volkswagen tsi or pd
Discussion
The wife needs (wants...) a newer car, must fit 3 kids seats across the back seat and must be auto. We have narrowed it down to either a toyota corolla verso or vw touran.
The budget is about 9k.
The verso only comes in a 1.8 petrol but we could get a 2.0 diesel vw with the dsg. They also do the vw with the 1.4 tsi engine and dsg although i can't find any for sale 2nd hand at any price.
Does anyone have any experiance of these cars, in particular the long term reliability of the tsi engine?
The budget is about 9k.
The verso only comes in a 1.8 petrol but we could get a 2.0 diesel vw with the dsg. They also do the vw with the 1.4 tsi engine and dsg although i can't find any for sale 2nd hand at any price.
Does anyone have any experiance of these cars, in particular the long term reliability of the tsi engine?
Not being silly, but if you want an auto you may be better off with a big estate than a people carrier. From my experience as a 6ft teenager in the back of cars with two younger teenage brothers there is no real space benefit between a people carrier and a big estate. The MPVs in your budget are all fairly average but for the same money you could pick up a 5 year old BMW 525d, a 5 year old Mercedes E220/270/280/320CDI or, at at push a 5 year old Audi A6 2.0 TDi. Seriously, I would look at them at least. If they really are not an option then I would go with the Verso. In my experince the Verso is very well thought out, well built, rides well and very quiet and the Touran rides like a brick on stilts and is very dark and depressing to travel in.
We already have a big estate (outback), but she's a nanny so needs the flexability of 7 seats when necessary, all the children are under 5 so leg room is not really an issue.
Milage won't be that high, not more than 10,000 miles, although I do want decent fuel economy and decent performance... that's why I'm thinking the 2.0 diesel or 1.4 TSI, I don't think the 1.8 in the toyota will offer then performance of the VW engines.
Milage won't be that high, not more than 10,000 miles, although I do want decent fuel economy and decent performance... that's why I'm thinking the 2.0 diesel or 1.4 TSI, I don't think the 1.8 in the toyota will offer then performance of the VW engines.
Across the VAG range, be it VW/Audi/Seat/Skoda, the 1.4TSI has more or less fully replaced the 1.9/2.0TDI engines. A year or two ago, it was all TDI, in every BHP variant, now it appears to be 1.4TSI, in every BHP variant. The 1.9TDI is still available, but even business users are switching to 1.4TSI. On our own company fleet we have had several such changes, my own Fabia 1.9TDI vRS, is now going to be a 1.4TSI vRS, and my colleagues 1.9TDI Octavia is going to be a 1.4TSI. Petrol is cheaper, emissions are lower, the cars go better, drive better, and do similar MPG to the outgoing TDI.
Balmoral Green said:
Across the VAG range, be it VW/Audi/Seat/Skoda, the 1.4TSI has more or less fully replaced the 1.9/2.0TDI engines. A year or two ago, it was all TDI, in every BHP variant, now it appears to be 1.4TSI, in every BHP variant. The 1.9TDI is still available, but even business users are switching to 1.4TSI. On our own company fleet we have had several such changes, my own Fabia 1.9TDI vRS, is now going to be a 1.4TSI vRS, and my colleagues 1.9TDI Octavia is going to be a 1.4TSI. Petrol is cheaper, emissions are lower, the cars go better, drive better, and do similar MPG to the outgoing TDI.
Not sure about that - given that you can get a 1.6TDI in standard and 'Bluemotion' trim, plus a 2.0TDI in 140 and 170bhp variants - also with 'Bluemotion Tech' options.The 1.9 has now gone, replaced by the 1.6.
1.6TDI 'Bluemotions' are stupidly economical and cheaper on company car tax than anything this side of a hybrid.
I think the Auto is your biggest problem here - seems few manufacturers can do an autobox these days that is not a time bomb reliability wise.
Check on Honest John regarding the Toyota 'auto' box. Its is one of the semi-auto jobbies that has a clutch and solenoids that change gear for you - not a nice torque converter box. Seems to be many complaints about the box playing up, not selecting gear, getting stuck in gear etc.
If I were buying a TSI + DSG I would get something within warranty -I may be scaremongering here but the DSG box and TSI technology is relatively new tech so not that much data out yet on reliability. Great combo though and give diesel torque and good fuel economy without the diesel and auto box drawbacks..
As an aside the Ford CVT box that was on the Focus Cmax failed badly and on HJ they actually say DO NOT buy one. Audi's CVT box is full of issues too, even good old Honda have issues on their CVT box on the Jazz.....
It sees the only 'family' cars that used a good old tried and trusted ZF torque converter auto box are the German trio Merc/BMW/Audi(some models only for Audi). Doesnt the 5 series/class/A6 have optional kids seats for the boot? These estates are fair bit longer than Verso/Touran and you don't sit as high so wife might not like it.
Word of caution though - read to much Honest John and you will not buy any car as it seems all have some faults!!
Edit to add: what about Honda FRV (6 SEATER WITH 3 PROPER SEATS IN 2 ROWS), Fiat Multipla, Mazda 5. I am not sure if any come in Auto though.
