Four dead again today in the Afghanistan.....

[Corsair7]

Sad> Sounds like they drowned.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk/10402041.stm

[Mike_CTR]

A sad occurrence, the protective vehicles are just getting too big for the 'infrastructure' around the Green Zone..

Atleast with WMIKs you had a chance to get out, and they were light!

[Mike_CTR]

JDMFanYo said:

Condolences to the family.

However, I don't understand how this can be classed as a 'statistic' related to the fighting. People have road accidents every day, yes they are in the army and yes they were on route to an incident, but it sounds like it was just an accident...?

I mean no disrespect to the soldiers

Edited by JDMFanYo on Thursday 24th June 11:54

The mostly likely occurrence would be that the vehicle weight would have collapsed the side of the track it was using and rolled into an irrigation ditch. So, an unfortunate event.

[munroman]

JDMFanYo said:

Condolences to the family.

However, I don't understand how this can be classed as a 'statistic' related to the fighting. People have road accidents every day, yes they are in the army and yes they were on route to an incident, but it sounds like it was just an accident...?

I mean no disrespect to the soldiers

Edited by JDMFanYo on Thursday 24th June 11:54

Sympathies to the families.

I suppose if we had not been at war, the guys would not have been in that place at that time, and would likely be still alive and well.
Bliar and Brown effectively put them in a fatal situation, so they are every bit victims as if they had been shot or blown up.

[DJC]

Knock it off, it was an accident that was purely on the logistics side. As others have said the infrastructure is not always suitable for the vehicles we put there. Frankly you could lobby that argument at an awful lot of the infrastructure in the UK, let alone Afghanistan!

Its got bugger all to do with Blair or Brown or whether or not they should be there.

There are some soft headers buggers round here at times.

[Shay HTFC]

DJC said:

Knock it off, it was an accident that was purely on the logistics side. As others have said the infrastructure is not always suitable for the vehicles we put there. Frankly you could lobby that argument at an awful lot of the infrastructure in the UK, let alone Afghanistan!

Its got bugger all to do with Blair or Brown or whether or not they should be there.

There are some soft headers buggers round here at times.

They were victims of war. They were being ferried around Afghanistan for war purposes.

By your reasoning, the soldiers who died of malnutrition and hypothermia on the Eastern Front in the Great Wars should not have been included in the death statistics as they were also deaths of a logistical nature

[Eric Mc]

You would be surprised how many soldiers, sailors and airmen are killed and/or injured on training in the UK and on the ranges or on exercise.

It's a fairly high risk form of activity - even without someone shooting at you.

[Corsair7]

DJC said:

Knock it off, it was an accident that was purely on the logistics side. As others have said the infrastructure is not always suitable for the vehicles we put there. Frankly you could lobby that argument at an awful lot of the infrastructure in the UK, let alone Afghanistan!

Its got bugger all to do with Blair or Brown or whether or not they should be there.

There are some soft headers buggers round here at times.

Whilst I agree that its a tragic accident, I think your stance that 'it had nothing to do with Afghanistan' is short sighted and simplistic.

These guys were on active duty in a war against an enemy that uses the tactics of IED warfare, thus forcing the troops into unsuitable vehicles for the terrain. A war where they cant easily identify the enemy, and an enemy that has no clear leadership that can surrender or negociate a peace.

So the (previous) government has put our soldiers in an impossible position, an unfightable, unwinnable conflict, and this accident would not have occurred otherwise. Yes, these guys might have had an accident on Salisbury plain or coming home from the pub, but the reality is it looks like they have drowned in a ditch in a sthole country waging a war that will end in us realising that we cannot ever claim a victory.

Its too easy to justify their lives as being lost in 'just an accident that could happen anywhere'. If it were a conventional war I might agree more easily, but because of the type of conflict that it is, and because of the way they have to fight this unseen enemy that uses IEDs to kill, they're very use of that kind of transport is relevant and makes it more than 'just an accident'.

Very very sad.

