What did I see / hear? Train related.
Discussion
Very, very early this morning I was woken up by something happening on the train tracks out the back of my place. I've seen diggers, foliage and tree cutters and various other 'obvious' train track related goings on in the past but I had no idea what this particular machine was doing.
It was about the length of two 'standard' train carriages, yellow, loads of lights and very noisy. It would move slowly forward about 10ft, screech to a stop and then for the next 8 - 10 seconds all hell would break loose. Loads of noise (metallic banging) and massive vibrations. Then, it would move forward again and repeat the process.
Any ideas what was going on?
My inner child loved watching it
, my early morning adult head just wanted to go back to bed 
.
It was about the length of two 'standard' train carriages, yellow, loads of lights and very noisy. It would move slowly forward about 10ft, screech to a stop and then for the next 8 - 10 seconds all hell would break loose. Loads of noise (metallic banging) and massive vibrations. Then, it would move forward again and repeat the process.
Any ideas what was going on?
My inner child loved watching it
, my early morning adult head just wanted to go back to bed .
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Moving rail factory? Have you got a link to that? Never seen that one, ive watched the rail train drop off lengths upto 1/4 mile long and even longer straight into the 4ft, then when they switch rails, the road railers do all the work from the adjacent line.ETA: I think you mean this from 4:30ish onwards?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvDdh7Hfwhw&fea...
Edited by working class on Sunday 18th July 18:10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORI8GCUB7hw&fea...
This is pretty similar noisewise. Guess I must have been mistaken about the stopping, maybe it just slowed. There was definatley screeching before the tampering (?).
This is pretty similar noisewise. Guess I must have been mistaken about the stopping, maybe it just slowed. There was definatley screeching before the tampering (?).
UncleRic said:
Those in the know, is this sort of work in response to a problem with the tracks or more of a maintainence job done to a specific (yearly / 2 yearly?) schedule?
I think it's probably a bit of both.The worst problems are usually subsidence, and water. The former usually arises as a result of the latter.
Normally it's just wear and tear. You can see it if you get a straight bit of track near a station. Stand at the end of the platform, and look down the track. If you can see the rails wiggling around all over the place, then it needs tamping (or replacing). They should just be straight or smooth curving lines.
It gets worse, as it becomes worse. Eventually it wears the rolling stock. It feels awful in older stock, but newer stock is more immune, with gas suspension.
I'm not really in the know though!
Edited by dilbert on Sunday 18th July 18:48
I think I might be described as being 'in the know' - it's certainly in my job description!!
Firstly, it sounds like it was either a Tamper or a Stoneblower. PM me with your location and the date, and I'll find out.
Secondly, either tamping or stoneblowing can be deployed either as routine maintenance, or in response to a track geometry issue (for instance to remove either an emergency or a temporary speed restriction imposed as a result of a track fault). In either case, the purpose is to either lift the track, or to move it laterally; neither machine can lower the track. In the case of tamping, the track and sleeper is lifted, and the tines vibrate until the ballast effectively behaves as a liquid, and the sleeper is left in a position either in accordance with a design or a position determined by the machine software. Stoneblowing injects new stone under the sleepers to achieve a change in track geometry.
Dilbert - not quite accurate. A change in track geometry is not always due to subsidence, although it is a problem, for instance on embankments in some geological conditions where dry periods in summer can be a real problem. Tamping or Stoneblowing cannot correct wet beds however, although they can sometimes be deployed to affect a temporary improvement in track geometry. If you don't dig out a wet bed, it will only be a temporary fix, and tamping does itself degrade ballast and shorten track life, so it's always an engineering balance.
If you want to see more, then Tampers utilised in the UK are built by either Plasser & Theurer, or Matisa. Stoneblowers are built by Harsco Rail. They all have pretty good websites. Or for the nerdy, then there are plenty of Plant Spotters' Websites.
Firstly, it sounds like it was either a Tamper or a Stoneblower. PM me with your location and the date, and I'll find out.
Secondly, either tamping or stoneblowing can be deployed either as routine maintenance, or in response to a track geometry issue (for instance to remove either an emergency or a temporary speed restriction imposed as a result of a track fault). In either case, the purpose is to either lift the track, or to move it laterally; neither machine can lower the track. In the case of tamping, the track and sleeper is lifted, and the tines vibrate until the ballast effectively behaves as a liquid, and the sleeper is left in a position either in accordance with a design or a position determined by the machine software. Stoneblowing injects new stone under the sleepers to achieve a change in track geometry.
Dilbert - not quite accurate. A change in track geometry is not always due to subsidence, although it is a problem, for instance on embankments in some geological conditions where dry periods in summer can be a real problem. Tamping or Stoneblowing cannot correct wet beds however, although they can sometimes be deployed to affect a temporary improvement in track geometry. If you don't dig out a wet bed, it will only be a temporary fix, and tamping does itself degrade ballast and shorten track life, so it's always an engineering balance.
If you want to see more, then Tampers utilised in the UK are built by either Plasser & Theurer, or Matisa. Stoneblowers are built by Harsco Rail. They all have pretty good websites. Or for the nerdy, then there are plenty of Plant Spotters' Websites.
