what rights have i got?
Discussion
Im wondering if anyone can give me some advice. I have recently bought a mini cooper s ( in the last 4 weeks) from a trader specializing in minis.
Within 2 weeks i noticed things that didnt feel right so I decided to put it into BMW main dealer for a routine maintenance check. An hour later and i was told that the front bushes were shot and needed replacement, the oil sump had a leak and needed replacement, the brakes and discs needed replacement. there is also a squeak that comes from the clutch pedal when it is depressed, i thought it was a squeaky pedal but after some parts have been replaced, it is still doing it and it now seems the noise is coming from the engine area.
So, i contacted the trader, who came took the car away and had it for a week. He says the car is under a supposed warranty but i am now thinking differently. He fixed the brakes only with an agreement that i paid him half the cost towards fixing them (this is where the warranty comes into question) but said his mechanic said the bushes were only slightly worn and the sump had a 'few loose bolts' It had past an mot 2 months earlier.
I took the car back from him, but it was still making noises from suspension so i took it to another independent engineer who showed me with the car up on the ramp that the bushes are split, the sump is still leaking and that he doesnt know what the noise is from the clutch without further investigation.
I then phoned the trader up to report this, at which point he went ballistic at me down the phone for 10 mins, refusing to do anymore work on the car. Ive contacted him by letter that i want the repairs done or a refund of all the monies given him. I am awaiting a reply.
My whole point in all this is what rights do i have? after reading citizens advice documents i can ask for a refund from this guy but is this correct? He denies that there is anything wrong with it now and that basically BMW are trying it on to make money, which is fair enough but when someone else is saying the same thing that these things are broken you cant really keep denying it.
Is it worth me doing another MOT? or getting an aa inspection done? i dont want this to go to court but as this guy has basically said to p*** off what can i now do? i dont want to fork out for a car that ive had 4 weeks with all these faults.
Within 2 weeks i noticed things that didnt feel right so I decided to put it into BMW main dealer for a routine maintenance check. An hour later and i was told that the front bushes were shot and needed replacement, the oil sump had a leak and needed replacement, the brakes and discs needed replacement. there is also a squeak that comes from the clutch pedal when it is depressed, i thought it was a squeaky pedal but after some parts have been replaced, it is still doing it and it now seems the noise is coming from the engine area.
So, i contacted the trader, who came took the car away and had it for a week. He says the car is under a supposed warranty but i am now thinking differently. He fixed the brakes only with an agreement that i paid him half the cost towards fixing them (this is where the warranty comes into question) but said his mechanic said the bushes were only slightly worn and the sump had a 'few loose bolts' It had past an mot 2 months earlier.
I took the car back from him, but it was still making noises from suspension so i took it to another independent engineer who showed me with the car up on the ramp that the bushes are split, the sump is still leaking and that he doesnt know what the noise is from the clutch without further investigation.
I then phoned the trader up to report this, at which point he went ballistic at me down the phone for 10 mins, refusing to do anymore work on the car. Ive contacted him by letter that i want the repairs done or a refund of all the monies given him. I am awaiting a reply.
My whole point in all this is what rights do i have? after reading citizens advice documents i can ask for a refund from this guy but is this correct? He denies that there is anything wrong with it now and that basically BMW are trying it on to make money, which is fair enough but when someone else is saying the same thing that these things are broken you cant really keep denying it.
Is it worth me doing another MOT? or getting an aa inspection done? i dont want this to go to court but as this guy has basically said to p*** off what can i now do? i dont want to fork out for a car that ive had 4 weeks with all these faults.
As far as I'm aware, as it is a trader, he must sell the car as fit for purpose.
With so much work that needs to be done on it, you may be able to argue that it isn't.
You need legal advice about this, so contact Citizens Advice and if they can't help there are independant legal advisers who offer services for free. I used to work for Co-op Legal and they offered this.
Also Trading Standards would be worth contacting. Also, if you had the car on finance, the finance company can add a lot of persuasive weight to your arguement, depending on the circumstances.
Best of luck mate, I think you will be able to get him for the repair costs...doubt if you will be able to get all your money back though.
ETA: Hello btw!
With so much work that needs to be done on it, you may be able to argue that it isn't.
You need legal advice about this, so contact Citizens Advice and if they can't help there are independant legal advisers who offer services for free. I used to work for Co-op Legal and they offered this.
Also Trading Standards would be worth contacting. Also, if you had the car on finance, the finance company can add a lot of persuasive weight to your arguement, depending on the circumstances.
Best of luck mate, I think you will be able to get him for the repair costs...doubt if you will be able to get all your money back though.
ETA: Hello btw!
Edited by The Hitman on Thursday 20th May 23:44
Right, the sump will be the sump gasket, common as buggery on modified a modified 'S, but not unheard of on a standard one, the bolts can't be loose on the sump as they also hold the air conditioning on etc.
