buying a lotus7 type kit car
Discussion
hi guys,
my first time on here. been researching the purchase of a lotus 7 type kit for some time now. looking to buy a pre owned car for 2 reasons. firstly i simply dont have the time to build one and secondly i am no way near skilled enough to go it alone, i have narrowed my choice down to a few favourites, the mk indy, raw striker, mnr vortex, tiger,and the mac 1....in no particular order, still undecided which route to take out of either bike or car engine apart from the fact i dont want a pinto engine....would prefer something more modern...just personal preference....anyone give me any pointers and sites recommended to use in my search ...would be grateful of any expert help...thanks...gary
my first time on here. been researching the purchase of a lotus 7 type kit for some time now. looking to buy a pre owned car for 2 reasons. firstly i simply dont have the time to build one and secondly i am no way near skilled enough to go it alone, i have narrowed my choice down to a few favourites, the mk indy, raw striker, mnr vortex, tiger,and the mac 1....in no particular order, still undecided which route to take out of either bike or car engine apart from the fact i dont want a pinto engine....would prefer something more modern...just personal preference....anyone give me any pointers and sites recommended to use in my search ...would be grateful of any expert help...thanks...gary
I'm in the same position. Have a lump of cash burning a hole and need to find the right car.
I think I need to sit in a few to see how they fit.
Considering a Westfield SEiW or a MK Indy.
My car will go alongside my motorbike and the idea is to have something of similar performance, that I can take the mrs out for the day in, country houses picnics etc that we couldn't do on the bike. Also I'm a manufacturing engineer so want something to tinker with. I can buy a car with a lower spec and upgrade to my taste. Have a lot of facilities available at work CNC lathes, water cutter, machining centres etc so can design & make some trick bits myself.
So Definately a car engine because I imagine a BEC to be a bit frenetic.
I also wanted a modern engine but it seems that you can get 160bhp out of a pinto reliably so seems viable. I haven't considered mpg though.
I think I need to sit in a few to see how they fit.
Considering a Westfield SEiW or a MK Indy.
My car will go alongside my motorbike and the idea is to have something of similar performance, that I can take the mrs out for the day in, country houses picnics etc that we couldn't do on the bike. Also I'm a manufacturing engineer so want something to tinker with. I can buy a car with a lower spec and upgrade to my taste. Have a lot of facilities available at work CNC lathes, water cutter, machining centres etc so can design & make some trick bits myself.
So Definately a car engine because I imagine a BEC to be a bit frenetic.
I also wanted a modern engine but it seems that you can get 160bhp out of a pinto reliably so seems viable. I haven't considered mpg though.
From what I remember when I was looking for mine - everyone I spoke to said to avoid the Pinto, mainly as it is a lot heavier. Plus you will get more power for less money with a Zetec.
I looked at Tigers, but it seemed most of them out there are the Supercat model, which uses the whole rear subframe and suspension of the Sierra, which makes them a bit heavier. I ended up with a Westfield, but liked the look of the MK Indy and MNR Vortex too.
I looked at Tigers, but it seemed most of them out there are the Supercat model, which uses the whole rear subframe and suspension of the Sierra, which makes them a bit heavier. I ended up with a Westfield, but liked the look of the MK Indy and MNR Vortex too.
Things to consider will include how much room is inside, Indys are a lot bigger than early Westfields, for instance. Your wife might prefer a windsreen to wearing a helmet (or maybe she wouldn't). If you are going on picnics you will want some storage room and not all kits offer that (the Phoenix has more than many).
You need to go and look at some cars and see if there is anything that attracts you. How well built it is will usually matter more than which make the kit is. Does it have any documentation? If you need a new clutch will you know what type to get, is there a wiring diagram, where does that odd black wire go, why doesn't the number plate lamp work?
Enginewise, the pinto is a good choice in a second hand car, drive it til you are used to it and want soemthing better, then change it for a zetec (exhaust on the same side, same gearbox, might even be able to use the carbs if it's a pair of 45s)
You need to go and look at some cars and see if there is anything that attracts you. How well built it is will usually matter more than which make the kit is. Does it have any documentation? If you need a new clutch will you know what type to get, is there a wiring diagram, where does that odd black wire go, why doesn't the number plate lamp work?
