Fiat Stilo diesel estate. Would I be mad to consider?
Discussion
A few years ago I had the abarth version, and loved it.
Not the best car on the road, granted, but quick, fun and cost very little.
With priorities firmly on economy now, and needing space, would I be mental to consider the estate.
Granted it's not at all desirable, but for the price-£3k is it the best I can manage? A few I have seen have much lower mileage than golfs, focus etc. Has anyone here run one for a while? What can I expect realitically mpg wise? Will this be high as it will spend most of it's time on an RAC truck?
Any pointers (as always) appreciated.
Or does anyone want to convince me I'm better off in a Volvo v40
Not the best car on the road, granted, but quick, fun and cost very little.
With priorities firmly on economy now, and needing space, would I be mental to consider the estate.
Granted it's not at all desirable, but for the price-£3k is it the best I can manage? A few I have seen have much lower mileage than golfs, focus etc. Has anyone here run one for a while? What can I expect realitically mpg wise? Will this be high as it will spend most of it's time on an RAC truck?
Any pointers (as always) appreciated.
Or does anyone want to convince me I'm better off in a Volvo v40
Have run a JTD Stilo but not an Estate.
The early Stilos have good spec (FIAT got meaner as time passes). However I would avoid an early Stilo they have too many issues.
All of the early cars (can be ID'd but the different rear lights - though perhaps not on the estate, not sure) tend to suffer from the following:
Springs snap - very common and so bad that FIAT have an official recall. Unfortunately this isn't any help as it's a catching device to stop the broken spring from piercing the tyre. Best bet is to replace the springs with quality after market items. Eibachs are good and improve the sproingy handling. If you're doing so the Bilstein dampers would be worth buying at the same time. The kit was originally sold as the Schumacher GP Kit (along with 18" wheels) from FIAT but you'd be cheaper to pick it up from other sources (as the standard Eibach springs/Bilstein dampers for diesel/Abarth Stilo).
Airbag warning light - the connectors under the driver/passenger seat are crap. If you adjust the seat too much the connectors register a dodgy connection and illuminate the airbag warning lamp. If you clean up the connectors (or even just wiggle them sometimes!) the 'problem' goes. NB the connectors are bright orange.
Overboost valve - it sits under the battery and gets covered in crap and eventually fails (I suspect it's the hoses more than the valve). Replacement valve is about £80. I went through 2 in about two years (of course just outside the warranty period both times!). The new owner tells me it failed for him too. The fix is to reposition the valve. Problem is three of the four FIAT dealers I used were incompetent and knew nothing about the car (and lied through their teeth about it too). Surprising given the Stilo (supposedly) being a common car.
Front lower suspension arms - the bushes go quite quickly so worth checking for slop if they've not been done in the last year or two. Fairly cheap part and worthwhile doing the springs/dampers at the same time too if not already done.
Radio - tend to fail (just the receiver the CD/cassette bit continues to work). Can be repaired at fairly high cost. I just put in a dash converter thing (£15 odd) and an after-market radio. If you had the Connect+ satnav that might be worth fixing but the stock radio isn't that good anyway.
ABS sensor type gremlins - not 100% sure on the cause/cure but can cause the ABS and/or traction control to fail. Bit like a laptop if you switch it on and off it usually goes away.
General electrical gremlins - don't think FIAT got the CANBUS system quite right on the early as it has glitches which aren't terminal but do result in a beep, beep, beep fault coming up. When mixed with the above items it's not uncommon to get a beep, beep, beep every time you start the car! They also seem to go through light-bulbs a lot. Don't know why and the head-lights are a bugger to change until you get the knack.
Brakes/throttle/clutch - Very sensitive, with too much assistance. Too much so IMHO. However I think that this is pretty much de rigur in this sector nowadays. Clutch takes some getting used to.
Apparently only FIAT can reset the service counter thing. Given my experience of FIAT dealers I would have been better off doing the job myself or getting a five year old with ADHD to do it.
Good points:
Engine - The JTD is brilliant. with the possible exception of the BMW/Merc FIAT make the best four cylinder diesels. They rev nicely (feel more like a torquey N/A petrol than a diesel) and go well. Sound good for a diesel too. MPG is excellent. I used to average 53mpg before chipping and 55mpg after. I also used to use all the performance. On one economy run (done late at night over mostly B and A roads) I managed an average of 93mpg over 24 miles, door to door. I suspect I could have improved that if I'd bothered again. Pointless but it impressed me.
Interior - Very nicely finished inside. Styling is obviously subjective but the quality of materials is a cut above. I had a mk5 Gold 1.9 for a week at the same time and (styling aside) the interior wasn't a patch on the FIAT. Much harder nastier plastics. Less cubby space (and no secret refrigerated 2nd glove compartment). The Stilo SEATs are good too. Squashy but they grip you well. I found that they needed adjustment to get right but once done were good.
Build quality - Doors thunk nicely. Car didn't squeak or rattle and was quite refined at speed.
