e46 323ci was suprisingly quick.
Discussion
hi, i went for a bit of a hoon with friend in his 323ci at the weekend and was expecting to easily dispatch him in my impreza, i must say he kept up very well although he says he was pushing to the limiter in every gear to keep up, i was not being quite as brave but keep up he did.
i think the 2.5 6 cylinder in his car is about 192 bhp and mine meant to be 237bhp, although with the awd transmission losses i would have thought my car weighs about a hundred kilos less, but then i did have 2 heavy passengers to his 1 passenger.
i also have a friend with a 330ci cab which seems nowhere near as quick as either so was wondering if the 323ci had possibly been chipped in its lifetime. i am pretty sure my car is running well and is healthy and we are both sure that if the weather was wet on this private track we were using there would have been a much more pronounced gap.
he was familiar with the "track" whereas i had never driven it before which would im sure have given him a fair advantage too.
but whichever way you cut it i was very impressed with the pace of the bmw which is why i have written this, considering i have played with 330ci`s and plenty of modern hot hatches (on private tracks and cars of whom i know the owners) and never had them manage to stay so close. anyway as you can probably tell i was suitably impressed.
im sure i will get a flaming for some reason or other as that is how so many threads seem to go.
i think the 2.5 6 cylinder in his car is about 192 bhp and mine meant to be 237bhp, although with the awd transmission losses i would have thought my car weighs about a hundred kilos less, but then i did have 2 heavy passengers to his 1 passenger.
i also have a friend with a 330ci cab which seems nowhere near as quick as either so was wondering if the 323ci had possibly been chipped in its lifetime. i am pretty sure my car is running well and is healthy and we are both sure that if the weather was wet on this private track we were using there would have been a much more pronounced gap.
he was familiar with the "track" whereas i had never driven it before which would im sure have given him a fair advantage too.
but whichever way you cut it i was very impressed with the pace of the bmw which is why i have written this, considering i have played with 330ci`s and plenty of modern hot hatches (on private tracks and cars of whom i know the owners) and never had them manage to stay so close. anyway as you can probably tell i was suitably impressed.
im sure i will get a flaming for some reason or other as that is how so many threads seem to go.
pilchardthecat said:
Eddh said:
Knowing the road > What car you are in.
+1 There's a few twisty b-roads round here where i would have trounced your imprezza in my old 90bhp Citroen ZX Volcane TD 
well i doubt that very much. i own a 90bhp citroen zx and it would not be able to beat the impreza on any stretch of road in the world even with seb loeb at the wheel.Edited by rb5230 on Tuesday 1st June 16:16
daveco said:
From personal experience the 2.5 and 3.0 litre BMW engines tend to put out more hp and more performance than BMW officially state.
The 325 is as quick as the Mark V Golf GTI and original Boxster 2.5 and the 330 is a notch above them.
i think that must be true (especially if it is the alleged 170bhp version). although i am yet to travel in a 330ci that seemed as quick as this 323ci.The 325 is as quick as the Mark V Golf GTI and original Boxster 2.5 and the 330 is a notch above them.
rb5230 said:
daveco said:
From personal experience the 2.5 and 3.0 litre BMW engines tend to put out more hp and more performance than BMW officially state.
The 325 is as quick as the Mark V Golf GTI and original Boxster 2.5 and the 330 is a notch above them.
i think that must be true (especially if it is the alleged 170bhp version). although i am yet to travel in a 330ci that seemed as quick as this 323ci.The 325 is as quick as the Mark V Golf GTI and original Boxster 2.5 and the 330 is a notch above them.
325ci-192hp 2.5 litre, same engine but updated from 2001 on
I've had two 325's dyno'd both put out roughly 202-205hp and at least 195lb ft of torque. The 330 is on another level when you're talking speeds of 40mph and up. I think the 330's you have been in aren't a good judge of their performance; Try a facelift manual coupe; a very sorted and rapid car indeed.
pilchardthecat said:
Eddh said:
Knowing the road > What car you are in.
+1 There's a few twisty b-roads round here where i would have trounced your imprezza in my old 90bhp Citroen ZX Volcane TD 
you should approach every bend as if you don't know it.In my experience unless you are going mostly in a straight line, there actually isn't much difference in real-world progress between cars driven enthusiastically on the road given limiting factors such as safety margin and visibility.
Look at evo's benchmark Bedford West times - the difference between hot hatches and exotica is measured in a few seconds, which on your average twisty British road basically means no difference. Group runouts are a great leveller as well - with consistent pace the norm even among cars whose performance figures on paper show wide difference.
Look at evo's benchmark Bedford West times - the difference between hot hatches and exotica is measured in a few seconds, which on your average twisty British road basically means no difference. Group runouts are a great leveller as well - with consistent pace the norm even among cars whose performance figures on paper show wide difference.
Edited by plenty on Tuesday 1st June 17:15
Cupramax said:
The Wookie said:
I drove an E46 328i slushbox a few years ago and was amazed at how slow it was.
It felt slower than my 1700kg, tractor driveline'd Defender with the same engine
You had a Defender with a 328 engine???It felt slower than my 1700kg, tractor driveline'd Defender with the same engine
die fahrt said:
pilchardthecat said:
Eddh said:
Knowing the road > What car you are in.
+1 There's a few twisty b-roads round here where i would have trounced your imprezza in my old 90bhp Citroen ZX Volcane TD you should approach every bend as if you don't know it.daveco said:
rb5230 said:
daveco said:
From personal experience the 2.5 and 3.0 litre BMW engines tend to put out more hp and more performance than BMW officially state.
The 325 is as quick as the Mark V Golf GTI and original Boxster 2.5 and the 330 is a notch above them.
i think that must be true (especially if it is the alleged 170bhp version). although i am yet to travel in a 330ci that seemed as quick as this 323ci.The 325 is as quick as the Mark V Golf GTI and original Boxster 2.5 and the 330 is a notch above them.
325ci-192hp 2.5 litre, same engine but updated from 2001 on
I've had two 325's dyno'd both put out roughly 202-205hp and at least 195lb ft of torque. The 330 is on another level when you're talking speeds of 40mph and up. I think the 330's you have been in aren't a good judge of their performance; Try a facelift manual coupe; a very sorted and rapid car indeed.
ked), and even the manuals are deceptive, because they are quite refined, have very linear delivery and don't make a fuss when you extend them. I don't think facelift makes any difference to performance but maybe you are mentioning it in connection with handling (i.e. 'sorted')? There were steering or suspension mods around 2001 which coincided with the saloon being facelifted but this had no impact on power or gearing. The later 03 coupe facelift added a 6th gear but left all other gears unchanged.
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