BMW 325/328: E36 or E46 ?

[Inigo Montoya]

What are the pros and cons of the E46 3-Series (specifically the 328 and 325) over the E36?

I'm toying with the idea of a 3-Series and I've noticed that for the price of a smart E36 coupe you can get an E46 saloon of similar miles. I really don't care which body style it has as long as it has the folding seats option, and it seems to be easier to find E46s with some of the options I'm after (I quite fancy cream/tan leather and I specifically don't want a spoiler so I can fit a bike rack).

Something like this seems quite tempting: http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2010...

It's a daily driver so as well as dynamics and performance I'm interested in long journey refinement, economy (although it's not too critical) and general ownership.

[aka_kerrly]

what is your budget as id rather have one of the better examples of a E36 than have a ropey example of a E46

dave

[neil_bolton]

If you want to fit a bike rack, don't consider an E36 coupe.

[Inigo Montoya]

Ideally I'm looking to cap it at around £4k, but it depends what's on offer really - I'm looking for something mechanically good but not too worried about cosmetics on a workhorse, so potentially £1,200's worth of slightly rusty E36 saloon could be all I need. It's a question of what I get for the money...

[aka_kerrly]

328i touring for under £3k.

auto 328i sport

of if you want manual there is
[url] manual 328iSE|http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201015356780558/sort/priceasc/usedcars/body-type/estate/transmission/manual/engine-size-cars/2-6l_to_2-9l/model/3_series/make/bmw/page/1/postcode/gl88da/radius/1500?logcode=p
[/url]

[Inigo Montoya]

I'm not so keen on the Touring, it's more than I'd really need most of the time I reckon. Either way, the E36/E46 comparison still stands - the late E36s are obviously very close to the early E46s in age, mileage and price these days.

[edo]

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1641429.htm



BMW E46 330i SE FSH X reg (2000) Low Milage!!
Topaz Blue with Cream leather interior. Auto/Tiptronic. 76k miles.
My car is in beautiful condition for it's age, & regularly gets comments on it's great appearance!
There are a few stone chips on the paint work but it is excellent for the age.
The car's full spec list is below:-

2975cc straight six
2 x recent tyres
18" (MV1) alloys
Full cream leather interior
Air conditioning
Cruise control
DSC traction control
Rear parking sensors
Electric windows front and rear
Electric mirrors
Rain sensors
Head light washer jets
Multi function steering wheel
MOT until Sept 2010
Taxed until Jan 2011
Oil Service due in 6000miles

[Inigo Montoya]

Not really a fan of autos either if I'm honest. Quite useful if you're in traffic I guess, but I'd rather have the advantages of a manual 'box.

[Gallen]

E46 - they drive and feel much more modern and dont look as Chav-like

[shalmaneser]

e36 is more fun to drive though and some came with LSDs (early ones)

I'd go for the e36 personally but it's up to you. 328i's are a steal at the moment and the engine is lovely.

[RobM77]

I've owned two E36s (1993 325i four door and 1998 328i sport coupe) and one E46 (2000 330ci), plus driven plenty of others. Personally I prefer the way the E36 drives, it feels more natural with respect to the controls and of course doesn't have the dreaded drive by wire throttle that the E46 has. I actually sold my E46 330ci and, after three years with just the Elise as my only car, bought an E36 328i because I preferred it to the E46 (and for the record I timed them both 30-70mph through the gears and they were both identical in performance, with the 328i having a slight edge).

However, the E46 has the E36 licked in all other areas - it's more refined, has better engines, generally does a bit more to the gallon and rides slightly better (the handling's debatable, and there's certainly some overlap between the models, but I think the average E46 four door handles better than the average E36 four door. Just my opinion though, and it's a very close thing so everyone will have their own opinion).

Plus of course the E36 is older and will cost more to run.

Overall, if like me you're obsessed with controls and handling, go for an E36. I was happy with lower refinement, less mpg and more expensive running costs (see my profile!!!), because I got a cable throttle, smoother steering and gearchange and a proper clutch. However, if you're not like me then go for the E46, it's generally a better car overall for most people.

[Inigo Montoya]

Hmm, it depends. I value things like progressive handling and decent steering feedback, but I already have something circa 500kgs with unassisted steering for that sort of thing. If I could get it in the daily driver as well without too many compromises I'd obviously like it, but it depends on the overall package. Can you expand a bit upon the handling differences?

Also am I more likely to find issues on a high mileage early E46 or on a last-of-the-line E36 of the same sort of age and mileage?

[Shropshiremike]

I've had the E46 330 and the E36 328. Personally I'd try and drive the E46 328 if you're thinking of the later car and then try a 330 from say 2002 onwards as the steering feel will be a bit different in my experience. I didn't like the early E46 feel but I did like the later type steering ( and the E46 Compact - a couple of which we had for a day ).
The E46 racks are a bit faster ratio than a standard E36 though. The E36 I found quite 'feelsome' but just too 'slow' so I got a Z3 rack.
Our 330 felt a bit faster at continental speeds but not a lot in general motoring over here but then it was 120kg heavier than my E36. Mpg I didn't find any real difference either ( but then I am one of the strange people who imagines thay get 30/31mpg on my B-road commute apparently..... ).
If you do get an E36, try and get a LSD on it. Makes it a lot more fun to drive.
I think user 'Sniff Diesel' would agree with me

[Shropshiremike]

neil_bolton said:

If you want to fit a bike rack, don't consider an E36 coupe.

