Vince Cable - Changed mind, back on topic.....
Discussion
For a while there I was getting worried about Mr Cable. He seemed to be drifting.
Now it seems he's had a change of mind, and IMO he's hitting all the targets again.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/businesslatestn...
Now it seems he's had a change of mind, and IMO he's hitting all the targets again.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/businesslatestn...
Telegraph said:
Mr Cable, who described bankers as "Scargills in pin-stripes" during the election campaign, said his criticism had been wrongly interpreted as a "grudge against the City".
"I'm not some kind of a socialist," Mr Cable said.
In a wide-ranging speech delivered at Cass Business School in London, Mr Cable admitted he had changed his mind and was no longer against cutting public spending immediately.
"Like the Governor of the Bank of England, and like the OECD, I have been persuaded that early action on the deficit is essential," he said. "Going forward, policy must be driven always by the same rational calculation of economic risk and benefit."
Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited.
He repeated his commitment to reforming the UK Takeover Rules but insisted his motivation was not "protectionism" from foreign acquirers but to guard against "unfettered short term speculation" and improving the accountability of shareholders.
However Mr Cable insisted he would stand firm on his determination get the banks to lend. He argued that costs to the taxpayer of the bank bail-outs "should outrage the most red-blooded capitalist every bit as much as any left-leaning radical."
As a result, he said: "We do not expect to see viable businesses deprived of credit or working capital by banks that are largely owned by the taxpayer, or the general beneficiaries of wider public support."
Mr Cable also reaffirmed his pledge to help small firms by taking a "tough line on regulation". He said: "The cost to business of regulation currently in the pipeline is around £20bn: far in excess of any direct help the Government does or can give."
Business lobby groups welcomed the speech. Miles Templeman, director-general of the Institute of Directors, approved of Mr Cable's emphasis on the "need for the state to interfere less, or even get out of the way, so that businesses can thrive."
Mr Templeman also praised Mr Cable's announcement that the Government would not prop up failing companies.
Then he said the most important thing of all..."I'm not some kind of a socialist," Mr Cable said.
In a wide-ranging speech delivered at Cass Business School in London, Mr Cable admitted he had changed his mind and was no longer against cutting public spending immediately.
"Like the Governor of the Bank of England, and like the OECD, I have been persuaded that early action on the deficit is essential," he said. "Going forward, policy must be driven always by the same rational calculation of economic risk and benefit."
Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited.
He repeated his commitment to reforming the UK Takeover Rules but insisted his motivation was not "protectionism" from foreign acquirers but to guard against "unfettered short term speculation" and improving the accountability of shareholders.
However Mr Cable insisted he would stand firm on his determination get the banks to lend. He argued that costs to the taxpayer of the bank bail-outs "should outrage the most red-blooded capitalist every bit as much as any left-leaning radical."
As a result, he said: "We do not expect to see viable businesses deprived of credit or working capital by banks that are largely owned by the taxpayer, or the general beneficiaries of wider public support."
Mr Cable also reaffirmed his pledge to help small firms by taking a "tough line on regulation". He said: "The cost to business of regulation currently in the pipeline is around £20bn: far in excess of any direct help the Government does or can give."
Business lobby groups welcomed the speech. Miles Templeman, director-general of the Institute of Directors, approved of Mr Cable's emphasis on the "need for the state to interfere less, or even get out of the way, so that businesses can thrive."
Mr Templeman also praised Mr Cable's announcement that the Government would not prop up failing companies.
Telegraph said:
He said: "The role of Government is not to provide handouts and soft loans to favoured companies or sectors, but to make it easier for businesses in all sectors to operate by lowering taxes, reducing regulation and delivering a skilled workforce."
Socialism, New Labour, it was really social engineering.Edited by dilbert on Friday 4th June 12:34
Well that's reassuring, but this
"Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
"Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
the media always seem to me to not be impressed with people who 'change their mind.' Personally I think any intelligent individual will have an open mind on many issues and therefore will be perfectly able to change their mind on a variety of topics, given persuasive arguments. I think its a bigger weakness to not listen to arguments, and to not change your mind. Changing your mind is a show of strength.
cs02rm0 said:
It would be nice to know what has changed his mind specifically though.
+1 And does he now believe whats coming out of his own mouth or is he just going along with the Tory line?. Was he not also once part of the Labour party.
Edited by Wanta996Gotta on Friday 4th June 13:08
cs02rm0 said:
It would be nice to know what has changed his mind specifically though.
Just before the election Mr Cable started saying all sorts of things that I thought were a bit dubious. That was from the perspective of his prior predictions about the banking crisis which were generally right and true IMO.Then his line started becoming much more left leaning. He started, almost, praising the work of Gordon Brown, in supporting the economy through public spending. Coming out the other side of the election, he was maintaining that line. By that stage I think (although I might be wrong)it was more in fear of the coalition and the "Tory b
ds" than any measurement of the economic landscape.I'd like to think that he's now seen for himself what's going on, and reached reasonable and rational conclusions. That's why I think the two significant statements in his speech are so important.