But the bushes are fairly common, most people put in polyurethane bushes and as for the brakes, that's just a wear and tear item, not a fault.
But the bushes are fairly common, most people put in polyurethane bushes and as for the brakes, that's just a wear and tear item, not a fault.
Silent1 said:
Right, the sump will be the sump gasket, common as buggery on modified a modified 'S, but not unheard of on a standard one, the bolts can't be loose on the sump as they also hold the air conditioning on etc.
But the bushes are fairly common, most people put in polyurethane bushes and as for the brakes, that's just a wear and tear item, not a fault.
This isn't a private sale, so not "sold as seen"But the bushes are fairly common, most people put in polyurethane bushes and as for the brakes, that's just a wear and tear item, not a fault.
If a car needs maintainance and is sold by a Trader, as far as I'm aware, this can only be done if he has informed the buyer and they accept the car regardless. (This is by no means a diffinitive answer, but makes sense to my understanding of a buyers rights)
The Hitman said:
Silent1 said:
Right, the sump will be the sump gasket, common as buggery on modified a modified 'S, but not unheard of on a standard one, the bolts can't be loose on the sump as they also hold the air conditioning on etc.
But the bushes are fairly common, most people put in polyurethane bushes and as for the brakes, that's just a wear and tear item, not a fault.
This isn't a private sale, so not "sold as seen"But the bushes are fairly common, most people put in polyurethane bushes and as for the brakes, that's just a wear and tear item, not a fault.
If a car needs maintainance and is sold by a Trader, as far as I'm aware, this can only be done if he has informed the buyer and they accept the car regardless. (This is by no means a diffinitive answer, but makes sense to my understanding of a buyers rights)
As he is a trader then, yes, he will be liable to pay for some of the repairs. The only problem lies with prooving that you did not split the bushes or that they did not go AFTER you brought the car. Same with the other items really.
How soon after buying the car did you get the feeling things were not right and if straight away why were they not apparent on the test drive?
How soon after buying the car did you get the feeling things were not right and if straight away why were they not apparent on the test drive?
I have been in a similar situation. First you need to write to him. If you get nowhere, tell him you are going to get it fixed. Then send him the bill. Whereupon He will probably ignore you or refer you to Lawgistics or similar. So then you have to take him to the small claims court.
You could ask him for the warranty paperwork but I would imagine none of the faults will be covered.
Plan B is wait till the brakes wear out then fix them. Get the oil leak and bushes fixed now. Probably the easiest option in my opinion. We are not looking at a fortune and you know they have been done if common faults.
Just buy privately in future, or from a dealer that has been recommended.
You could ask him for the warranty paperwork but I would imagine none of the faults will be covered.
Plan B is wait till the brakes wear out then fix them. Get the oil leak and bushes fixed now. Probably the easiest option in my opinion. We are not looking at a fortune and you know they have been done if common faults.
Just buy privately in future, or from a dealer that has been recommended.
Do you have a warranty in writing? If not don't waste your time with it all.
Trading standards won't be helpful and they'll explain you've bought a second hand car and not a new one.
The car has just passed an MOT test 2 months ago. Buying from a trader is not the same as a main dealer.
They sound like relatively simple jobs so don't worry to much.
How old is the car and how much was it?
Trading standards won't be helpful and they'll explain you've bought a second hand car and not a new one.
The car has just passed an MOT test 2 months ago. Buying from a trader is not the same as a main dealer.
They sound like relatively simple jobs so don't worry to much.
How old is the car and how much was it?
hello again
thank you for your replies
il answer all your comments if i can.
From what i have read from the CAB i am within my rights to ask for a full refund because its a good... and like HITMAN said its not fit for its purpose, and because it is such a short time from buying the car. Someone asked how long have I had it? I have had the car 4 weeks. I noticed the problems 7 days after buying it. I took it to BMW 10 days after buying it. It went back to the trader 2 days after that and i received it back 5 days after he took it. SO if you can understand that it means ive kept on top of this situation inside 2 weeks of purchasing the vehicle.
The brakes have been replaced, he did this when he took the car back, but i had to pay 150 quid towards the replacement of them. The discs and pads were worn, the 4 discs had corrosion 2 inches from the top of the disc on all 4 brakes. I could put my finger in the brakes and chip bits of rust off them.
My dispute here at the moment is that he denies these faults exist, that myself and BMW are making it up, plus the independent engineer that has since seen the car in the past 2 days. I dont feel i should have to pay for faults that were clearly on the car in the first place. He is not willing to listen anymore and wont accept an AA report either.
I found out on the gov website that i could check the cars MOT history, I found that the trader put this car in the garage on the 8th March and it failed due to a malfunctioning power steering. It went back in on the 16th March and then passed its MOT. I didnt buy the car from this guy until 12th April so it sat for one month or more doing nothing. So this all recent stuff.
