Discussion
Hello folks of the Alfa Forum.
Quick question for you if I may. Friend and his missus are looking to buy a 159 soonish. Prices of JTS and JTD cars seem quite similar and from what I can see, servicing costs are much the same until you reach high mileage.
They don't do that many miles (around 4k per annum) so they won't really benefit from the JTD's better mpg, although the cheaper tax cost might be useful.
Basically, I'm after opinions from the learned of the pros and cons of both engines.
Many thanks in advance - TTwiggy (former owner of a 147 GTa)
Quick question for you if I may. Friend and his missus are looking to buy a 159 soonish. Prices of JTS and JTD cars seem quite similar and from what I can see, servicing costs are much the same until you reach high mileage.
They don't do that many miles (around 4k per annum) so they won't really benefit from the JTD's better mpg, although the cheaper tax cost might be useful.
Basically, I'm after opinions from the learned of the pros and cons of both engines.
Many thanks in advance - TTwiggy (former owner of a 147 GTa)
Edited by TTwiggy on Thursday 1st July 14:16
ALFA. 
The 2.2 JTS is atrocious and has now been discontinued, so if they're buying used then the 1.9 JTDm would be the better option. The 2.2 JTS is the main reason I have a 1.9 JTDm.
For the bigger engines, it's not so clear-cut - the 3.2 JTS isn't as characterful as the old Alfa V6, but it's not as bad as it's sometimes made out to be either. For real-world performance, I don't think there's a massive different between the 3.2 JTS and the 2.4 JTDm.
If they're buying new, then I think the 1750 TBi would be the pick of the bunch.
The 2.2 JTS is atrocious and has now been discontinued, so if they're buying used then the 1.9 JTDm would be the better option. The 2.2 JTS is the main reason I have a 1.9 JTDm.
For the bigger engines, it's not so clear-cut - the 3.2 JTS isn't as characterful as the old Alfa V6, but it's not as bad as it's sometimes made out to be either. For real-world performance, I don't think there's a massive different between the 3.2 JTS and the 2.4 JTDm.
If they're buying new, then I think the 1750 TBi would be the pick of the bunch.
jamieboy said:
ALFA.
The 2.2 JTS is atrocious and has now been discontinued, so if they're buying used then the 1.9 JTDm would be the better option. The 2.2 JTS is the main reason I have a 1.9 JTDm.
For the bigger engines, it's not so clear-cut - the 3.2 JTS isn't as characterful as the old Alfa V6, but it's not as bad as it's sometimes made out to be either. For real-world performance, I don't think there's a massive different between the 3.2 JTS and the 2.4 JTDm.
If they're buying new, then I think the 1750 TBi would be the pick of the bunch.
hey jamie - sorry about the typo (now corrected) posted from my iphone and i think it auto-corrected.The 2.2 JTS is atrocious and has now been discontinued, so if they're buying used then the 1.9 JTDm would be the better option. The 2.2 JTS is the main reason I have a 1.9 JTDm.
For the bigger engines, it's not so clear-cut - the 3.2 JTS isn't as characterful as the old Alfa V6, but it's not as bad as it's sometimes made out to be either. For real-world performance, I don't think there's a massive different between the 3.2 JTS and the 2.4 JTDm.
If they're buying new, then I think the 1750 TBi would be the pick of the bunch.
anyhoo, thanks for your input, but could you tell me why the 2.2 jts is so bad? they are buying used so that is one of their options...
TTwiggy said:
could you tell me why the 2.2 jts is so bad? they are buying used so that is one of their options...
It just wasn't a good engine. No power low down so you have to rev it to make much progress - no problem with that in principle, our 1.6 147 needed wound up, as did the Seicento Sporting - but the 2.2 feels unwilling to rev, and the noise it makes (never pleasant) becomes harsher as the revs increase. And somehow having to cane the engine to make any sort of progress doesn't feel right in a car in the 159's class. Not especially powerful, not that clean, not that economical. Not even nice to look at.
I find it hard to make a case for the 2.2 at all, unless you're fundamentally opposed to diesel, in which case it's your only real option at that price point.
The only time I felt the 2.2 made sense was on track, where you were wringing it's neck all the time, and where the nose felt noticably lighter than the 3.2. Largely pointless, though - as fond as I am of my 159 for what it is, the track isn't it's natural habitat.
There's also a well-documented problem where there's a significant hesitation at just over idle, moving-off-from-stopped pace. I never noticed it on the ones that I tried, but on another forum there's a very lengthy thread with people complaining about it, reckoning it to be dangerous, etc. to the point where they were considering legal action against Alfa. Obvously some of those complaining are likely just serial whingers, and even within the complainers there are different interpretations of how bad it is.
Most reviews seem to agree that 1750TBi is the petrol engine the 159 should have had from the start, unfortunately it seems to have come in closer to the end of 159 production than the beginning. I'm not a particular diesel evangelist, and had the 1750 been available when I bought mine then it's likely that's what I'd have.
In more general terms of the car, the 159 had a facelift in early '08 - I think cars built from March '08 onwards - the styling is exactly the same, but they lost a fair bit of weight and there were some trim differences, mostly trivial. So if they're looking at that sort of age then it's worth double-checking.
The ti looks the part, but the 19" wheels can go through £200-a-corner tyres at a fair rate - if the alignment is set correctly then it's tolerable, but if it's out then it can be savage. The suspension on the ti is also on the stiff side, but the softer Lusso was a bit too soft for me, so it's likely to be personal preference.
Edited by jamieboy on Thursday 1st July 14:53
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