Decisions, decisions...Caterham v Elise (or something else?)
Discussion
So, we park up at the beach on Sunday next to a lovely silver Elise MkII. I've just got a new job (and redundancy from the old one!) which has a handy profit share so could be in the money in a few months (or years time!). Wifey asks what a 2nd hand Elise goes for, so I say £7k to £10k for a very early one with a few miles. She then says OK, if your profit share works out ok, in about 2 years, let's get something like that.
I nearly faint.
Getting over the shock, I say I would prefer a Caterham, as I have wanted one of them for about 20 years (well, since Performance Car had a "Prisoner" special front cover in about 1987...
She thinks they "look dangerous" and I guess I can see her point. I can see too how an Elise might look more "normal" when compared to a Caterham.
So, if you were me, and had say £10k-£15k to spend on something like this, what would you do?
I would be concerned about reliabilty with the K series engine in an Elise, but I guess it would be a K engined Caterham at that price, probably. Neither have great hoods, so I hear, what else are the strengths and weaknesses? And would a VX220 be a soft choice? More reliable engine, more of a daily driver?
I nearly faint.
Getting over the shock, I say I would prefer a Caterham, as I have wanted one of them for about 20 years (well, since Performance Car had a "Prisoner" special front cover in about 1987...
She thinks they "look dangerous" and I guess I can see her point. I can see too how an Elise might look more "normal" when compared to a Caterham.
So, if you were me, and had say £10k-£15k to spend on something like this, what would you do?
I would be concerned about reliabilty with the K series engine in an Elise, but I guess it would be a K engined Caterham at that price, probably. Neither have great hoods, so I hear, what else are the strengths and weaknesses? And would a VX220 be a soft choice? More reliable engine, more of a daily driver?
elise / vx essentially the same thing, and both very good, practical second car options. Caterham is more of a hard core option, and I would argue end up being a fair weather option whereas elise/ vx can be a daily driver, although this can become a pain too due to losing the sense of occasion.
+1 and you get all the imagineI had this very dilemma earlier this year, and went for the Elise.
Before I had sat in them both I had no idea just how cramped the Caterham cabin is. Not only could I not work the pedals in my size 10 trainers, but I quickly realised the notion of convincing anyone but a hardened petrolhead to come as a passenger was just not going to happen.
Also, the lack of dealers and the extremely seasonal way they have to operate (ie mega busy in spring, dead in winter) put me off slightly.
Having said that, I may well go down the Caterham route in the future, so it depends exactly how focused a car you want.
Also, dont buy into the K-series hgf scare stories. If it does go, which is not any more likely than any other car, it will probably cost about £350. Not exactly the end of the world.
Before I had sat in them both I had no idea just how cramped the Caterham cabin is. Not only could I not work the pedals in my size 10 trainers, but I quickly realised the notion of convincing anyone but a hardened petrolhead to come as a passenger was just not going to happen.
Also, the lack of dealers and the extremely seasonal way they have to operate (ie mega busy in spring, dead in winter) put me off slightly.
Having said that, I may well go down the Caterham route in the future, so it depends exactly how focused a car you want.
Also, dont buy into the K-series hgf scare stories. If it does go, which is not any more likely than any other car, it will probably cost about £350. Not exactly the end of the world.
The K series unreliability is overblown too - the most common fault you hear about is head gasket failure but any that have had this should have had an uprated gasket fitted afterwards, which almost always solves the problem. There is also a thermostat mod (you'll see references to PRRT) which is a bit of extra insurance too.
I sold my Elise recently to an ex-Caterham owner, who made the change to get most of the thrills of the 7-type but much more year-round usability. I had mine for nearly 2 years, as a main car for my wife and I, parked outside, perfectly reliable and useable (and watertight).
If you want a car your wife will go in, the Elise is a much more likely bet. If you want fairweather weekend fun, go a Caterham.
Enjoy the search.
I sold my Elise recently to an ex-Caterham owner, who made the change to get most of the thrills of the 7-type but much more year-round usability. I had mine for nearly 2 years, as a main car for my wife and I, parked outside, perfectly reliable and useable (and watertight).
If you want a car your wife will go in, the Elise is a much more likely bet. If you want fairweather weekend fun, go a Caterham.
Enjoy the search.
Drive an Elise, then drive a Caterham - that will make your mind up one way or another. Some people aren't designed for Caterham-ownership. Some people come away from test driving one wanting nothing else for the rest of their lives. It's no use other people telling you what they prefer - you have to make that decision and live with it.
Considerations:
Considerations:
- Elise as a daily? It's not that easy to live with, especially if you go to work in a suit. If you can live with one, can you make that leap to using a Caterham every day too? Warning... as problematic as it is to use an Elise daily, a Caterham is another stretch again.
- If neither can be used as a daily, why not go for the one you feel most comfortable in for your weekend excursions?
- Fair weather vs any weather?.. both have problems with anything other than fair weather. How hardy are you and how determined are you to make it work? Of the two, Caterhams have the greater probability of suffering corrosion problems later-on, but you can "protect, prevent, and address" as you go along, if you're so minded to do so.
- Don't write off the K (in either car). Are you a "spannerer" because if you are, and you fancy playing with your toy, the K is **the** favourite. The Caterham is the easiest, most accessible, to work on at home.
