Smart Roadster
Discussion
A mate of mine has had two, and my boss has just bought a Brabus.
As far as I am aware, the Brabus is a total waste of cash. The big wheels go oval and kerb easily, the leather interior isn't worth the extra money and you can make a standard SMART roadster as quick as a Brabus with a remap. The ride quality is better on the smaller rims, and the handling isn't 'all that' on the bigger rims anyway.
IMO, you're paying for the pointless name. And the gearbox is still awful whether its a Brabus or not.
As far as I am aware, the Brabus is a total waste of cash. The big wheels go oval and kerb easily, the leather interior isn't worth the extra money and you can make a standard SMART roadster as quick as a Brabus with a remap. The ride quality is better on the smaller rims, and the handling isn't 'all that' on the bigger rims anyway.
IMO, you're paying for the pointless name. And the gearbox is still awful whether its a Brabus or not.
MarJay said:
A mate of mine has had two, and my boss has just bought a Brabus.
As far as I am aware, the Brabus is a total waste of cash. The big wheels go oval and kerb easily, the leather interior isn't worth the extra money and you can make a standard SMART roadster as quick as a Brabus with a remap. The ride quality is better on the smaller rims, and the handling isn't 'all that' on the bigger rims anyway.
IMO, you're paying for the pointless name. And the gearbox is still awful whether its a Brabus or not.
This echos what a friend with one told me, although I have no personal experience of owning one.As far as I am aware, the Brabus is a total waste of cash. The big wheels go oval and kerb easily, the leather interior isn't worth the extra money and you can make a standard SMART roadster as quick as a Brabus with a remap. The ride quality is better on the smaller rims, and the handling isn't 'all that' on the bigger rims anyway.
IMO, you're paying for the pointless name. And the gearbox is still awful whether its a Brabus or not.
Personally if I wanted a really good 'PH' car and could afford a Brabus I'd probably buy a boggo roadster and get a GSXR1000 or Hayabusa engine stuffed in there. Lots of power, decent dog engagement mechanical sequential box and a proper clutch.
Probably be a bit 'twitchy' in the wet though.
Probably be a bit 'twitchy' in the wet though.
300 bhp/ton!Hi, maybe I can help a bit.
I bought a Roadster last month. This is it:
With these I think there are several things to note.
1. They feel a lot faster than the stats say they are.
2. They are actually a bit quicker than the stats say they are.
3. They are not and will never be a tarmac tearing hp monster.
If you are after out and out speed and acceleration, this is not the car for you. But don’t be disparaged, as there is far more to this than just that.
First off is how they drive. The turbo motor is rather fantastic, they make a great noise, so much better than any 4 cylinder engine and are very addictive. They rev freely, but also feel very grunty. In short the car never feels sluggish or lacking.
The low ride and firm suspension then add to the sensation when moving. They never really feel slow. And true enough they are fast enough to whip up to sensible speed on most roads, capable of cruising at high speed and enough poke to overtake.
But put it in a drag race off a roundabout then it will show up that it’s only 80hp.
However, where this car comes into its own is in the twisty B and C roads. Here it truly is a very rapid machine. The small size, light weight and nimble handling mean it’s much faster on these roads than you would give it credit for.
Last weekend I went on a gentle drive with some fellow PH’ers. The lead car was a well driven Porsche 968. However the little Roadster managed to keep pace with them on all of the B and C roads we went on. It truly does punch higher than its hp rating would suggest. And on such roads as those my opinion is, it is truly a rapid car.
To bolster this opinion, the car is just so much fun. The interior is funky and delightfully charming and fun. The little chirrup it makes when you change gear only enhances your smile. And it is simply a pleasure to drive.
So far I’ve also found them quite practical. Ok it’s a 2 seater and not huge. But the cabin is roomy. It’s a tad difficult to get in and out of, but a lot easier than an Elise for example.
Boot space is ok too. It has a boot in the front and back, and as long as you don’t have large items to transport, then you can actually get quite a lot of stuff in.
In terms of what models to look at. Well essentially there are 2.
