Not quite a what car thread...

[Chris71]

Although I've got no plans to give up my current fun car imminently I am started to contemplate what I might do next. When the switch does come I plan to go back to something a bit more usable. This means a genuinely water-tight hood (or even a fixed roof), some degree of luggage capacity - ideally enough to get a full size suitcase in - and maybe some slight concessions to comfort on the motorway (at least compared to a track-spec Seven). Despite those, I'd like to retain a genuine sense of occasion. Budget is around £12k and although running costs aren't too critical I'd prefer something that isn't going cost a fortune to run - no Maserati 3200GTs or Ferrari 400s I'm afraid.

Two cars immediately stand out. The BMW Z3M Breadvan (probably the favourite as I've never done an M-car before and it's vaguely discrete to non-petrolheads) or a TVR Chimaera. Actually, make that three - a good V8S quite appeals too (used to have an S3...)

Like I said, there's an element of pipe dreaming at work here, as I don't plan to switch until the winter or even spring, but humour me... any thoughts?

[soad]

Not tempted by a Griffith instead of Chimaera?
Would get you a nice 4.0 litre example perhaps.

[Dominicc01]

I'm in exactly the same position, but with a greater risk appetite. I have a curious hankering to change my comfortable, unbeliveably reliable, respectably quick, 95 XJ6, for something more exciting, around the £12k mark. My list in order of preference is:

Maserati 3200
TVR Cerbera
Jaguar XKR

I don't want a BM. Fantastic cars, love them, think they look great. But I'm not getting one. If I did, M3.

There are lots of others for your money - RS2, RS4, M5. AMG Mercs can be had for that sort of cash too. I've looked through the lot, and they all leave something to be desired.

[Chris71]

soad said:

Not tempted by a Griffith instead of Chimaera?

I don't have a huge preference between the two to be honest. The Griffith is undoubtedly the icon - I grew up in the '90s (and near a TVR garage) so a Griff 500 was the bedroom wall poster of choice - but it strikes me you're getting much the same car for a higher price and a smaller boot? Plus, I'm told the Chim comes with a sunroof.

As for risk-appetite, it's true, I am looking to be vaguely sensible. The logic is the money used is a reasonable proportion of my half of a house deposit or something when maturity finally beckons.

My assumption is that the BMW is probably less likely to suffer from niggling issues, but likely to incur greater costs for servicing and a greater risk of big jobs like Vanos failure?

I don't mind doing a certain number of jobs myself, but significant engine work I'd rather leave to someone who knows what they're doing. And if I'm going back to a nice shiny road car rather than my battered ex-racer I'd probably have to maintain a service history rather than doing it myself. The total labour cost on the Caterham in 12 months of ownership is zero, despite quite a few jobs being ticked off the list (with the help of a couple of fellow PHers). I suspect people's expectations are slightly different when buying a road orientated BM or TVR; a list of receipts and work diary probably doesn't quite cut it.

I've sort of half done the TVR thing. This is a dilemma because it's the one marque I'd really like to go back to, but the Breadvan is also very much on the 'to own' list and might be a little more civilised for regular-ish or long distance use?

[Dominicc01]

My disliking of BMWs is partly due to the huge gulf between perceived reliability and actual reliability. In my experience - that is to say, the experience of being one of the only people in my family not to drive a BM - they are not as reliable as expected. Once the warranty ends, it's very much an expensive game of "what's going to go wrong next".
One member of my family was a BMW specialist for many years. When I mentioned I was thinking of getting a BMW, he persuaded me out of it on cost/reliability grounds.

It's not the engines that aren't solid (though I've seen plenty with fked engines), but other things can be dicey. There's lots of electrics and miles of wiring to go wrong. I've heard of ABS failures, power steering failures..... And none of it's cheap to put right.

At least with a TVR you know what to expect!

[AdamW]

Clio V6?

[300bhp/ton]

Chris71 said:

Although I've got no plans to give up my current fun car imminently I am started to contemplate what I might do next. When the switch does come I plan to go back to something a bit more usable. This means a genuinely water-tight hood (or even a fixed roof), some degree of luggage capacity - ideally enough to get a full size suitcase in - and maybe some slight concessions to comfort on the motorway (at least compared to a track-spec Seven). Despite those, I'd like to retain a genuine sense of occasion. Budget is around £12k and although running costs aren't too critical I'd prefer something that isn't going cost a fortune to run - no Maserati 3200GTs or Ferrari 400s I'm afraid.

Two cars immediately stand out. The BMW Z3M Breadvan (probably the favourite as I've never done an M-car before and it's vaguely discrete to non-petrolheads) or a TVR Chimaera. Actually, make that three - a good V8S quite appeals too (used to have an S3...)

Like I said, there's an element of pipe dreaming at work here, as I don't plan to switch until the winter or even spring, but humour me... any thoughts?

Like all the ideas so far.

I'd also throw one of these into the mix too. Very easy to live with and easy to maintain although the ride is a little harsh:




Monaro's are also in price range, but maybe a tad too big and heavy for what you are after??

[Devil2575]

Dominicc01 said:

My disliking of BMWs is partly due to the huge gulf between perceived reliability and actual reliability.

Yes, i'm a big fan of BMWs but they really don't live up to the hype about their reliability.

[Chris71]

AdamW said:

Clio V6?

I think I'm a bit too much of a wimp for a mid-engined Clio! It is nicely leftfield - I'm not a fan of conventional sports saloons or hot hatches (any more than standard Z3s), but the V6 quite appeals. The thing is though, I'd like something that I can still interact with even at my meagre level of ability. I suspect Clio ownership could end very expensively.

Also, when I do have the space to play, I like the hooligan potential of front-engined rear wheel drive, plenty of oomph and a limited slip diff.

Has anyone here used a Breadvan as a daily? I don't strictly intend to do that, but I would like to use the next car semi-regularly.

Other options are I guess: A Boxster S (not hugely keen on the image or Porsche garage bills and a bit short on luggage capacity), a 968 Sport or 944 S2 (already owned something similar and I find that big 4-cylinder a tiny bit dull), an S1 Elise (perhaps a little too hardcore to offer a touring advantage over the Seven) or a 350Z (not very practical and a little bit, well, Japanese)

ETA I would quite like a Monaro (or an MG ZT V8 for that matter) as a daily driver when I'm older and richer, but they're not quite what I'm looking for as a weekend toy... even a more usable one.

Edited by Chris71 on Friday 4th June 13:14