Leased car tyre replacement - the law?
Discussion
I drive a company car, and have recently tried to get the tyres changed; the tread depth was measured at the approved tyre place, found to be 2.3mm, and authorisation to change the tyres was duly withheld, on the grounds that they weren't at the legal limit yet.
I emailed the leasing co for confirmation of their policy, saying I thought it was a bit rich to cut up rough over 0.7mm of tread depth when I'd managed to get 25,000 miles out of the tyres and had recently had a nasty aquaplaning incident on a (fortunately empty) wet motorway. I got the foloowing response:
"The policy is set that we will not authorise tyres to be replaced until they are under the legal limit. Please accept my apologies for the problems you have had with this but unfortunately we are unable to amend the policy."
How do I stand as regards legal liability on this point? If I get stopped and the tyres are checked and found to be illegal (i.e. "under the legal limit"), is the leasing company liable for the fine? What about the points? And what happens if I have a shunt in which the state of the tyres is found to be a contributory factor? I'm driving like I'm on eggshells at the moment because I don't trust the tyres, and it seems that my only alternative is to buy some new tyres out of my own pocket.
Any coppers/legal eagles out there got some input on this? Is it legal for a leasing company to stipulate that its vehicles fall into an illegal state before they'll do anything about it?
Also, does anyone know where I could find some research to support my own feeling that a tyre's performance can be significantly reduced before it becomes technically illegal?
Many thanks in advance. I'm gobsmacked that they'd apparently rather I crashed their precious fvcking car and endangered the safety of other road users, all for want of 0.7mm of tread depth...
I emailed the leasing co for confirmation of their policy, saying I thought it was a bit rich to cut up rough over 0.7mm of tread depth when I'd managed to get 25,000 miles out of the tyres and had recently had a nasty aquaplaning incident on a (fortunately empty) wet motorway. I got the foloowing response:
"The policy is set that we will not authorise tyres to be replaced until they are under the legal limit. Please accept my apologies for the problems you have had with this but unfortunately we are unable to amend the policy."
How do I stand as regards legal liability on this point? If I get stopped and the tyres are checked and found to be illegal (i.e. "under the legal limit"), is the leasing company liable for the fine? What about the points? And what happens if I have a shunt in which the state of the tyres is found to be a contributory factor? I'm driving like I'm on eggshells at the moment because I don't trust the tyres, and it seems that my only alternative is to buy some new tyres out of my own pocket.
Any coppers/legal eagles out there got some input on this? Is it legal for a leasing company to stipulate that its vehicles fall into an illegal state before they'll do anything about it?
Also, does anyone know where I could find some research to support my own feeling that a tyre's performance can be significantly reduced before it becomes technically illegal?
Many thanks in advance. I'm gobsmacked that they'd apparently rather I crashed their precious fvcking car and endangered the safety of other road users, all for want of 0.7mm of tread depth...
Their policy is illegal. Tyres MUST be changed at or before the limit not after. Anything lower than the limit is liable for 3 points and a fine + a rectification notice or even a possible prohibition notice (where the car cannot be driven until the problem is fixed).
I think I would explain this too your company before you head for the lease company. Then make sure that they put pressure on to make sure they are changed at safe levels.
Although the legal limit is 1.6mm most tyre experts recommend changing at 2mm.
You could also get a dealer to recommend replacement on safety grounds - in writing. They can't ignore that.
I think I would explain this too your company before you head for the lease company. Then make sure that they put pressure on to make sure they are changed at safe levels.
Although the legal limit is 1.6mm most tyre experts recommend changing at 2mm.
You could also get a dealer to recommend replacement on safety grounds - in writing. They can't ignore that.
This situation is not unusual.
Some years ago I took my car to an organisation which claims that you can't get quicker than a......
you do know who I mean.
I measured the tyres at 2mm, the 1.6mm wear bars were not quite flush but clearly not much left.
The tyre outfit refused point blank even to contact the leasing company for a similar reason you suggested.
Took the car out next day, found a stretch of road with (ahem) quite abrasive chippings and flat spotted a tyre or so.
Went to a different tyre company no problem apart from there was clearly a lot of wriggling by the leasing company to replace as few tyres as possible.
Another driver arrived from the same leasing firm, he had 4 totally illegal tyres on his A6, again because he had been refused when the tyres were still just legal.
We don't use that leasing company any more, nor do we put our cars in the hands of F***wit fitters!
However it does raise the following question.
Some folks suggest that buying an ex company car can be a sound buy, because "you know it will have been serviced properly and looked after."
adding the above info to the knowledge that at one time several of our drivers never lifted the bonnet between services to check oil or any level, let alone tyre checks 
suggests otherwise. That issue has been dealt with now.
Some years ago I took my car to an organisation which claims that you can't get quicker than a......
you do know who I mean. I measured the tyres at 2mm, the 1.6mm wear bars were not quite flush but clearly not much left.
The tyre outfit refused point blank even to contact the leasing company for a similar reason you suggested.
Took the car out next day, found a stretch of road with (ahem) quite abrasive chippings and flat spotted a tyre or so.
Went to a different tyre company no problem apart from there was clearly a lot of wriggling by the leasing company to replace as few tyres as possible.
Another driver arrived from the same leasing firm, he had 4 totally illegal tyres on his A6, again because he had been refused when the tyres were still just legal.
We don't use that leasing company any more, nor do we put our cars in the hands of F***wit fitters!
However it does raise the following question.