Roadster, which is the notch back style (like mine). And the Roadster Coupe, this is the one with the glass/Perspex rear hatch.
The cars are identical otherwise, although the Coupe tends to sell for a bit more.
To compare these, the Coupe is a little heavier and has a slightly higher centre of gravity. But not by enough to worry about too much. But it is slightly more aerodynamic, so has a slightly higher top speed (about 2-3mph) and in theory this should lend to slightly better high speed cruising mpg.
Both variants are available in a variety of trim specs and limited edition models and the Brabus variant.
On face value the Brabus would seem the obvious choice. But I’m not truly convinced on this, although I admit I’ve not driven a Brabus.
As far as I know the Brabus has different wheels, slightly different suspension, a different turbo, bodykit and styling changes, interior styling changes, and usually all the options list.
But to contrast this, all the extra options simply add weight IMO. The air con, while nice is a known problem area with pipes that break and in a convertible one could question is it really needed anyhow. The Brabus wheels look nice, but apparently are made from very soft metal and buckle easily. Also being 17” means tyres will be more money for them.
In terms of power. The Brabus has 100hp compared to the stock Roadsters 80hp. But you can remap a stock Roadster to 100hp if you want. That said, a Brabus will remap to 120hp due to the different turbocharger used.
So it then leaves the styling. Personally I prefer the cleaner lines of the regular Roadster to the Brabus, but this is evidently a personal opinion, and there’s no denying the Brabus looks great anyway.
So should you go for a Brabus? Well it’s up to you. It’s more likely to be worth more, but by the same measure it’ll cost you more to buy also. So you don’t really gain anything overall.
Apart from that it’s then mostly down to styling and if it really offers enough over a regular Roadster to make it worth it.
As far as I know options included:
-computer
-air con
-boost/temp gauges
-leather seats
-paddle shift on steering wheel
-sports 3 spoke steering wheel
-heated seats
-cruise control
-rims
Mine is a basic spec car, it had a CD player and the boost gauges and that’s it. So it weighs in at the minimum 790kg rating. A fully loaded Raodster or Brabus will weigh a reasonable percentage more.
I also like the 15” wheels and I’m pleased that new tyres will be cheap also.
Your best bet is to go and drive one and see what you think.
And on this note, all I’ll say is, the harder you drive it the better they get.
Now, one last point to make. The gearbox!!!!!!
It’s a 6 speed sequential unit. A bit like a motorbike box. It has no clutch pedal, but it does have a clutch that is controlled by the ECU. So this means it is not an automatic. Now it does have an automatic mode, which I think is a nice addition and an extra dynamic ability on its list of abilities. It works well on the motorway, in town or when you want to cruise more than hoon. It also seems to return better mpg in auto mode.
But it isn’t the smoothest drive and will seem a little ponderous and jerky compared to many other proper automatic cars. Although to be fair, I’ve not really driven a small engined auto that was significantly better.
Manual mode is where it’s at. In this guise you push the lever forward to change up and pull it back to change down. Very much like a WRC rally car or GT race car in terms of use. If you have the paddles then you can use these too (although I don’t have them).
In this mode the gearbox is much, much smoother. And it’s quicker to change gear. Some say it’s too slow, but they are wrong! It will change gear quicker than you or I could with a regular manual. Ok it might not be in the same league as an F1 car or a top spec Ferrari – but check out the price difference, lol But it is more than quick enough and responsive enough IMO. And is one of the greatest features about the car. The box means it is quick and easy to keep the engine on the boil and get the most from it. And reminds me very much of the OD unit on an old MGB.
The Roadster really is a first rate sports car
I bought a Roadster last month. This is it:
With these I think there are several things to note.
1. They feel a lot faster than the stats say they are.
2. They are actually a bit quicker than the stats say they are.
3. They are not and will never be a tarmac tearing hp monster.
If you are after out and out speed and acceleration, this is not the car for you. But don’t be disparaged, as there is far more to this than just that.
First off is how they drive. The turbo motor is rather fantastic, they make a great noise, so much better than any 4 cylinder engine and are very addictive. They rev freely, but also feel very grunty. In short the car never feels sluggish or lacking.