Enginewise, the pinto is a good choice in a second hand car, drive it til you are used to it and want soemthing better, then change it for a zetec (exhaust on the same side, same gearbox, might even be able to use the carbs if it's a pair of 45s)
well seems the general census is to avoid the pinto....not cos of reliability issues...merely weight etc....i get the feeling from most people the bike engines offer manic performance but are tiresome on journeys of any length....i have provisionally applied for and been accepted for a loan but until i find the right car am having to wait.....knowing which route to take is the first problem.....then its a matter of sticking to it i guess and not getting the kid in a sweetshop syndrome and being tempted by anything else...i sat in a few at stoneleigh which was my 3rd trip to the show....although i never never driven a kit car and i guess anything will seem quick compared to my everyday car (although i have owned a few sports bikes) the raw striker is now out with a 20valve 1.6 litre engine which ticks all my boxes but i cant stretch to a loan of that amount. i am aiming for about 8k i think.....you have to draw the line somewhere...the like sof westfield and caterham being the premier type of 7 variant obviously command far deeper pockets..... i sat in the mac 1 a tiger a raw striker but not the mnr.....all very similar....keep watching my kit car dvd.....now its just abouty tracking down the right car and taking the plunge i guess
Gary, are any of the manufacturers you're looking at based near you? While I am not looking at a 7 for the moment, I would probably go to have a good look at an MK first as they're based locally to me.
I like the Pinto as car engine and I'm sure is fine in a 7 to a point but I'd agree to looking at more modern engines, especially if you can afford one - which with £8k to spend I'd say you can.
I like the Pinto as car engine and I'm sure is fine in a 7 to a point but I'd agree to looking at more modern engines, especially if you can afford one - which with £8k to spend I'd say you can.
Glade said:
Interesting about the weight of a pinto.
Another one for the list!
I'm not sure what you mean by that, does that mean the Pinto is out or in. If the former, you should reconsider. They can be good engines, and the extra weight, not that there's a lot of it, won't matter anything like as much as you might think. Another one for the list!
And as I said earlier, it can always be changed quite easily for a Zetec if and when.
Buying a car with a Pinto in it will probably mean a decently lower price too.
singlecoil said:
Enginewise, the pinto is a good choice in a second hand car, drive it til you are used to it and want soemthing better, then change it for a zetec (exhaust on the same side, same gearbox, might even be able to use the carbs if it's a pair of 45s)
Sorry old bean,pinto's are on the other side.It`s much cheaper to buy the right car the first time in my experience.
I've spent around £2500 on my westy getting it to my spec.
garysenter said:
well seems the general census is to avoid the pinto....not cos of reliability issues...merely weight etc....i get the feeling from most people the bike engines offer manic performance but are tiresome on journeys of any length....i have provisionally applied for and been accepted for a loan but until i find the right car am having to wait.....knowing which route to take is the first problem.....then its a matter of sticking to it i guess and not getting the kid in a sweetshop syndrome and being tempted by anything else...i sat in a few at stoneleigh which was my 3rd trip to the show....although i never never driven a kit car and i guess anything will seem quick compared to my everyday car (although i have owned a few sports bikes) the raw striker is now out with a 20valve 1.6 litre engine which ticks all my boxes but i cant stretch to a loan of that amount. i am aiming for about 8k i think.....you have to draw the line somewhere...the like sof westfield and caterham being the premier type of 7 variant obviously command far deeper pockets..... i sat in the mac 1 a tiger a raw striker but not the mnr.....all very similar....keep watching my kit car dvd.....now its just abouty tracking down the right car and taking the plunge i guess
westfield and caterham are not the premier type of 7 anymore. well maybe 15 years ago. they make nice cars but are expensive not worth any more than other 7 type cars.h4muf said:
singlecoil said:
Enginewise, the pinto is a good choice in a second hand car, drive it til you are used to it and want soemthing better, then change it for a zetec (exhaust on the same side, same gearbox, might even be able to use the carbs if it's a pair of 45s)
Sorry old bean,pinto's are on the other side.It`s much cheaper to buy the right car the first time in my experience.
I've spent around £2500 on my westy getting it to my spec.
jason61c said:
westfield and caterham ....are expensive not worth any more than other 7 type cars.
I'm not convinced of that. You MIGHT argue that they are not worth the premium they ask, but I've not seen a 'seven' at a show that's as nicely made as a Caterham, certainly. The attention to detail is better. Having said that I'm a big fan of many of the copies.jason61c said:
They're both copies! You've got to remember that it comes down to the person putting it together. Westfields are very simple, almost too simple! In terms of dynamics I mean that they are not the best.
Like all these cars it depends on who builds them, to what specification and how good the setup is. Comparing apples with apples it certainly isn't.I'm not going to get dragged into the "my kit's better than yours" argument. However, do get yourselves over to the Westfield Sports Car Club boardroom for more advice than you can shake a stick at, Caterham owners are also welcome but do come in for some stick occasionally.
