Expelling kids to be abolished (maybe)

[srebbe64]

Apparently excluding disruptive kids from school doesn't much help the kids in question - fair enough, their problems are their parents (or normally parent).

However, what about the well behaved kids who have to suffer because of a minority, surely they deserve the opportunity to learn in an appropriate environment?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8541404.stm

[Jasandjules]

Why is it that "think tanks" almost seem like an oxymoron...

At the risk of sounding like a Trekkie, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

If the scrotes can't behave, so be it. Remove them from society if needs be.

[andy_s]

Jasandjules said:

Why is it that "think tanks" almost seem like an oxymoron...

At the risk of sounding like a Trekkie, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

If the scrotes can't behave, so be it. Remove them from society if needs be.

Make it so.

[grumbledoak]

Jasandjules said:

If the scrotes can't behave, so be it. Remove them from society if needs be.

"Go play on the motorway, you little st. I've a class to teach."

[BliarOut]

I used to try to get expelled Kicking a kid out of school who doesn't want to go to school seems the most perverse punishment imaginable to me.

[Mark34bn]

Jasandjules said:

At the risk of sounding like a Trekkie, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

Or the one..

Seriously though I can't see a problem with expelling the disruptive kids. Why let them spoil it for everyone.
Is it true classes are all mixed ability nowadays?
When I went to school there were 4 or 5 classes in each subject based on ability from the top scorers down to the thickos (or whatever you like to call them) and I don't see the problem with that system.

[paddyhasneeds]

I thought expulsion simply meant you're sent to a unit for other bad, sorry "vulnerable" kids, it's not as if you're walking the streets looking for work at 12 because no school will have you?

[Parrot of Doom]

So a child throws a chair at a teacher, the teacher then refuses to ever again teach that child, who cannot be removed from the school?

Makes sense to me :/

[Hobzy]

In our LA, once "excluded" permanently, each kid goes to Panel where its decided whether they go to another mainstream school or one of the "pupil referral units" depending on what they have done. Kids who are a pain can be sent to panel earlier to try and prevent them (and School) having the permanent exclusion on their records. Its an absolute paper chasing nightmare. It also raises the problem of is it "better the devil you know", as the more you boot out, the more you get from other schools in return. Easier at GCSE as there are lots of alternative provision that gets them off site, but a nightmare at Key Stage 3.

[Mark34bn]

Send them out with some council workers to sweep the streets / clean out the refuse lorries for a week. Tell them that's all they'll be doing if they carry on.
There must be consequences for their actions, otherwise they'll grow up thinking they can do anything and it's always someone else's fault. Harsh maybe but it would get the message across...

[paddyhasneeds]

Mark34bn said:

Send them out with some council workers to sweep the streets / clean out the refuse lorries for a week. Tell them that's all they'll be doing if they carry on.

I'll bet your local refuse disposal technicians would fking love you for that

[Jasandjules]

Surely they don't really need much of an education, I mean, all they have to learn is "Do you want fries with that?".

So, throw them out of normal school. If they need to be educated in some special school then ensure they have a tax code which penalises them in future from their benefits (or if some miracle happens, their wages) to repay the extra costs of "teaching" them. Also ensure that the parents immediately have their benefits reduced to pay for this special school. I bet they will learn to behave pretty f****ng sharpish then.

[Mark34bn]

Jasandjules said:

Surely they don't really need much of an education, I mean, all they have to learn is "Do you want fries with that?".

So, throw them out of normal school. If they need to be educated in some special school then ensure they have a tax code which penalises them in future from their benefits (or if some miracle happens, their wages) to repay the extra costs of "teaching" them. Also ensure that the parents immediately have their benefits reduced to pay for this special school. I bet they will learn to behave pretty f****ng sharpish then.

This reminds me of a mother & daughter on GMTV a while back. The mum had already been to prison because her child refused to go to school. She said one teacher 'had it in for her', no other pupils had a problem. The kid couldn't care less, her mum was in tears at the prospect of a 2nd term inside. But what's the answer ? Boot Camp ?

[Hobzy]

I meant to mention my most recent wee boiler at work... difficult pupil "diagnosed" with:

"Oppositional defiant disorder".

Look it up...



Now while I do believe in ADHD - ( I have a kid in my year just like the squirrel in "Over the hedge"), Aspergers and Autism, this made me shake my head and laugh in a depressed "WTF" manner.

[Jasandjules]

Hobzy said:

I meant to mention my most recent wee boiler at work... difficult pupil "diagnosed" with:

"Oppositional defiant disorder".

Look it up...

Ok, just looked that up as I'd never heard of it.

I would re-name it "hasn't been put in his place enough disorder"..

[Hobzy]

Jasandjules said:

Hobzy said:

I meant to mention my most recent wee boiler at work... difficult pupil "diagnosed" with:

"Oppositional defiant disorder".

Look it up...

Ok, just looked that up as I'd never heard of it.

I would re-name it "hasn't been put in his place enough disorder"..

[nonegreen]

Jasandjules said:

Hobzy said:

I meant to mention my most recent wee boiler at work... difficult pupil "diagnosed" with:

"Oppositional defiant disorder".

Look it up...

Ok, just looked that up as I'd never heard of it.

I would re-name it "hasn't been put in his place enough disorder"..

Isn't that the same as "needs a smack in the mouth syndrome"?

Anyway I just don't understand this thread. Clearly the object of school is to create stress for the teachers and make sure the pupils are equipped for the Britain of tommorrow. As that is going to be a bit like Mosambique only with more rain the policy seems fit for purpose.

[standards]

BliarOut said:

I used to try to get expelled Kicking a kid out of school who doesn't want to go to school seems the most perverse punishment imaginable to me.

I agree. PS3 time increase for those with feckless parents.

One area I read about have an educational social worker pick up excluded pupil from home in uniform and take them to another school where they do their set tasks in the library looking and feeling uncomfortable in odd uniform.

Expensive though.

[Jasandjules]

nonegreen said:

Isn't that the same as "needs a smack in the mouth syndrome"?

I believe it is quite similar.

Also sometimes referred to as "spoilt f****ng rotten" or "gotten away with far too much without being severely punished for it" syndrome.

I personally prefer the "need to have 10 lashes in front of the school" sydrome, but I believe the professionals dispute this as being a real condition....

[dxg]

So the underlying report is produced by Demos, well known for its left-wing bias.

Have a read of the Demos section of this summary: http://www.diplomatmagazine.co.uk/Features/left-wi...

Which includes the following:

Among its authors, naturally, are some of the more fashionable intellectuals of our time, including Charles Leadbeater, John Gray and Amitai Etzioni, the latter of whom is the nearest thing to Demos’ patron saint (sample quote: ‘Social Democracy is obsolete; now it’s Communitarian Liberalism’).