The low ride and firm suspension then add to the sensation when moving. They never really feel slow. And true enough they are fast enough to whip up to sensible speed on most roads, capable of cruising at high speed and enough poke to overtake.
But put it in a drag race off a roundabout then it will show up that it’s only 80hp.
However, where this car comes into its own is in the twisty B and C roads. Here it truly is a very rapid machine. The small size, light weight and nimble handling mean it’s much faster on these roads than you would give it credit for.
Last weekend I went on a gentle drive with some fellow PH’ers. The lead car was a well driven Porsche 968. However the little Roadster managed to keep pace with them on all of the B and C roads we went on. It truly does punch higher than its hp rating would suggest. And on such roads as those my opinion is, it is truly a rapid car.
To bolster this opinion, the car is just so much fun. The interior is funky and delightfully charming and fun. The little chirrup it makes when you change gear only enhances your smile. And it is simply a pleasure to drive.
So far I’ve also found them quite practical. Ok it’s a 2 seater and not huge. But the cabin is roomy. It’s a tad difficult to get in and out of, but a lot easier than an Elise for example.
Boot space is ok too. It has a boot in the front and back, and as long as you don’t have large items to transport, then you can actually get quite a lot of stuff in.
In terms of what models to look at. Well essentially there are 2.
Roadster, which is the notch back style (like mine). And the Roadster Coupe, this is the one with the glass/Perspex rear hatch.
The cars are identical otherwise, although the Coupe tends to sell for a bit more.
To compare these, the Coupe is a little heavier and has a slightly higher centre of gravity. But not by enough to worry about too much. But it is slightly more aerodynamic, so has a slightly higher top speed (about 2-3mph) and in theory this should lend to slightly better high speed cruising mpg.
Both variants are available in a variety of trim specs and limited edition models and the Brabus variant.
On face value the Brabus would seem the obvious choice. But I’m not truly convinced on this, although I admit I’ve not driven a Brabus.
As far as I know the Brabus has different wheels, slightly different suspension, a different turbo, bodykit and styling changes, interior styling changes, and usually all the options list.
But to contrast this, all the extra options simply add weight IMO. The air con, while nice is a known problem area with pipes that break and in a convertible one could question is it really needed anyhow. The Brabus wheels look nice, but apparently are made from very soft metal and buckle easily. Also being 17” means tyres will be more money for them.
In terms of power. The Brabus has 100hp compared to the stock Roadsters 80hp. But you can remap a stock Roadster to 100hp if you want. That said, a Brabus will remap to 120hp due to the different turbocharger used.
So it then leaves the styling. Personally I prefer the cleaner lines of the regular Roadster to the Brabus, but this is evidently a personal opinion, and there’s no denying the Brabus looks great anyway.
So should you go for a Brabus? Well it’s up to you. It’s more likely to be worth more, but by the same measure it’ll cost you more to buy also. So you don’t really gain anything overall.
Apart from that it’s then mostly down to styling and if it really offers enough over a regular Roadster to make it worth it.
As far as I know options included:
-computer
-air con
-boost/temp gauges
-leather seats
-paddle shift on steering wheel
-sports 3 spoke steering wheel
-heated seats
-cruise control
-rims
Mine is a basic spec car, it had a CD player and the boost gauges and that’s it. So it weighs in at the minimum 790kg rating. A fully loaded Raodster or Brabus will weigh a reasonable percentage more.
I also like the 15” wheels and I’m pleased that new tyres will be cheap also.
Your best bet is to go and drive one and see what you think.
And on this note, all I’ll say is, the harder you drive it the better they get.
Now, one last point to make. The gearbox!!!!!!
It’s a 6 speed sequential unit. A bit like a motorbike box. It has no clutch pedal, but it does have a clutch that is controlled by the ECU. So this means it is not an automatic. Now it does have an automatic mode, which I think is a nice addition and an extra dynamic ability on its list of abilities. It works well on the motorway, in town or when you want to cruise more than hoon. It also seems to return better mpg in auto mode.