Sum up - If FIAT had developed the car properly (see above) and fitting proper electrics then it would have been cracking car and a proper Golf competitor. I would avoid an early car like the plague (mine was first year of production) as the later cars are (apparently) better. 8v JTD (115) is a good engine though if you like to get places quickly the 16v JTD (150) is better. Both are certainly worth chipping (Celtic Tuning did mine) as both economy, performance and driveability are improved. If your local FIAT garage (or even better a specialist who can deal with Stilos) is good then it would be worth a shout given how cheap they are. If not then get your barge poles out!
NB FIAT Forum is very useful - if only the FIAT techs on there worked in a FIAT dealer near me!
The early Stilos have good spec (FIAT got meaner as time passes). However I would avoid an early Stilo they have too many issues.
All of the early cars (can be ID'd but the different rear lights - though perhaps not on the estate, not sure) tend to suffer from the following:
Springs snap - very common and so bad that FIAT have an official recall. Unfortunately this isn't any help as it's a catching device to stop the broken spring from piercing the tyre. Best bet is to replace the springs with quality after market items. Eibachs are good and improve the sproingy handling. If you're doing so the Bilstein dampers would be worth buying at the same time. The kit was originally sold as the Schumacher GP Kit (along with 18" wheels) from FIAT but you'd be cheaper to pick it up from other sources (as the standard Eibach springs/Bilstein dampers for diesel/Abarth Stilo).
Airbag warning light - the connectors under the driver/passenger seat are crap. If you adjust the seat too much the connectors register a dodgy connection and illuminate the airbag warning lamp. If you clean up the connectors (or even just wiggle them sometimes!) the 'problem' goes. NB the connectors are bright orange.
Overboost valve - it sits under the battery and gets covered in crap and eventually fails (I suspect it's the hoses more than the valve). Replacement valve is about £80. I went through 2 in about two years (of course just outside the warranty period both times!). The new owner tells me it failed for him too. The fix is to reposition the valve. Problem is three of the four FIAT dealers I used were incompetent and knew nothing about the car (and lied through their teeth about it too). Surprising given the Stilo (supposedly) being a common car.
Front lower suspension arms - the bushes go quite quickly so worth checking for slop if they've not been done in the last year or two. Fairly cheap part and worthwhile doing the springs/dampers at the same time too if not already done.
Radio - tend to fail (just the receiver the CD/cassette bit continues to work). Can be repaired at fairly high cost. I just put in a dash converter thing (£15 odd) and an after-market radio. If you had the Connect+ satnav that might be worth fixing but the stock radio isn't that good anyway.
ABS sensor type gremlins - not 100% sure on the cause/cure but can cause the ABS and/or traction control to fail. Bit like a laptop if you switch it on and off it usually goes away.
General electrical gremlins - don't think FIAT got the CANBUS system quite right on the early as it has glitches which aren't terminal but do result in a beep, beep, beep fault coming up. When mixed with the above items it's not uncommon to get a beep, beep, beep every time you start the car! They also seem to go through light-bulbs a lot. Don't know why and the head-lights are a bugger to change until you get the knack.
Brakes/throttle/clutch - Very sensitive, with too much assistance. Too much so IMHO. However I think that this is pretty much de rigur in this sector nowadays. Clutch takes some getting used to.
Apparently only FIAT can reset the service counter thing. Given my experience of FIAT dealers I would have been better off doing the job myself or getting a five year old with ADHD to do it.
Good points:
Engine - The JTD is brilliant. with the possible exception of the BMW/Merc FIAT make the best four cylinder diesels. They rev nicely (feel more like a torquey N/A petrol than a diesel) and go well. Sound good for a diesel too. MPG is excellent. I used to average 53mpg before chipping and 55mpg after. I also used to use all the performance. On one economy run (done late at night over mostly B and A roads) I managed an average of 93mpg over 24 miles, door to door. I suspect I could have improved that if I'd bothered again. Pointless but it impressed me.
Interior - Very nicely finished inside. Styling is obviously subjective but the quality of materials is a cut above. I had a mk5 Gold 1.9 for a week at the same time and (styling aside) the interior wasn't a patch on the FIAT. Much harder nastier plastics. Less cubby space (and no secret refrigerated 2nd glove compartment). The Stilo SEATs are good too. Squashy but they grip you well. I found that they needed adjustment to get right but once done were good.
Build quality - Doors thunk nicely. Car didn't squeak or rattle and was quite refined at speed.
Sum up - If FIAT had developed the car properly (see above) and fitting proper electrics then it would have been cracking car and a proper Golf competitor. I would avoid an early car like the plague (mine was first year of production) as the later cars are (apparently) better. 8v JTD (115) is a good engine though if you like to get places quickly the 16v JTD (150) is better. Both are certainly worth chipping (Celtic Tuning did mine) as both economy, performance and driveability are improved. If your local FIAT garage (or even better a specialist who can deal with Stilos) is good then it would be worth a shout given how cheap they are. If not then get your barge poles out!
NB FIAT Forum is very useful - if only the FIAT techs on there worked in a FIAT dealer near me!
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