You can get the roof ones for a coupe/saloon that will go on.

Boot mount ones you will have to for a Saris Bones or Yakima Joe as Thule don't do one but they will mark your boot and you'll probably need a lightboard. If you go on the Yank BMW forums a few people with convertibles run them as well

[Inigo Montoya]

Shropshiremike said:

I've had the E46 330 and the E36 328. Personally I'd try and drive the E46 328 if you're thinking of the later car and then try a 330 from say 2002 onwards as the steering feel will be a bit different in my experience.

Interesting. I've driven an E46 325 Touring briefly and I was really quite impressed with the steering. I can't remember what year it was, but I believe it did have a few tweaks (poly bushes were about the size of it I think) but certainly still the standard rack.

Can anyone tell me more about mechanical issues? Is an average condition last-of-the-line E36 likely to be more or less work than an average early E46? I guess it's a question of whether any improvements in the new design outweigh the teething issues.

[Inigo Montoya]

This all may be a bit academic. I saw a few E46s on Autotrader for E36 money yesterday, but looking on PH it seems that most of them are still comfortably above E36 prices. Maybe the ones down at circa £3k were a bit rough?

[theboymoon]

Shropshiremike said:

neil_bolton said:

If you want to fit a bike rack, don't consider an E36 coupe.

You can get the roof ones for a coupe/saloon that will go on.

Boot mount ones you will have to for a Saris Bones or Yakima Joe as Thule don't do one but they will mark your boot and you'll probably need a lightboard. If you go on the Yank BMW forums a few people with convertibles run them as well

yerp

neil has a roof mounted one so dont know what he's playing at!

PS - BoltON change of plan my end van is up for grabs this weekend if you want it.

[Gallen]

Inigo Montoya said:

Shropshiremike said:

I've had the E46 330 and the E36 328. Personally I'd try and drive the E46 328 if you're thinking of the later car and then try a 330 from say 2002 onwards as the steering feel will be a bit different in my experience.

Interesting. I've driven an E46 325 Touring briefly and I was really quite impressed with the steering. I can't remember what year it was, but I believe it did have a few tweaks (poly bushes were about the size of it I think) but certainly still the standard rack.

Can anyone tell me more about mechanical issues? Is an average condition last-of-the-line E36 likely to be more or less work than an average early E46? I guess it's a question of whether any improvements in the new design outweigh the teething issues.

I've had a lot E36's and and one of the first "S" Plated E46's.

E36 wise, I even remember flicking thorugh Exchange and mart with a hard saved 20k+ budget looking for the right one! Which ever BMW you get you will be happy with. I had many a good hoon in my E36's but that's years ago now

In my opinion, as an every day car they are incomparable to the E46 - the latter being far superior. The E36 feels archaic in comparison.

Whilst the 6 pot engines are smooth the overall drive is comparitively creaky and inferior. The interior trim feels cheap and looks very dated.

On the E46, DSC was available on most (if not all) models.

When the E36 was first launched it was a gorgeous looking car. Unfortunately the look was cheapened by tacky add ons fitted by the wrong sort of owners to detrement of the E36's image. As a result, I feel that - unfortunately - E36's look like an ultimate chav-mobile. I am sure one day their status will return to classic, as currently enjoyed by the E30.

...Just see, touch and drive both.

I have nothing against them, but am not a fan of their image.

That said I wouldn't be turning down a clean and original M3 3.2 Evo.

E36 - if it's the 2.8 engine I think early on they had Nikasil Bore issues (I suspect MOST of these will have raised their heads by now). Also on the 6's especially, check for Head Gasket issues. Look for FSH as they were very easy to clock and I wouldnt touch one with good mooney without a comprehensive history, unless there was good reason. keep your eye out for poorly repaired body damage, and HPi it. Rust is also now an issue on these, believe it or not!

Good luck.

[Inigo Montoya]

At what point does rust go from being a cosmetic issue to a structural/MOT problem on these? Is some to be expected or can you find a completely clean example for sensible money?

[bodhi]

I'm currently running an E46 320Cd and have recently purchased an E36 328i Saloon to compliment it (i.e the old dear wants the E46 back ) and I must admit, after a week or so in the 328i, I really dislike going back to the 320 - and only a small portion of this is the paraffin stove under the bonnet. The E46 feels far more remote than the '36, and whilst the E46 interior is much nicer, the E36 seems much nicer to drive.

The 328i SE I found was on an N-plate, had 99k miles and FBMWSH. Has the odd spot of rust but nothing too worrying, and it cost me 1500 quid. Double that budget and you could get an absolute peach.