered me when it didn't actually have a front plate for about 6 months either. I always got the impression that it depends on the car quite a bit.

[flemke]

TVR Moneypit said:

Thanks for that info Flemke.

Yes, it is a BSI number, not a DOT number. You should consider yourself lucky though, as I nearly typed a ISBN number, before realising that that was something to do with books I think?

"ISBN" I would have recognised. The "DOT" did make me wonder if there was something that I was missing.

TVR Moneypit said:

So, to summerise, as usual the law is an ass, complicated, and with several different variations on what might be considered to be 'the truth'? Well, that's as clear as mud then

The vagueness of the law I can sort-of abide, in the sense that not all circumstances can be anticipated. To improve the rule, they could have a single definitive test related to actual legibility - which ultimately is all that matters - with guidelines for assistance or interpretation.
To my mind, the absolutely unforgivable thing is that the only way to find out what the law is is to pay for it. Forty-three fu<king pounds to find out the rules for your reg plate? How much for the rules for the rest of your car? How much for the other 3,000 new laws and statutory instruments that are created every single year? It is totally insane.

TVR Moneypit said:

Edited to add, maybe the 1998 rule was the reason why the copper said that I wouldn't have any problem as the Chim is 1995 and the Disco is 1996. I'm sure that this topic has been done before, right here on SP&L?

Yes, SP&L, most recently last summer, I believe.

[flemke]

manox said:

Bloody hell Flemke... you know your beans!!

Maybe, but unfortunately I don't know anything about motorcars.

[Ozzie Osmond]

Don't kid yourselves! Those stick-on plates are definitely illegal. All plates must be made of the correct material and mounted vertically as well as correct size of letters and spacing.

There is talk of making 100% correct plates a specific MoT test requirement.

In the meantime DVLA is issuing fixed penalties on any report of an incorrect plate. This may matter little with a normal plate but anyone with a personalised registration will still be warned that it may be confiscated in the event of repeated offence.

[flemke]

Ozzie Osmond said:

Don't kid yourselves! Those stick-on plates are definitely illegal. All plates must be made of the correct material and mounted vertically as well as correct size of letters and spacing.

There is talk of making 100% correct plates a specific MoT test requirement.

In the meantime DVLA is issuing fixed penalties on any report of an incorrect plate. This may matter little with a normal plate but anyone with a personalised registration will still be warned that it may be confiscated in the event of repeated offence.

There are many vehicles that were either type-approved or SVA'd without provision for a perfectly flat and vertical plate, and they cannot function properly with one. In most cases, a car owner uses a stick-on plate only because a flat one is not readily feasible.
Font/spacing is a completely different issue - a deliberate attempt to ignore the rules not for a pragmatic reason, but for a social one.
About 3 years ago the DVLA instructed MOT testers to enforce the standard strictly, including the requirement that the plate had to bear the postal code of the maker, but after a few weeks they rescinded the instruction.
The stick-on plate is not "definitely illegal", for the simple reason that a stick-on plate could be stuck onto an inflexible flat substrate.

In any case, which is more useful to anyone who needs to spot the reg plate:
This


or this?


Where would you put a "legal" plate on the E-Type?

[RicksAlfas]

The biggest problem with these plates is getting all the letters straight.

[Munter]

Never had any problems with the original non reflective one. The nice copper who attended the bump the Mrs had even used the stick on plate to read the reg.

Now I have a reflective one It satisfies even more of the legal requirements. No it doesn't have a BSI kite mark. But as the cars from before that legislation came in it's ignored. Otherwise everybody with any numberplate made before then would have to rush out and buy new ones.

Get a sticky one from Craigs plates. Select it to be 100% the legal layout/format. Stick it on the car.

[Ozzie Osmond]

Munter said:

Get a sticky one from Craigs plates. Select it to be 100% the legal layout/format. Stick it on the car.

Unless your car is 40 years old it's not possible for a stick-on vinyl number plate to be legal. It is not made from the correct reflective material and also,


The Road Vehicles (Display of Registration Marks) Regulations 2001

Fixing of front registration plates: vehicles registered on or after [1 October 1938]

6. (1) This regulation applies to [cars].

(2) ... a registration plate must be fixed on the front of the vehicle in the manner required by paragraph (3).

(3) This paragraph requires the plate to be fixed - vertically or, where that is not reasonably practicable, in a position as close to the vertical as is reasonably practicable,


VEHICLES REGISTERED AND NEW REGISTRATION PLATES FITTED ON OR AFTER 1ST SEPTEMBER 2001 (MANDATORY SPECIFICATION)

1. The plate must be made of retroreflecting material which, as regards its construction, colour and other qualities, complies with the requirements of -


(a) the British Standard specification for retroreflecting number plates published on 15 January 1998 under number BS AU 145d[13], or

(b) any other relevant standard or specification recognised for use in an EEA State and which, when in use, offers a performance equivalent to that offered by a plate complying with the British Standard specification,


and which, in either case, is marked with the number (or such other information as is necessary to permit identification) of that standard or specification.


VEHICLES REGISTERED ON OR AFTER 1ST JANUARY 1973 AND BEFORE 1ST SEPTEMBER 2001 (OPTIONAL SPECIFICATION)

1. The plate must be made of reflex-reflecting material which, as regards its construction, colour and other qualities, complies with the requirements of -


(a) the British Standard Specification for reflex-reflecting number plates, published on 11 September 1972 under the number BS AU 145a[14], or

(b) any other relevant standard or specification recognised for use in an EEA State and which, when in use, offers a performance equivalent to that offered by a plate complying with the British Standard specification,


and which, in either case, is marked with the number (or such other information as is necessary to permit identification) of that standard or specification.

[snotrag]

My car has passed two MOTs like this, and never had any attention from the Police, or any problems with ANPR.

Its reflective, correctly spaced, correct font, flat(ish). If I got pulled for it i would be mightily displeased, not to mention very surprised.




Making sure you stick it on straight is another matter