Personally, I'm inclined to believe he really has changed his mind. I certainly hope so.
Edited by dilbert on Friday 4th June 13:12
The real Apache said:
Well that's reassuring, but this
"Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
Yes, I think I can see £20bn a year worth of savings there."Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
Wanta996Gotta said:
cs02rm0 said:
It would be nice to know what has changed his mind specifically though.
+1 And does he now believe whats coming out of his own mouth or is he just going along with the Tory line?. Was he not also once part of the Labour party.
Edited by fido on Friday 4th June 13:20
The real Apache said:
Well that's reassuring, but this
"Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
Yep that exactly stoof out for me too- frankly i couldn't care what ministers get up to, or think, as long as they don't throw good money at bad projects like Quangos"Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
pugwash4x4 said:
The real Apache said:
Well that's reassuring, but this
"Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
Yep that exactly stoof out for me too- frankly i couldn't care what ministers get up to, or think, as long as they don't throw good money at bad projects like Quangos"Mr Cable said he had already started cutting costs at the Department of Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS) which spends £20bn a year. He said he had scrapped or merged 13 quangos attached to the department and planned to axe another "20 or so" out of the 74 he inherited."
stands out for me, 74 Quangos for one department alone?!!! FFS!
t cascade that is the 'bussiness support' network; national, regional and local quangos, theoretically a chain of command but practically overlapping and, critically, largely inneffective. There's plenty of deadwood to be pruned there IMHO.As far as Cable, or any other cabinet minister is concerned, they are entitled to change their mind on the basis - as Churchil put it, of "when the facts change, I change my mind" - that until/unless in power, they cannot have command of all the facts or know the true picture.
fido said:
Tis amazing what being put into a position of power does to one's beliefs .. Red Ken was also remarkably City-friendly when he became Mayor of London. I never quite understood Vince Cable - he has a good background in Economics, yet seems to demonstrate poor knowledge about the subject.
Economics is a very broad subject and being good in one area doesn't mean you are good in another. Inparticular being especially good in some specific field such as energy economics doesn't mean you can always see things properly in the broader sense. As for being chief economist at Shell, I just had a quick look at Wikipedia and tracking his career he was more likely brought into Shell for his political connections than lured to the Liberal Democrats for his wizardly in the dismal science.
Personally I think there's a lot to be said for only a very basic understanding of economics. If you can see the basic interactions of supply and demand applied to any given situation then the rest flows from there. Many economists get lost off in their own tangents of IS-LM graphs and complicated calculus that they will come out with the most ludicrous answers to the simplest of problems.
dilbert said:
Then he said the most important thing of all...
Lets hope that at last we have a Government that actually understands this fundamental point. I do hope it isn't just lip service. In my opionion this is the single most important thing that a Government has to do. Just give us the environment to work in and private businesses will perform miracles for the economy in a short period of time.Telegraph said:
He said: "The role of Government is not to provide handouts and soft loans to favoured companies or sectors, but to make it easier for businesses in all sectors to operate by lowering taxes, reducing regulation and delivering a skilled workforce."
Greenie said:
dilbert said:
Then he said the most important thing of all...
Lets hope that at last we have a Government that actually understands this fundamental point. I do hope it isn't just lip service. In my opionion this is the single most important thing that a Government has to do. Just give us the environment to work in and private businesses will perform miracles for the economy in a short period of time.Telegraph said:
He said: "The role of Government is not to provide handouts and soft loans to favoured companies or sectors, but to make it easier for businesses in all sectors to operate by lowering taxes, reducing regulation and delivering a skilled workforce."
Making regulation and taxation simpler (and fairer) benefits any and every business venture (well except perhaps tax accountants), irrespactive of size.
DangerousMike said:
the media always seem to me to not be impressed with people who 'change their mind.' Personally I think any intelligent individual will have an open mind on many issues and therefore will be perfectly able to change their mind on a variety of topics, given persuasive arguments. I think its a bigger weakness to not listen to arguments, and to not change your mind. Changing your mind is a show of strength.
I think you miss the logical implication of someone changing their mind - it means that they admit that their previously held beliefs (and quite possibly actions) were wrong.If someone was wrong before, what's to say they're not wrong now?
I would rather have someone who was right from the start, rather than someone who is good at recognising that they were in fact wrong once they've had the benefit of hindsight.
youngsyr said:
DangerousMike said:
the media always seem to me to not be impressed with people who 'change their mind.' Personally I think any intelligent individual will have an open mind on many issues and therefore will be perfectly able to change their mind on a variety of topics, given persuasive arguments. I think its a bigger weakness to not listen to arguments, and to not change your mind. Changing your mind is a show of strength.
I think you miss the logical implication of someone changing their mind - it means that they admit that their previously held beliefs (and quite possibly actions) were wrong.If someone was wrong before, what's to say they're not wrong now?
I would rather have someone who was right from the start, rather than someone who is good at recognising that they were in fact wrong once they've had the benefit of hindsight.
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