Check on Honest John regarding the Toyota 'auto' box. Its is one of the semi-auto jobbies that has a clutch and solenoids that change gear for you - not a nice torque converter box. Seems to be many complaints about the box playing up, not selecting gear, getting stuck in gear etc.
If I were buying a TSI + DSG I would get something within warranty -I may be scaremongering here but the DSG box and TSI technology is relatively new tech so not that much data out yet on reliability. Great combo though and give diesel torque and good fuel economy without the diesel and auto box drawbacks..
As an aside the Ford CVT box that was on the Focus Cmax failed badly and on HJ they actually say DO NOT buy one. Audi's CVT box is full of issues too, even good old Honda have issues on their CVT box on the Jazz.....
It sees the only 'family' cars that used a good old tried and trusted ZF torque converter auto box are the German trio Merc/BMW/Audi(some models only for Audi). Doesnt the 5 series/class/A6 have optional kids seats for the boot? These estates are fair bit longer than Verso/Touran and you don't sit as high so wife might not like it.
Word of caution though - read to much Honest John and you will not buy any car as it seems all have some faults!!
Edit to add: what about Honda FRV (6 SEATER WITH 3 PROPER SEATS IN 2 ROWS), Fiat Multipla, Mazda 5. I am not sure if any come in Auto though.
Edited by Dino D on Saturday 21st August 15:40
Thanks for the replies. The 'newness' of the TSI, DSG combo is really what is worrying me - seems a lots of bits to go wrong!
We have looked at FRV & Multipla - my daughter sitting in the front of her current car drives her nuts - kicking the dash, pressing the buttons, being a 3 year old etc....
We have a mazda 5 at the moment - can't fit 3 seats across the middle row, and pretty awful to drive - probably a mistake purchase... hopefully not to be repeated...
We have looked at FRV & Multipla - my daughter sitting in the front of her current car drives her nuts - kicking the dash, pressing the buttons, being a 3 year old etc....
We have a mazda 5 at the moment - can't fit 3 seats across the middle row, and pretty awful to drive - probably a mistake purchase... hopefully not to be repeated...
TSIs suffer from misfires. And various sensor faults. Including one car misfiring like the preverbial whilst being PDI'd! Sometimes it's more serious though and we've seen a few major mechanicals required. They ain't fun to work on either.
DSG's suffer from the mechatronics getting jerky. Mainly the older ones mind.
PD's suffer from misfires (as in fairness do most german modern Tdi's) And EGR valves and throttle bodies getting horribly gunked up. Oh and don't forget the DPF "issues"
DSG's suffer from the mechatronics getting jerky. Mainly the older ones mind.
PD's suffer from misfires (as in fairness do most german modern Tdi's) And EGR valves and throttle bodies getting horribly gunked up. Oh and don't forget the DPF "issues"
edthedead said:
We have a mazda 5 at the moment - can't fit 3 seats across the middle row, and pretty awful to drive - probably a mistake purchase... hopefully not to be repeated...
Didn't know that about the 5, looks great from the outside and I love the sliding doors. Haven't seen one yet where I am though.What about the Sharan/Galaxy/Alhambra combo? I know they get bad reliability reviews but I believe it is very engine dependent. My experience is of a Sharan 2,8 VR6 that did only medium and long trips out of town in South Africa. This meant with 3-6 adults and high cruising speeds on what in UK is called an A-road.
Of course the VR6 was thirsty but it was a great drive and 100% reliable over 60kmiles. It was a manual though but come in auto. Also drove briefly a 1,8t model. Was not as pokey but more than adequate. Again it was manual but I think they do come in auto.
Not tried the diesel but I believe you have a choice of the older VW/Ford TDI/TDCI engines.
Lots of cabin room ad very flexible seating all with individual chairs - only pain are the heavy seats but only an issues if you remove them often. Each seat slides back and forth.
Still looks fresh and was very ahead of it's time when it came out.
edthedead said:
Thanks for the replies. The 'newness' of the TSI, DSG combo is really what is worrying me - seems a lots of bits to go wrong!
We have looked at FRV & Multipla - my daughter sitting in the front of her current car drives her nuts - kicking the dash, pressing the buttons, being a 3 year old etc....
We have a mazda 5 at the moment - can't fit 3 seats across the middle row, and pretty awful to drive - probably a mistake purchase... hopefully not to be repeated...
"my daughter sitting in the front of her current car drives her nuts - kicking the dash, pressing the buttons, being a 3 year old " - sounds more of a discipline problem than a car problem. And yes I do have kids (well did, they're grown up now). Any kid of mine would only kick the dash once.We have looked at FRV & Multipla - my daughter sitting in the front of her current car drives her nuts - kicking the dash, pressing the buttons, being a 3 year old etc....
We have a mazda 5 at the moment - can't fit 3 seats across the middle row, and pretty awful to drive - probably a mistake purchase... hopefully not to be repeated...
CinqAbarth said:
HellDiver said:
Verso does come with a diesel - the 2.2 D4D. We have one at work. I'm not sure why you're saying it only comes with a 1.8 petrol, because it clearly doesn't.
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