But it isn’t the smoothest drive and will seem a little ponderous and jerky compared to many other proper automatic cars. Although to be fair, I’ve not really driven a small engined auto that was significantly better.
Manual mode is where it’s at. In this guise you push the lever forward to change up and pull it back to change down. Very much like a WRC rally car or GT race car in terms of use. If you have the paddles then you can use these too (although I don’t have them).
In this mode the gearbox is much, much smoother. And it’s quicker to change gear. Some say it’s too slow, but they are wrong! It will change gear quicker than you or I could with a regular manual. Ok it might not be in the same league as an F1 car or a top spec Ferrari – but check out the price difference, lol
But it is more than quick enough and responsive enough IMO. And is one of the greatest features about the car. The box means it is quick and easy to keep the engine on the boil and get the most from it. And reminds me very much of the OD unit on an old MGB.The Roadster really is a first rate sports car
Edited by 300bhp/ton on Wednesday 24th March 12:56
300bhp/ton said:
Now, one last point to make. The gearbox!!!!!!
It’s a 6 speed sequential unit. A bit like a motorbike box. It has no clutch pedal, but it does have a clutch that is controlled by the ECU. So this means it is not an automatic. Now it does have an automatic mode, which I think is a nice addition and an extra dynamic ability on its list of abilities. It works well on the motorway, in town or when you want to cruise more than hoon. It also seems to return better mpg in auto mode.
But it isn’t the smoothest drive and will seem a little ponderous and jerky compared to many other proper automatic cars. Although to be fair, I’ve not really driven a small engined auto that was significantly better.
Manual mode is where it’s at. In this guise you push the lever forward to change up and pull it back to change down. Very much like a WRC rally car or GT race car in terms of use. If you have the paddles then you can use these too (although I don’t have them).
In this mode the gearbox is much, much smoother. And it’s quicker to change gear. Some say it’s too slow, but they are wrong! It will change gear quicker than you or I could with a regular manual.
The box is NOT a sequential box.. Yes, you select the gears in a sequential fashion, but, as far as I am aware, it is a standard pattern box with robotic selection.. It’s a 6 speed sequential unit. A bit like a motorbike box. It has no clutch pedal, but it does have a clutch that is controlled by the ECU. So this means it is not an automatic. Now it does have an automatic mode, which I think is a nice addition and an extra dynamic ability on its list of abilities. It works well on the motorway, in town or when you want to cruise more than hoon. It also seems to return better mpg in auto mode.
But it isn’t the smoothest drive and will seem a little ponderous and jerky compared to many other proper automatic cars. Although to be fair, I’ve not really driven a small engined auto that was significantly better.
Manual mode is where it’s at. In this guise you push the lever forward to change up and pull it back to change down. Very much like a WRC rally car or GT race car in terms of use. If you have the paddles then you can use these too (although I don’t have them).
In this mode the gearbox is much, much smoother. And it’s quicker to change gear. Some say it’s too slow, but they are wrong! It will change gear quicker than you or I could with a regular manual.
And if you can't change faster than the box in the Roadster when using a manual box, I think you need to go back to driving lessons.. I guarantee I could swap cogs faster in a manual car than the click, pause, pause, change, deliver from the roadster..
I've owned a Brabus for 2.5 years now (and had a for-two for 1.5 years a few years before that), it is indeed a fun car, but, unless you learn to drive around the foibles of the gearbox, it can be frustrating.. Stuck in traffic on a hill just feels nasty in terms of clutch torture!
Would I buy another one when this one goes? Yeah, if it came with an extra 50hp, a clutch pedal and quicker gear selection..
kambites said:
Does no-one do a manual gearbox conversion for them yet? The car is crying out for a proper gearbox.
I disagree. The box is what makes the car. A regualy H pattern manual box with that engine and gearing would blunt performance and you'd always be changing gear, and often in places you wouldn't want to be.I had a finale coupe, 80bhp.
Nothing this cheap to buy, or run, will feel this special. Children will point, girls will love it, people with beards will ask you questions about it at petrol stations.