[BruceV8]

Eric Mc said:

You would be surprised how many soldiers, sailors and airmen are killed and/or injured on training in the UK and on the ranges or on exercise.

It's a fairly high risk form of activity - even without someone shooting at you.

Eric speaks the truth, as usual.

IIRC, the biggest cause of death and injuries to British forces in Bosnia was RTAs. There's no reason why that risk of accidental death should vanish just because there are people deliberately trying to kill you as well. Its tragic, but accidents do happen.

A sad loss nonetheless.

[rhinochopig]

Corsair7 said:

DJC said:

Knock it off, it was an accident that was purely on the logistics side. As others have said the infrastructure is not always suitable for the vehicles we put there. Frankly you could lobby that argument at an awful lot of the infrastructure in the UK, let alone Afghanistan!

Its got bugger all to do with Blair or Brown or whether or not they should be there.

There are some soft headers buggers round here at times.

Whilst I agree that its a tragic accident, I think your stance that 'it had nothing to do with Afghanistan' is short sighted and simplistic.

These guys were on active duty in a war against an enemy that uses the tactics of IED warfare, thus forcing the troops into unsuitable vehicles for the terrain. A war where they cant easily identify the enemy, and an enemy that has no clear leadership that can surrender or negociate a peace.

So the (previous) government has put our soldiers in an impossible position, an unfightable, unwinnable conflict, and this accident would not have occurred otherwise. Yes, these guys might have had an accident on Salisbury plain or coming home from the pub, but the reality is it looks like they have drowned in a ditch in a sthole country waging a war that will end in us realising that we cannot ever claim a victory.

Its too easy to justify their lives as being lost in 'just an accident that could happen anywhere'. If it were a conventional war I might agree more easily, but because of the type of conflict that it is, and because of the way they have to fight this unseen enemy that uses IEDs to kill, they're very use of that kind of transport is relevant and makes it more than 'just an accident'.

Very very sad.

It is not appropriate to blame the Labour government for us being in Afghanistan. Unlike Iraq, it is a NATO operation so we are obliged to support it, as we part of NATO. Con-Dem government would have committed men and materiel just as quickly.

Edited by rhinochopig on Thursday 24th June 13:32

[DJC]

Corsair7 said:

DJC said:

Knock it off, it was an accident that was purely on the logistics side. As others have said the infrastructure is not always suitable for the vehicles we put there. Frankly you could lobby that argument at an awful lot of the infrastructure in the UK, let alone Afghanistan!

Its got bugger all to do with Blair or Brown or whether or not they should be there.

There are some soft headers buggers round here at times.

Whilst I agree that its a tragic accident, I think your stance that 'it had nothing to do with Afghanistan' is short sighted and simplistic.

These guys were on active duty in a war against an enemy that uses the tactics of IED warfare, thus forcing the troops into unsuitable vehicles for the terrain. A war where they cant easily identify the enemy, and an enemy that has no clear leadership that can surrender or negociate a peace.

So the (previous) government has put our soldiers in an impossible position, an unfightable, unwinnable conflict, and this accident would not have occurred otherwise. Yes, these guys might have had an accident on Salisbury plain or coming home from the pub, but the reality is it looks like they have drowned in a ditch in a sthole country waging a war that will end in us realising that we cannot ever claim a victory.

Its too easy to justify their lives as being lost in 'just an accident that could happen anywhere'. If it were a conventional war I might agree more easily, but because of the type of conflict that it is, and because of the way they have to fight this unseen enemy that uses IEDs to kill, they're very use of that kind of transport is relevant and makes it more than 'just an accident'.

Very very sad.

Actually no it doesnt. These vehicles have suffered the same type of incidents in UK training arenas.

Nice try on just trying to randomly blame and whinge about the past Govt again and barely even hiding you just wanting to have another whinge about being in Afghanistan in the first place. Lets be honest, thats obviously more important to you than acknowledging the sad loss of the folks involved.

[andy_s]

Poor guys, not good at all and certainly a massive blow to the families and friends. RIP.