Rude Girl said:
I think I might be described as being 'in the know' - it's certainly in my job description!!
Firstly, it sounds like it was either a Tamper or a Stoneblower. PM me with your location and the date, and I'll find out.
Secondly, either tamping or stoneblowing can be deployed either as routine maintenance, or in response to a track geometry issue (for instance to remove either an emergency or a temporary speed restriction imposed as a result of a track fault). In either case, the purpose is to either lift the track, or to move it laterally; neither machine can lower the track. In the case of tamping, the track and sleeper is lifted, and the tines vibrate until the ballast effectively behaves as a liquid, and the sleeper is left in a position either in accordance with a design or a position determined by the machine software. Stoneblowing injects new stone under the sleepers to achieve a change in track geometry.
Dilbert - not quite accurate. A change in track geometry is not always due to subsidence, although it is a problem, for instance on embankments in some geological conditions where dry periods in summer can be a real problem. Tamping or Stoneblowing cannot correct wet beds however, although they can sometimes be deployed to affect a temporary improvement in track geometry. If you don't dig out a wet bed, it will only be a temporary fix, and tamping does itself degrade ballast and shorten track life, so it's always an engineering balance.
If you want to see more, then Tampers utilised in the UK are built by either Plasser & Theurer, or Matisa. Stoneblowers are built by Harsco Rail. They all have pretty good websites. Or for the nerdy, then there are plenty of Plant Spotters' Websites.
Im guessig you're either a P-way or Renwals manager?Firstly, it sounds like it was either a Tamper or a Stoneblower. PM me with your location and the date, and I'll find out.
Secondly, either tamping or stoneblowing can be deployed either as routine maintenance, or in response to a track geometry issue (for instance to remove either an emergency or a temporary speed restriction imposed as a result of a track fault). In either case, the purpose is to either lift the track, or to move it laterally; neither machine can lower the track. In the case of tamping, the track and sleeper is lifted, and the tines vibrate until the ballast effectively behaves as a liquid, and the sleeper is left in a position either in accordance with a design or a position determined by the machine software. Stoneblowing injects new stone under the sleepers to achieve a change in track geometry.
Dilbert - not quite accurate. A change in track geometry is not always due to subsidence, although it is a problem, for instance on embankments in some geological conditions where dry periods in summer can be a real problem. Tamping or Stoneblowing cannot correct wet beds however, although they can sometimes be deployed to affect a temporary improvement in track geometry. If you don't dig out a wet bed, it will only be a temporary fix, and tamping does itself degrade ballast and shorten track life, so it's always an engineering balance.
If you want to see more, then Tampers utilised in the UK are built by either Plasser & Theurer, or Matisa. Stoneblowers are built by Harsco Rail. They all have pretty good websites. Or for the nerdy, then there are plenty of Plant Spotters' Websites.
Rude Girl said:
Dilbert - not quite accurate. A change in track geometry is not always due to subsidence, although it is a problem, for instance on embankments in some geological conditions where dry periods in summer can be a real problem. Tamping or Stoneblowing cannot correct wet beds however, although they can sometimes be deployed to affect a temporary improvement in track geometry. If you don't dig out a wet bed, it will only be a temporary fix, and tamping does itself degrade ballast and shorten track life, so it's always an engineering balance.
I wouldn't disagree with that. It's just that the OP, asked if Tamping was a maintenance issue, or a fault fixing issue.I was trying to suggest that subsidence and water were a fault, and that small misalignments will naturally occur as a result of wear and tear and require maintenance.
I don't think either of us got it quite right till just there!
The point I thought about but didn't bother with, is that not only does increased misalignment lead to increasing misalignment, but that also; tamping will only work so many times. You said that the tamping degrades the ballast, and that is pretty important.
In the end I guess there's no real alternative but to lift the track completely. I presume that the engineering balance, attempts to get the rail to wear out at the same time as the ballast.
Edited by dilbert on Sunday 18th July 19:29
V8mate said:
Rude Girl said:
working class said:
Im guessig you're either a P-way or Renwals manager?
Nope 
she makes a corking brew to be fair, but if they're paying that much for a tea lady, I suggest you get your missus to find a job there! Mr Rude.
Now we're getting somewhere. After a lengthy trawl, I'm pretty sure that this was the company doing the work (I was thinking collac, collec so just kept googling..)
http://www.colasrail.co.uk/index.htm
So, I can narrow it down to one of these..
Plasser & Theurer 08-4x4/4S-RT Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 08-12/4x4C-RT Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 08-16/4x4C100-RT Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 08-16/32 U-RT Tamper
Matisa B41 UE Universal Tampers
Plasser & Theurer 08-275 S & C Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 09-32 Tamper
http://www.colasrail.co.uk/index.htm
So, I can narrow it down to one of these..
Plasser & Theurer 08-4x4/4S-RT Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 08-12/4x4C-RT Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 08-16/4x4C100-RT Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 08-16/32 U-RT Tamper
Matisa B41 UE Universal Tampers
Plasser & Theurer 08-275 S & C Tamper
Plasser & Theurer 09-32 Tamper
Edited by UncleRic on Sunday 18th July 19:44
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