The Smart Roadster is a caricature of what a sports car should be. The 3cylinder engine sounds like a mini 911, the wastegate has hints of rallying gone by, and the profile of the front wings from the drivers seat will always make you smile.
You can open the roof at any speed, and you will, as being connected with the world around you is key to enjoyment of the Roadster. It's response and turn in is immediate, the grip is fantastic, it's total lack of inertia will see you close in on *much* quicker machinery on track under braking. No one will believe it only has 80bhp, you will buy one thinking it's not enough, but never get round to remapping it.
It's a toy car, that matchbox you clipped the apexes on the pattern on the carpet, that revell snap together kit you assembled on a wet holiday in wales, and sadly built in a similar fashion. Aircon pipes will crack, the dashboard will creak, the door catch will become unlatched every now and again. It's built in france, and in many ways reminds me of the two citroens I have owned.
But on the right day, with the sun peering in above your sunglasses, as you brake, flick through the gears on the sequential stick, hear the turbo whistle and bury the throttle through the next corner, you will wonder if there is any better motoring experience. And when you look at the speedo and realise all this fun is legal, that grin will only be reinforced.
I miss mine, will probably have another one day.
Nothing this cheap to buy, or run, will feel this special. Children will point, girls will love it, people with beards will ask you questions about it at petrol stations.
The Smart Roadster is a caricature of what a sports car should be. The 3cylinder engine sounds like a mini 911, the wastegate has hints of rallying gone by, and the profile of the front wings from the drivers seat will always make you smile.
You can open the roof at any speed, and you will, as being connected with the world around you is key to enjoyment of the Roadster. It's response and turn in is immediate, the grip is fantastic, it's total lack of inertia will see you close in on *much* quicker machinery on track under braking. No one will believe it only has 80bhp, you will buy one thinking it's not enough, but never get round to remapping it.
It's a toy car, that matchbox you clipped the apexes on the pattern on the carpet, that revell snap together kit you assembled on a wet holiday in wales, and sadly built in a similar fashion. Aircon pipes will crack, the dashboard will creak, the door catch will become unlatched every now and again. It's built in france, and in many ways reminds me of the two citroens I have owned.
But on the right day, with the sun peering in above your sunglasses, as you brake, flick through the gears on the sequential stick, hear the turbo whistle and bury the throttle through the next corner, you will wonder if there is any better motoring experience. And when you look at the speedo and realise all this fun is legal, that grin will only be reinforced.
I miss mine, will probably have another one day.
300bhp/ton said:
kambites said:
Does no-one do a manual gearbox conversion for them yet? The car is crying out for a proper gearbox.
I disagree. The box is what makes the car. A regualy H pattern manual box with that engine and gearing would blunt performance and you'd always be changing gear, and often in places you wouldn't want to be.You're always changing gear anyway due to the gear ratios that the box has. I'd much rather a box in the car that I fully control, that I can clip the rev limiter without the car deciding to change up a gear for me..
The box is one of the only things that spoils the car, that and the leaks..
300bhp/ton said:
kambites said:
Does no-one do a manual gearbox conversion for them yet? The car is crying out for a proper gearbox.
I disagree. The box is what makes the car. A regualy H pattern manual box with that engine and gearing would blunt performance and you'd always be changing gear, and often in places you wouldn't want to be.Slinky said:
The box is NOT a sequential box.. Yes, you select the gears in a sequential fashion, but, as far as I am aware, it is a standard pattern box with robotic selection..
In all honesty I don't know. But I'll investigate and find out.Slinky said:
And if you can't change faster than the box in the Roadster when using a manual box, I think you need to go back to driving lessons.. I guarantee I could swap cogs faster in a manual car than the click, pause, pause, change, deliver from the roadster..
I can guarantee that you are deluded and that you wouldn't stand a chance.sure you might be able to move your arm quicker. But the entire end to end process of yes I need to change gear. Foot down on the clutch, other foot up off the throttle, move the lever and then down on the throttle and back up on the clutch.