Someone asked why did i not realise this when i bought the thing? he let me drive it for 10 mins, it felt ok on the roads he took me on to drive it, no bumps or sleeping poilcemen. I didnt notice the squeaky noise from suspension until went over a speed hump at a slow pace back at home. The sump i knew nothing of until BMW pointed it out. I have it in writing from this guys mechanic that the sump bolts were loose and needed tightening and that there is slight wear in the suspension, that they are not broken. SO surely the mechanic guy he used is at fault here too?
The age of the car is 05, its done 33k and has had 1 owner before me. Is it normal for this age of car to have this stuff broken already? I am asking all this because i am a girly, not a guy and so i dont know alot about motor cars, this is why i was hoping someone on here might be able to offer advice.
I forgot to add, i have written to him and am waiting for a reply. I still need to find out what this squeaky noise coming from the engine is when i press the clutch pedal down. any ideas on that anyone??
thank you for your replies
il answer all your comments if i can.
From what i have read from the CAB i am within my rights to ask for a full refund because its a good... and like HITMAN said its not fit for its purpose, and because it is such a short time from buying the car. Someone asked how long have I had it? I have had the car 4 weeks. I noticed the problems 7 days after buying it. I took it to BMW 10 days after buying it. It went back to the trader 2 days after that and i received it back 5 days after he took it. SO if you can understand that it means ive kept on top of this situation inside 2 weeks of purchasing the vehicle.
The brakes have been replaced, he did this when he took the car back, but i had to pay 150 quid towards the replacement of them. The discs and pads were worn, the 4 discs had corrosion 2 inches from the top of the disc on all 4 brakes. I could put my finger in the brakes and chip bits of rust off them.
My dispute here at the moment is that he denies these faults exist, that myself and BMW are making it up, plus the independent engineer that has since seen the car in the past 2 days. I dont feel i should have to pay for faults that were clearly on the car in the first place. He is not willing to listen anymore and wont accept an AA report either.
I found out on the gov website that i could check the cars MOT history, I found that the trader put this car in the garage on the 8th March and it failed due to a malfunctioning power steering. It went back in on the 16th March and then passed its MOT. I didnt buy the car from this guy until 12th April so it sat for one month or more doing nothing. So this all recent stuff.
Someone asked why did i not realise this when i bought the thing? he let me drive it for 10 mins, it felt ok on the roads he took me on to drive it, no bumps or sleeping poilcemen. I didnt notice the squeaky noise from suspension until went over a speed hump at a slow pace back at home. The sump i knew nothing of until BMW pointed it out. I have it in writing from this guys mechanic that the sump bolts were loose and needed tightening and that there is slight wear in the suspension, that they are not broken. SO surely the mechanic guy he used is at fault here too?
The age of the car is 05, its done 33k and has had 1 owner before me. Is it normal for this age of car to have this stuff broken already? I am asking all this because i am a girly, not a guy and so i dont know alot about motor cars, this is why i was hoping someone on here might be able to offer advice.
I forgot to add, i have written to him and am waiting for a reply. I still need to find out what this squeaky noise coming from the engine is when i press the clutch pedal down. any ideas on that anyone??
Edited by cheesedoff on Friday 21st May 06:58
Get a full refund - They should honour you. I had a 4 yr old Mondeo that had the cat fail a week after buying. Contacted dealer, very evasive etc.
However, he did offer me a refund.
Didn't take it as fundamentally, I liked the car. Car turned into a bit of a money pit, so on reflection, should have taken him up on the refund.
However, he did offer me a refund.
Didn't take it as fundamentally, I liked the car. Car turned into a bit of a money pit, so on reflection, should have taken him up on the refund.
Edited by Hell27 on Friday 21st May 07:26
Ok first thing I would do is remember you have bought a used car not a new one....
Secondly Mini main agent will have reported work needing doing that doesnt. (robbing *****)
Split bushes, leaking sump ect, back to guy you bought it from, he has to sort that out for you under the SOGA.
Im glad someone else thinks i should go for the refund... its not like this happened 6 months after having the car this is in a few short weeks. I am going to BMW today to see if they can discover what this noise is with the squeaking.
I dont know what to do about the fact this guy wont talk to me anymore.... do i go to a solicitor? I will try my CAB again but to be honest they just give you leaflets to read.
i have a major headache!!
I dont know what to do about the fact this guy wont talk to me anymore.... do i go to a solicitor? I will try my CAB again but to be honest they just give you leaflets to read.
i have a major headache!!
yes i am fully aware that the car is second hand but surely this doesnt excuse him to sell it in this condition otherwise everyone would sell their cars in any old state. surely he has some obligation to get this stuff repaired? why should i fork out another 500 quid to get this stuff fixed when ive already given the guy nearly 9,500 pounds for it?
Gassing Station | General Gassing [Archive] | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff