Thousands of anti-terror searches were illegal.......
Discussion
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?Is that what we will be getting enquires instead of quangos?
There was a f
k up. The forces have admitted there was a fk up. The forces have adjusted their systems. No-one is denying the fk up. Why waste millions on finding out what we know?Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?Is that what we will be getting enquires instead of quangos?
There was a f
k up. The forces have admitted there was a fk up. The forces have adjusted their systems. No-one is denying the fk up. Why waste millions on finding out what we know?And that takes an inquiry and results to be actioned upon.
Mojocvh said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?Is that what we will be getting enquires instead of quangos?
There was a f
k up. The forces have admitted there was a fk up. The forces have adjusted their systems. No-one is denying the fk up. Why waste millions on finding out what we know?And that takes an inquiry and results to be actioned upon.
The forces have already changed what they do. The enquiry at a cost of millions to the tax payer will like find out what we already know and make changes that are most likely already in place.
I've no problem with anything being looked at but object to the vast costs involved.
With all the work the forces have done it should be able to cobble together most if it in half a day. It won't though.
Oh and of the public are so fed up with a politicized police service why do so many seem in favour of directly elected police chiefs ( or whatever they want to call them). That is about as politicized as you get.
As for s44 it may only produce a few positives but in general it was used as a target hardening tool not a tool to find terrorists. It was designed and used to discourage terrorists not really as a means of catching them.
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?A political move in part if you will. They possibly also want an independant answer as to what approach to take to resolve it - again, if you are thinking politically, so that if they are also shockingly bad they can be absolved of responsibility...
AND, finally, they COULD be (but this one is a bit lower down the likely reasons) using these enquiries to have a bit more of an "open" Govt - as they promised.
Jasandjules said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?A political move in part if you will. They possibly also want an independant answer as to what approach to take to resolve it - again, if you are thinking politically, so that if they are also shockingly bad they can be absolved of responsibility...
AND, finally, they COULD be (but this one is a bit lower down the likely reasons) using these enquiries to have a bit more of an "open" Govt - as they promised.
Like you I see more and more of these and changes for changes sake when most issues are long resolved.
Mr_annie_vxr said:
I just see more people earning more millions. These never cost a few thousand they run on and on and the cost runs and runs.
Like you I see more and more of these and changes for changes sake when most issues are long resolved.
True - but I am hoping that they will save billions by axing some quangos and wastes of money such as ID cards which will at least save us something overall. Like you I see more and more of these and changes for changes sake when most issues are long resolved.
If you are fearing these will be like the "Bloody Sunday" enquiry I am hoping that they won't be as drawn out, or even close to it.
I hope that they will actually act on the results as well, which will at least make it seem a bit like it was worthwhile - But time will tell....
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?A political move in part if you will. They possibly also want an independant answer as to what approach to take to resolve it - again, if you are thinking politically, so that if they are also shockingly bad they can be absolved of responsibility...
AND, finally, they COULD be (but this one is a bit lower down the likely reasons) using these enquiries to have a bit more of an "open" Govt - as they promised.
Like you I see more and more of these and changes for changes sake when most issues are long resolved.
To use a relevant analogy, it is like a felon saying to you "you dont need to arrest me for beating that bloke up because its ok, I have stopped doing it now and I can see it was wrong of me" and you responding by saying "oh, ok, It would cost lots to put you to trial and keep you inside anyway, off you go"
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Mojocvh said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?Is that what we will be getting enquires instead of quangos?
There was a f
k up. The forces have admitted there was a fk up. The forces have adjusted their systems. No-one is denying the fk up. Why waste millions on finding out what we know?And that takes an inquiry and results to be actioned upon.
Seriously why don't you just admit that the Police Service in the UK really does needs a damn good shaking, especially AT THE TOP.
Mojocvh said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Mojocvh said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?Is that what we will be getting enquires instead of quangos?
There was a f
k up. The forces have admitted there was a fk up. The forces have adjusted their systems. No-one is denying the fk up. Why waste millions on finding out what we know?And that takes an inquiry and results to be actioned upon.
Seriously why don't you just admit that the Police Service in the UK really does needs a damn good shaking, especially AT THE TOP.
Lower crime, Higher convictions rates, better quality evidence, less corruption than at any stage and more accountability than at any time.
What it needs is to be left to get on with its job. What it needs is to be able to apply the common sense we use to apply until facts and figures became the mainstay. Facts and figures that were not the choice of the police but the government to introduce, political correctness that was not the choice of the police but the government to introduce. Both things that the current lot don't seem to bothered about changing.
Indeed with elected police chiefs expect more of a performance driven culture, less discretion, less ability to apply common sense.
My force has reduced crime in 3 years by 30 %. Has convicted more people than ever. With my own personal experience of a number of the 'rough' estates no longer being that rough. Yet because our public confidence measure is low, they will now be taking resources away from detecting crime and preventing and reducing crime to do things that raise public confidence.
Reducing pro-active policing to do more reactive policing.
Every police force is facing the same changes.
Getragdogleg said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Mr_annie_vxr said:
Jasandjules said:
Let's see what CMD does about it - just heard on the news that there is to be a full enquiry.
That's two enquires now.. how many millions will they both be costing?A political move in part if you will. They possibly also want an independant answer as to what approach to take to resolve it - again, if you are thinking politically, so that if they are also shockingly bad they can be absolved of responsibility...
AND, finally, they COULD be (but this one is a bit lower down the likely reasons) using these enquiries to have a bit more of an "open" Govt - as they promised.
Like you I see more and more of these and changes for changes sake when most issues are long resolved.
To use a relevant analogy, it is like a felon saying to you "you dont need to arrest me for beating that bloke up because its ok, I have stopped doing it now and I can see it was wrong of me" and you responding by saying "oh, ok, It would cost lots to put you to trial and keep you inside anyway, off you go"
It will tell us nothing we don't already know.
If its that important they can do it for free.
Over inflated fees on enquiry after enquiry is what should be looked at.
Or are you about doing stuff so people think that things will change compared to things actually being changed?
MOTORVATOR said:
So the police have acted outside of the law and you don't think an enquiry is warranted? I think it reasonable for the public to know who instructed it's use and what corrective actions have been taken to ensure the police actually read a piece of legislation and act on it legally.
To be fair thought, from what I can understand the error was with the law not being properly logged (as such) therefore it is not and was not the fault of the officers in question but the Govt Administrators for not ensuring the i's were dotted and the t's were crossed.Jasandjules said:
MOTORVATOR said:
So the police have acted outside of the law and you don't think an enquiry is warranted? I think it reasonable for the public to know who instructed it's use and what corrective actions have been taken to ensure the police actually read a piece of legislation and act on it legally.
To be fair thought, from what I can understand the error was with the law not being properly logged (as such) therefore it is not and was not the fault of the officers in question but the Govt Administrators for not ensuring the i's were dotted and the t's were crossed.Remember that if you were on the other side of this you could not use the defence of ignorance of the law.
So to me quite clearly the police have used their new powers in a cavalier manner that requires investigating or a minimum of a clear statement from top level to say that they overstepped the mark and what they have done to ensure it never happens again.
Just turning round and saying oh we misunderstood is not good enough. The police have to stay within the law just as you and I have to and it is important to public confidence / respect that they do so.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
If using the example of my OHs work place where they agreed a limit of £30 theft before calling the police, then when they found too many people were still being arrested the police called a meeting and looked for the limit to be raised to £40 then £50 weeks later you can see why crime reduction rates are what they say.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff