Mustang as an alternative....??
Discussion
Just noticed a few higher mileage 2005 4.6 V8 Mustangs going around the £13k mark. I appreciate they're a left hooker and not quite as powerful as they should be but they've still got a bloody great V8 up front, are easily mod-able and there is definately something to be said for having a Mustang..!! What's the PH opinion on these as say an alternative to the Monaro..??
Edited by MoonMonkey on Wednesday 16th June 15:07
I really like the "new shape" modern Mustang. I've looked over a few of them and while build and material standards aren't quite at German-barge levels, the relative simplicity and tunability of the V8 really appeal. I know I'll get derided for this but I'd have one over an M3.
I've not found LHD to be a problem in the UK, but then I don't use many toll roads or barriered car parks.
I've not found LHD to be a problem in the UK, but then I don't use many toll roads or barriered car parks.
ewenm said:
I know I'll get derided for this but I'd have one over an M3.
I think it probably appeals more - or at least as much - as an M3 for me too. While I don't doubt the Beamer is a better car in all quantifiable aspects and has its genuine enthusiasts too, the fact is a lot of people round here buy a high-end 3-Series as a status symbol. The fact it's actually a fantastic car in its own right is largely lost on the yuppies I suspect; what matters is that it's expensive and prestigious. I hasten to add I'm not knocking BMW owners there, rather the materialistic environment here in the footballer belt of North London. It's all about the bling. And, while you could hardly call a Mustang discrete it's a sufficiently leftfield choice to suggest the driver actually cared about what he was buying. They just want to trump the guy nextdoor's new 335i Coupe.
If I lived in a civilised part of the country I'd probably go for the M3 though.
ewen said:
...while build and material standards aren't quite at German-barge levels...
Errrr... I looked at 2007 Mustangs and that has to be the biggest understatement I've read today.Not my cup of tea anyway, but 'not quite'? You're having a laugh... The ones I looked at were barely better than my 1988 Renault 5...
M.
Edited by marcosgt on Wednesday 16th June 14:47
marcosgt said:
ewen said:
...while build and material standards aren't quite at German-barge levels...
Err I've looked at 2007 Mustangs and that has to be the biggest understatement I've read today.Not my cup of tea anyway, but 'not quite'? You're having a laugh...
M.
OllieWinchester said:
They appear to be massive externally, and quite petite inside and that puts me off as I don't like the idea of driving round in a reverse tardis.
Plus the whole Retro chic thing makes me sick in my mouth a bit.
Plenty of room inside for 4 adults and a shedload of luggage.Plus the whole Retro chic thing makes me sick in my mouth a bit.
MoonMonkey said:
Just noticed a few higher mileage 2005 Mustangs going around the £13k mark. I appreciate they're a left hooker and not quite as powerful as they should be but they've still got a bloody great V8 up front, are easily mod-able and there is definately something to be said for having a Mustang..!! What's the PH opinion on these as say an alternative to the Monaro..??
I think it comes down to what you want from the car and why.The Monaro is a fine car, but it does have a Vauxhall badge, which for me would be a no no. I'd want to swap on a proper Holden badge if I had one.
The Monaro is also plainer looking, inside and out, slightly bigger and slightly heavier. Also being RHD it is less niche, so probably easier to sell on, but won't hold it's money as well and isn't as exclusive.
On the plus sides I personally rate the LS engines as far superior to the Ford's modular V8, in terms of sound, power, tuning and power delivery.
A stock 5.7 Monaro is probably about on par with a stock 4.6 GT Mustang performance wise, the Stang maybe slightly quicker, but the Monaro will respond better to engine mods.
That said there is still good scope with the Stang, even bolt ons will liberate a number of HP and in stock tune it's designed to run on 87 octane fuel (PON rating, about equal to 91 or 92 RON if there was such a thing).
Supercharging is the best route, but is pricey and of course you could do the same to the Monaro too.
Handling wise the Monaro is fairly sorted in stock trim, as TG and Clarkson demonstrate it's a very good tailout car. Lots of scope to uprate it though. Mustang is a bit soft and wallowy in stock trim, but actually no where near as bad as some would claim. But suspension mods would be high on my list should I buy one.
So really it then comes down to how much of a statement you want to make. I personally love the interior on the Mustang. Ok it's not Jaguar quality and all leather covered. But it looks fab, has some great touches like IUP and My Color and is a fun place to be. The Monaro by contrast looks more upmarket, but it is just a looks thing, it too isn't a Jag inside.
Similar follows through on the outside, even with the 6.0 LS2 Monaro's nostrils (bonnet scoops) it's still quite an understated beast. Many people won't know what it is, and in a subdued colour won't even notice it.
Not so with the Stang, it's big, its bold its a statement! It'll attract attention where ever you go and ultimately so long as attention doesn't bother you, I believe it'll be more fun because of it. You'll be welcomed at any car show, people will want to talk to you about it in car parks and at petrol stations, it'll be fun just to sit in, even in 2 miles worth of traffic.