Some folks suggest that buying an ex company car can be a sound buy, because "you know it will have been serviced properly and looked after."
adding the above info to the knowledge that at one time several of our drivers never lifted the bonnet between services to check oil or any level, let alone tyre checks suggests otherwise. That issue has been dealt with now. Every time my wife goes near a tyre fitting place for tyres, the fitters are only too happy to say they are below the legal limit or just on the limit in order to flog the tyres.
The only thing she has learnt to be careful about is the mixing of makes. At one point she had 4 different makes of tyre due to punctures, VW Main Dealer servicing etc!!!
I kicked up a mega stink and got them changed on safety grounds. Just ask the leasing company to take liabilty in the event of an accident and to put it in writing that different tyres are acceptable.
They will soon swap them then!!!
The only thing she has learnt to be careful about is the mixing of makes. At one point she had 4 different makes of tyre due to punctures, VW Main Dealer servicing etc!!!
I kicked up a mega stink and got them changed on safety grounds. Just ask the leasing company to take liabilty in the event of an accident and to put it in writing that different tyres are acceptable.
They will soon swap them then!!!
[quote=PreacherCain]
"The policy is set that we will not authorise tyres to be replaced until they are under the legal limit. Please accept my apologies for the problems you have had with this but unfortunately we are unable to amend the policy."
quote]
It's unimaginable that a more senior person at the leasing company (ie a Director with legal responsibility) won't backtrack on the above, clearly ridiculous statement.
Our leasing company will change below 2mm - but tyres never seem to wear perfectly evenly across the width of the tread so getting the timing right where Kwik Fit (we have to go there) will change the tyres without them going illegal is quite tricky, especially as I can do 1K miles some weeks. They can look almost flush to the TWI's but Kwik Fit will find a spot that reads 3mm. I've tried different branches and they all seem terrified of upsetting the lease co's.
We had a row with our leasing company about tyre changing (they also insist on using mid-range tyres, I think we should replace like for like were possible). Their response was that the lease cost is based on using certain brands of tyre and only replacing them when legally required.
I know someone who is a maintenance controller in a leasing company and he told me they work on the basis that they could replace tyres a week early, onlt for the car to be written off in a crash a few days later so they'd have wasted the money!! Sounds horriffic, but when they've got K's of cars, I guess that must happen sometimes.
"The policy is set that we will not authorise tyres to be replaced until they are under the legal limit. Please accept my apologies for the problems you have had with this but unfortunately we are unable to amend the policy."
quote]
It's unimaginable that a more senior person at the leasing company (ie a Director with legal responsibility) won't backtrack on the above, clearly ridiculous statement.
Our leasing company will change below 2mm - but tyres never seem to wear perfectly evenly across the width of the tread so getting the timing right where Kwik Fit (we have to go there) will change the tyres without them going illegal is quite tricky, especially as I can do 1K miles some weeks. They can look almost flush to the TWI's but Kwik Fit will find a spot that reads 3mm. I've tried different branches and they all seem terrified of upsetting the lease co's.
We had a row with our leasing company about tyre changing (they also insist on using mid-range tyres, I think we should replace like for like were possible). Their response was that the lease cost is based on using certain brands of tyre and only replacing them when legally required.
I know someone who is a maintenance controller in a leasing company and he told me they work on the basis that they could replace tyres a week early, onlt for the car to be written off in a crash a few days later so they'd have wasted the money!! Sounds horriffic, but when they've got K's of cars, I guess that must happen sometimes.
As you are the driver- get them on the phone- tell them that the keys are on the desk at the tyre centre !if they dont change them they can come and collect the car as you dont want to tell the parents or family that a loved one life is worth less than a pair of crappy tyres .Also tell them that you will inform your health and safety officer at work of your decision and where and whom has the keys .7 of a mm of tread is crap .Dont take any threats from them show them who`s boss .Keep the roads safe it may be me you kill but I hope not!
PreacherCain said:
the tread depth was measured at the approved tyre place, found to be 2.3mm, and authorisation to change the tyres was duly withheld,
Are there any missing grooves?
ledfoot said:
This is normal policy of Leasing companies by the sound of it.
The Leasing company that provide our company vehicles will not change tyres if not below the legal limit.
Same with the company I'm with. But I generally find tyrefitters willing to be flexible. They even say that if a leasing co rep comes to visit "they'll find some tyres to show him". I don't condone such dishonesty, but safety is important. I generally use mobile fitters. Maybe a more personal relationship and the need to show something for the trip out makes a difference?
I worked for a (Non -lion) Auction company at one time and had a Company Car. The dealers always wanted them when we got rid of them, BUT My last car needed new brake discs and had about 5,000 miles to replacement. So they sold it! It would never have passed an MOT but it was under 3 years old.
[quote]It's unimaginable that a more senior person at the leasing company (ie a Director with legal responsibility) won't backtrack on the above, clearly ridiculous statement.[/quote]
Funnily enough, it appears things are moving; our fleet manager has applied The Boot, and I've already had an unreserved apology from the drooling cretin responsible for the original email. I suspect a wholesale, legally-binding retraction from a senior person cannot be far behind, and then we'll see about getting some new tyres.
If they're not forthcoming, I suppose I might find that the local scrotes have slashed the tyres. At some stage. Especially if I park a couple of roads over.
The only difficulty is, they'd probably brick the windows too...
Funnily enough, it appears things are moving; our fleet manager has applied The Boot, and I've already had an unreserved apology from the drooling cretin responsible for the original email. I suspect a wholesale, legally-binding retraction from a senior person cannot be far behind, and then we'll see about getting some new tyres.
If they're not forthcoming, I suppose I might find that the local scrotes have slashed the tyres. At some stage. Especially if I park a couple of roads over.
The only difficulty is, they'd probably brick the windows too...
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