As for the boat anchor or Pinto as it is more commonly known, I had one in my first Westfield and the car was still great fun. Don't always take the advice as gospel, I'd actually test the car and see how you get on. If a Pinto engined car comes up and is within budget then give it a go see how you like it. The most important thing with any kit car is the build quality, you can have the best kit in the world but if it's nailed together by someone who thinks a spanner and hammer are interchangeable it won't be as good as a poor kit put together by a meticulous engineer type.
As for the boat anchor or Pinto as it is more commonly known, I had one in my first Westfield and the car was still great fun. Don't always take the advice as gospel, I'd actually test the car and see how you get on. If a Pinto engined car comes up and is within budget then give it a go see how you like it. The most important thing with any kit car is the build quality, you can have the best kit in the world but if it's nailed together by someone who thinks a spanner and hammer are interchangeable it won't be as good as a poor kit put together by a meticulous engineer type.
Ferg said:
jason61c said:
They're both copies! You've got to remember that it comes down to the person putting it together.
Caterham can claim lineage, which is good enough for me. It ISN'T all down to who puts it together. I'm talking about the quality of the kit.There are two many variables to answer your question. . .
Are you more interested in performance, safety, comfort or looks?
Performance (straight line) I think that the MK Indy comes in quite light, as far as cornering goes, I've heard good things about the MNR chassis and the Mac 1 looked well put together at the Stoneleigh show, nothing wrong with the Indy either.
If safety is your priority, there is no comeptition, the Quantum Xtreme takes it hands down with its monocoque chassis rather than spaceframe (if you can get past the looks). It is also very well engineered with horizontal inboard front coilovers and a bespoke rear suspension set up. It is about 100kg heavier than others though so if all out performance is your aim maybe something else.
Comfort, depends on your height, balast and size of your arse!!!!
Looks - personal peference. I think that the Dax Rush is the best looking, just looks meaner than the others, the Raw Striker's windscreen isn't to my taste, given your shortlist purely on looks the MK Indy.
I still can't decide what to do with my car, everytime I make a decision to change it for something more suitable for track day driving, I take it out on the road and change my mind!! Bloody cars!
Are you more interested in performance, safety, comfort or looks?
Performance (straight line) I think that the MK Indy comes in quite light, as far as cornering goes, I've heard good things about the MNR chassis and the Mac 1 looked well put together at the Stoneleigh show, nothing wrong with the Indy either.
If safety is your priority, there is no comeptition, the Quantum Xtreme takes it hands down with its monocoque chassis rather than spaceframe (if you can get past the looks). It is also very well engineered with horizontal inboard front coilovers and a bespoke rear suspension set up. It is about 100kg heavier than others though so if all out performance is your aim maybe something else.
Comfort, depends on your height, balast and size of your arse!!!!
Looks - personal peference. I think that the Dax Rush is the best looking, just looks meaner than the others, the Raw Striker's windscreen isn't to my taste, given your shortlist purely on looks the MK Indy.
I still can't decide what to do with my car, everytime I make a decision to change it for something more suitable for track day driving, I take it out on the road and change my mind!! Bloody cars!
hi guys....sorry i been at work all day and only just got time to come online and look for replies....well you kit car guys sure are a passionate bunch with regards to your cars.....various opinions which is good cos it gives me a broad outlook. as we all must surely agree though we really are spoilt for choice. we all have different needs and tastes and what a wonderful problem for us guys to have to deliberate over...i respect everybodies opinions and in truth you are all right. there is the quality issue....some robin hoods i have seen have been truly awful and yet the odd one or 2 have looked properly pampered(although still not what i want from a 7) i am starting to lean towards a car engined 7 i think.....looks wise a few models "do it" for me....but i still think i need a more modern powerplant than the old pinto....a good solid reliable engine for sure (i have owned a few sierras in my time)but i want performance more than i think the pinto can offer and to the guy who mentioned the extra weight not making much difference i know what you are saying...the quantum i think has more of a "proper car" look. with boot and even a nice dash lol....but they are rather big.....dont get me wrong if a nice enough one came along with a decent power plant i would be tempted....and yes the r1ot i have read is a complete animal.....the mk midi i think it is called has a similar shortened rear end kind of look to it.....if we are gonna start drifting onto other cars then i have to mention i have even looked at the fury....but everytime i have to say to myself....no gary stick to your first love....the car you have waited years for...the 7......i plan to keep this car for a very long time so its gotta be right.....decisions decisions eh fellas ???
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