As for LHD, well I've had a lefty for almost 4 years now. I personally haven't found it an issue. Reckon it takes about 20 mins worth of driving to get used to the idea and a weekend to fully acclimatise. If you weave in and out of traffic on single carriage way roads (I don't) you might find it more of an issue compared to RHD.
On a side note, stay away from RHD conversions, most are horrid, cheap, nasty, stupidly expensive and I'd worry about long term issues, unique parts and durability. It's also likely to make it harder to sell and actually worth less IMO.
Or look at it like this:
| Mustang | Monaro | |
|---|---|---|
| Exterior appearance | 1 | 0 |
| Interior appearance | 1 | 0 |
| Stock Performance | 1 | 1 |
| Tuning ability | 1 | 1+ |
But when all said and done, for this kind of money I'd actually say look for one of these:
It's a 2003/4 Mustang Cobra
Cobra's were built by Ford's SVT (Special Vehicle Tuning) Department, the current alternative is the Shelby GT500.
Ok it's the previous gen Mustang (sn95 platform, not the current s197). But it looks bad ass!
Spec is very good too, where as the newer GT uses a 3v per cylinder n/a 4.6 SOHC V8 making 300'ish HP with a 5 speed manual box and a live rear axle. The Cobra uses a 4v per cyliner DOHC 4.6 V8 with forged internals with an Eaton M112R supercharger, T56 6 speed gearbox and IRS (Independence Rear Suspension).
In stock trim these things are "claimed" to make 390hp/390lb ft (although they seem to produce higher numbers on dyno's) and are in a different performance league to either a Monaro or GT Stang.
But the biggest thing is, a few cost affective mods; pulley change, cold air intake, exhaust and a tune will see around 550hp!! It'd take a lot of money to get either a Monaro or GT to this level of performance.
If you want to spend a bit more then 600-700hp is quite easy on about the same budget it'd cost to take a Mustang GT to 450hp.
One of these was on PH recently for £10.5k
EDIT:
If you don't need the +2 seating, I'd also look at C5 Corvettes. Similar money to a s197 GT. And compared to a Monaro they look better, are lighter, faster, more exclusive and handle better.
So in order of V8 muscle cars I'd look at them in this order:
| Car | Reason |
|---|---|
| Mustang Cobra 2003/4 | Looks great, v. rare, very fast, silly fast with tuning |
| Corvette | Looks, as in semi supercar and loads of people will ask you "is it a Ferrari?". Performance and tunability |
| Mustang GT (s197) | Looks, age (it'll be probably the newest), pretty good performance, very good with the right mods |
| 4th Gen Fbody (Camaro/Firebird) | Same engine and transmissions as Corvette and Monaro, but rarer than Monaro, more striking and lighter, so better performance too |
| Mustang Mach 1 (sn95) | Limited edition vehicle (seen on on Ebay for under £9k for a 2004 plate car). Has a DOHC 4.6 litre engine with a claimed 320hp. Faster than a stock s197 GT and looks uber cool with its active "Shaker" scoop |
| Monaro | Still looks good, but heavier than all the other GM offerings and plainer styling too. Good platform to mod from and capable stock |
Edited by 300bhp/ton on Wednesday 16th June 15:49
OllieWinchester said:
They appear to be massive externally, and quite petite inside and that puts me off as I don't like the idea of driving round in a reverse tardis.
Plus the whole Retro chic thing makes me sick in my mouth a bit.
They are no bigger outside than most other "big coupes" such as BMW M3 (current e90 weighs more too) or 6 Series, big Mercs like a CL, Jag XK and so on. Similar space inside too, as in 2+2 seating and a usable boot.Plus the whole Retro chic thing makes me sick in my mouth a bit.
And it's not retro, the Mustang has been in continuous production since 1964 and uses many styling cues from the last gen sn95 platform as well as pooling from it's heritage.
Had a '95 Mustang Cobra back in the day when I moved back from the US. LHD is never a problem (apart from the Dartford Tunnel when on my own) but it handled like a boat on UK roads. I understand the new one is a much better proposition though. I too would have one of these over an M3 too but then I'd have a '67 Fastback over one of these any day.
As mentioned already the interior is no Bentley but I for one don't give a flying f
k about that.
As mentioned already the interior is no Bentley but I for one don't give a flying f
k about that. unpc said:
300bhp/ton said:
IRS (Independence Rear Suspension).
I thought IRS was only available on the Mustang Cobra R. This one.
You won't get one of those for £10.5k
99 was the first year and the one with the engine recall for not making the claimed 320hp. And a 5 speed box.
2000 was the Cobra R you posted above with a 5.4 engine, very rare and not really worth the OP looking for.
2001 was n/a but made the power and got a 6 speed box.
2002 was Australian imports only, all RHD and not many made. Got an article somewhere in a UK mag. Most American's seem to know bugger all about these. Think there were only 100.
2003/4 Very similar to 2001 Cobra but gained the supercharger and went from an alloy block to cast iron.
All are good really, but the 2003/4 are sensational and I'd have one in a heartbeat.
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