- Is there anyone else you know with either car? Some sort of club or group of like-minded enthusiasts can make the whole ownership experience more enjoyable, to the point where you might consider one car over another simply for this alone.
It all depends on the people. My OH loves the Caterham and I've used it as an only car (5 years) and a touring vehicle (10 years). In terms of carrying capacity, there's not much in it and the Caterham has the advantage of you being able to strap extra stuff to the rollbar/spare wheel carrier when the boot is full.
In terms of interior comfort, there's more space in the Elise/VX but I find the 7 very comfortable once in (did 745 miles in mine on Friday) and obviously it's a lot of fun to drive. I too can't drive it in my size 10 trainers but can in a pair of Puma Speedcats. Heel and toe just feel natural, the car feels part of you with instant response to your inputs.
Edit: Whichever you get, you'll love it
In terms of interior comfort, there's more space in the Elise/VX but I find the 7 very comfortable once in (did 745 miles in mine on Friday) and obviously it's a lot of fun to drive. I too can't drive it in my size 10 trainers but can in a pair of Puma Speedcats. Heel and toe just feel natural, the car feels part of you with instant response to your inputs.
Edit: Whichever you get, you'll love it
Edited by ewenm on Wednesday 14th July 09:23
ewenm said:
Chamonix - Martigny - Lausanne - Besancon - Chaumont - Reims - Calais - Folkestone - Bath after a week of mountaineering in the Alps (all kit carried in the Caterham but no passenger 
).
I think I'd want a bath after that much driving in a Caterham. Not much protection from road muck. ).And I'd brush my teeth as well. Just to get the flies out.
Oli.
Oh, you don't mean that sort of Bath ...
They're very different cars. Drive both and see which you prefer.
There haven't been any issues with the K-series in my Elise so far, in around 40k miles. The head gaskets are a weak point, but it's only around 400 quid to fix if it does go and you can significantly decrease the chances of a repeat failure if you fix it properly. Caterhams seem slightly less prone to HGF than Elises, but that's probably just because they get looked after better.
Drive a Toyota engined Elise too. You'll get a 111R for the top end of your budget (just) and you might prefer it. Personally I preferred the K-series.
The VX220 Turbo is worth a drive too.
There haven't been any issues with the K-series in my Elise so far, in around 40k miles. The head gaskets are a weak point, but it's only around 400 quid to fix if it does go and you can significantly decrease the chances of a repeat failure if you fix it properly. Caterhams seem slightly less prone to HGF than Elises, but that's probably just because they get looked after better.
Drive a Toyota engined Elise too. You'll get a 111R for the top end of your budget (just) and you might prefer it. Personally I preferred the K-series.
The VX220 Turbo is worth a drive too.
Edited by kambites on Wednesday 14th July 10:05
Caterham v expensive insurance. Elise not too bad. The Elise has a boot, so the pair of you can disappear for a dirty weekend. With the caterham, you can shove a wallet, a mobile phone and a jersey behind the seats but that's about it.
Slightly softer option would be a Boxer - same price range. Worse image, but a very very good car. Decent sized boot(s), comfortable cabin, cracking engine and fantastic handling. The hood will be much easier to deal with than the Elise's, and certainly compared to the Caterham's!
Slightly softer option would be a Boxer - same price range. Worse image, but a very very good car. Decent sized boot(s), comfortable cabin, cracking engine and fantastic handling. The hood will be much easier to deal with than the Elise's, and certainly compared to the Caterham's!
alfa pint said:
Caterham v expensive insurance. Elise not too bad. The Elise has a boot, so the pair of you can disappear for a dirty weekend. With the caterham, you can shove a wallet, a mobile phone and a jersey behind the seats but that's about it.
Slightly softer option would be a Boxer - same price range. Worse image, but a very very good car. Decent sized boot(s), comfortable cabin, cracking engine and fantastic handling. The hood will be much easier to deal with than the Elise's, and certainly compared to the Caterham's!
Erm, expensive insurance? My R400 was £400 a year. A (slower, cheaper) Elise would have been £1200.Slightly softer option would be a Boxer - same price range. Worse image, but a very very good car. Decent sized boot(s), comfortable cabin, cracking engine and fantastic handling. The hood will be much easier to deal with than the Elise's, and certainly compared to the Caterham's!
Also more luggage room in a Caterham than you give credit for - there is a boot.
Have you owned a Caterham?
alfa pint said:
Caterham v expensive insurance. Elise not too bad. The Elise has a boot, so the pair of you can disappear for a dirty weekend. With the caterham, you can shove a wallet, a mobile phone and a jersey behind the seats but that's about it.
I'm sorry but that's just rubbish. The Caterham has a decent-sized boot and more places to strap extra luggage than an Elise. The OH and I did a 25 day trip across the USA in ours carrying all our kit in and on the car. For the performance, I'd say insuring a Caterham was pretty cheap too, of course using specialists.alfa pint said:
Slightly softer option would be a Boxer - same price range. Worse image, but a very very good car. Decent sized boot(s), comfortable cabin, cracking engine and fantastic handling. The hood will be much easier to deal with than the Elise's, and certainly compared to the Caterham's!
Boxster I presume. A good suggestion. Edit to add a pic (not mine):
Edited by ewenm on Wednesday 14th July 10:20
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