No chance matey, not even close
(all IMO of course 
)Slinky said:
I've owned a Brabus for 2.5 years now (and had a for-two for 1.5 years a few years before that), it is indeed a fun car, but, unless you learn to drive around the foibles of the gearbox, it can be frustrating.. Stuck in traffic on a hill just feels nasty in terms of clutch torture!
Are you talking about auto mode or manual?Ignoring my above tongue in cheek reply. I simply can't relate to this experience. My experience in manual mode, if you bang the lever and it shifts before you can count to 1, certainly before you can get your hand back to the steering wheel. And it's almost as good going down the box.
Now I won't claim to be a great driver, but I think I'm ok. And I can honestly say that most of the time the Roadster will shift faster than I could, and even on it's slow shifts, its still no slower than what your average Jo would achieve.
kambites said:
300bhp/ton said:
kambites said:
Does no-one do a manual gearbox conversion for them yet? The car is crying out for a proper gearbox.
I disagree. The box is what makes the car. A regualy H pattern manual box with that engine and gearing would blunt performance and you'd always be changing gear, and often in places you wouldn't want to be.Slinky said:
300bhp/ton said:
kambites said:
Does no-one do a manual gearbox conversion for them yet? The car is crying out for a proper gearbox.
I disagree. The box is what makes the car. A regualy H pattern manual box with that engine and gearing would blunt performance and you'd always be changing gear, and often in places you wouldn't want to be.You're always changing gear anyway due to the gear ratios that the box has. I'd much rather a box in the car that I fully control, that I can clip the rev limiter without the car deciding to change up a gear for me..
The box is one of the only things that spoils the car, that and the leaks..
In a regular H pattern box car, if you "clip" the red line as you say, you'd end up either over revving it, or kicking in the rev limiter.
300bhp/ton said:
Slinky said:
The box is NOT a sequential box.. Yes, you select the gears in a sequential fashion, but, as far as I am aware, it is a standard pattern box with robotic selection..
In all honesty I don't know. But I'll investigate and find out.Slinky said:
And if you can't change faster than the box in the Roadster when using a manual box, I think you need to go back to driving lessons.. I guarantee I could swap cogs faster in a manual car than the click, pause, pause, change, deliver from the roadster..
I can guarantee that you are deluded and that you wouldn't stand a chance.sure you might be able to move your arm quicker. But the entire end to end process of yes I need to change gear. Foot down on the clutch, other foot up off the throttle, move the lever and then down on the throttle and back up on the clutch.
No chance matey, not even close
(all IMO of course )Slinky said:
I've owned a Brabus for 2.5 years now (and had a for-two for 1.5 years a few years before that), it is indeed a fun car, but, unless you learn to drive around the foibles of the gearbox, it can be frustrating.. Stuck in traffic on a hill just feels nasty in terms of clutch torture!
Are you talking about auto mode or manual?Ignoring my above tongue in cheek reply. I simply can't relate to this experience. My experience in manual mode, if you bang the lever and it shifts before you can count to 1, certainly before you can get your hand back to the steering wheel. And it's almost as good going down the box.
Now I won't claim to be a great driver, but I think I'm ok. And I can honestly say that most of the time the Roadster will shift faster than I could, and even on it's slow shifts, its still no slower than what your average Jo would achieve.
You need to get out and drive some more cars if you think the Roadster gearbox is slick..
kambites said:
300bhp/ton said:
kambites said:
Does no-one do a manual gearbox conversion for them yet? The car is crying out for a proper gearbox.
I disagree. The box is what makes the car. A regualy H pattern manual box with that engine and gearing would blunt performance and you'd always be changing gear, and often in places you wouldn't want to be.Maybe its been mapped and shifts quicker
but there's no evidence to suggest that it has.But I like the downshift and use it for engine braking, so much so that in places you don't even need to use the brake pedal.
Maybe the trick is, not to expect the shift the very instant you move the lever. In a regular manual you don't actually get the drive back when you move the lever, but when you lift the clutch pedal up. The Roadster is no different, hit the lever and it'll shift, but you won't have drive until its all engaged again.
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