Discussion
260mm disc upgrade easiest using ford bits - loads of threads on it - sierra xr4i discs (not xr4x4) and calipers and carriers from an xr4i or xr4x4 or later models with ABS. Make sure you get the caliper mounting brackets with the calipers if using secondhand bits.
There is a bigger option where you have to drill the upright and use spacers - I can't offer any advice I went 260mm.
There is a bigger option where you have to drill the upright and use spacers - I can't offer any advice I went 260mm.
What size discs do you have at present. Are they 240mm dia?
If so you can go to 260mm by using the standard Chim/Griff 500 brakes, or go up to 283mm dia by using Escort or Sierra 4x4 cossie or Scorpio Cossie front calipers and carriers, with a 283mm RWD Sierra Cossie disc. The RWD disc is needed for the correct offset - dont use the 4x4 cossie disk. No need to drill uprights with this, all you will need to do is to put a washer between the caliper carier and the hub to centralise the caliper over the disc, and relieve some of the caliper carrier so that the 283mm disc doesnt rub.
Its a very easy diy job.
If so you can go to 260mm by using the standard Chim/Griff 500 brakes, or go up to 283mm dia by using Escort or Sierra 4x4 cossie or Scorpio Cossie front calipers and carriers, with a 283mm RWD Sierra Cossie disc. The RWD disc is needed for the correct offset - dont use the 4x4 cossie disk. No need to drill uprights with this, all you will need to do is to put a washer between the caliper carier and the hub to centralise the caliper over the disc, and relieve some of the caliper carrier so that the 283mm disc doesnt rub.
Its a very easy diy job.
Marty V8 said:
What size discs do you have at present. Are they 240mm dia?
If so you can go to 260mm by using the standard Chim/Griff 500 brakes, or go up to 283mm dia by using Escort or Sierra 4x4 cossie or Scorpio Cossie front calipers and carriers, with a 283mm RWD Sierra Cossie disc. The RWD disc is needed for the correct offset - dont use the 4x4 cossie disk. No need to drill uprights with this, all you will need to do is to put a washer between the caliper carier and the hub to centralise the caliper over the disc, and relieve some of the caliper carrier so that the 283mm disc doesnt rub.
Its a very easy diy job.
I have 260mm discsIf so you can go to 260mm by using the standard Chim/Griff 500 brakes, or go up to 283mm dia by using Escort or Sierra 4x4 cossie or Scorpio Cossie front calipers and carriers, with a 283mm RWD Sierra Cossie disc. The RWD disc is needed for the correct offset - dont use the 4x4 cossie disk. No need to drill uprights with this, all you will need to do is to put a washer between the caliper carier and the hub to centralise the caliper over the disc, and relieve some of the caliper carrier so that the 283mm disc doesnt rub.
Its a very easy diy job.
found these on e-bay, are they the correct ones
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FORD-SIERRA-RS-COSWORTH-4X4-...
They look like the ones - its the single piston caliper type that you are after rather than the 4 pot RWD Sierra Cosworth. If they are Escort Cossie they should have 888 and 887 cast into the bodies of the caliper.
I got a second hand set and refurbed them myself - £70 for the calipers, £20ish for a seal kit and £10 for VHT paint. However, buying a recon set certainly makes it a much less messy job.
However, If you are going to put 17" rims on, you can get much bigger brakes which will fill the space behind the rims better, although they are more expensive than this setup. I imagine the retardation with a big brake setup is nothing short of eyeball popping.
I got a second hand set and refurbed them myself - £70 for the calipers, £20ish for a seal kit and £10 for VHT paint. However, buying a recon set certainly makes it a much less messy job.
However, If you are going to put 17" rims on, you can get much bigger brakes which will fill the space behind the rims better, although they are more expensive than this setup. I imagine the retardation with a big brake setup is nothing short of eyeball popping.
Edited by Marty V8 on Sunday 22 August 11:55
if using 17" wheels you can go up to 320mm discs, but it will cost a bit more to do, AP clipers with 320 discs were on my car and filled the space behind the wheel up nicely, Dnb has done a nice conversion using discs a bit bigger.
you can buy kits, but these can cost a good 1k or so, but if you do it yourself there are a lot of savings to be made, you can get 322mm ford focus st 4 stud discs for around £60 each, then depending on the caliper choice make up the spacer brackets to suit,it will take a bit of trial and error making sure it all fits behind the wheel with a bit of clearance, also the disc offsets are different to the existing set up,so as long as you measure it all up accurately and have some spacers for the calipers machined properly you can do all of this yourself if you are a rerasonably competent diy mechanic/engineer.
and don`t forget to use the correct H12 bolts.
you can buy kits, but these can cost a good 1k or so, but if you do it yourself there are a lot of savings to be made, you can get 322mm ford focus st 4 stud discs for around £60 each, then depending on the caliper choice make up the spacer brackets to suit,it will take a bit of trial and error making sure it all fits behind the wheel with a bit of clearance, also the disc offsets are different to the existing set up,so as long as you measure it all up accurately and have some spacers for the calipers machined properly you can do all of this yourself if you are a rerasonably competent diy mechanic/engineer.
and don`t forget to use the correct H12 bolts.
The disc I used for a 283mm conversion is the front disc from a 2wd Sierra Cosworth. Part references (amongst others) are Quinton Hazell BDC3728 for a plain vented disc or the one I used EBC GD483 which is a grooved and dimpled disc.
Any motor factors will be able to cross reference the above numbers for other makes such as Mintex etc.
Its then a 'simple' matter of finding/obtaining front calipers and mounting brackets from a Granada Scorpio Cosworth (Mine came off a '92 model but I suspect these are getting thin on the ground?). I had to drill out the 10mm upright mounting holes to 12mm and mount with a thin spacer/washer, I found a 1.5mm thick M12 washer centred the caliper to the disc just right, but I guess this may vary according to individual car tolerances.
I suggest trial assembly to check clearances between the outer disc edge and the caliper body and the mounting brackets. A small amount of relieving maybe necessary to get adequate clearance, I found a few minutes with a file did the trick.
I used Mintex MDB1407M1144 pads to suit the calipers.
This is just my experience and has worked well on my car, BUT brakes are so important (understatement!) if you are unsure of your technical abilities you should leave this sort of modification work to a competent professional.
ETA Forgot to mention as Clive has said the spacers/washers should be parallel faced to ensure clamping forces of the mounting bolt are transferred to the upright
Any motor factors will be able to cross reference the above numbers for other makes such as Mintex etc.
Its then a 'simple' matter of finding/obtaining front calipers and mounting brackets from a Granada Scorpio Cosworth (Mine came off a '92 model but I suspect these are getting thin on the ground?). I had to drill out the 10mm upright mounting holes to 12mm and mount with a thin spacer/washer, I found a 1.5mm thick M12 washer centred the caliper to the disc just right, but I guess this may vary according to individual car tolerances.
I suggest trial assembly to check clearances between the outer disc edge and the caliper body and the mounting brackets. A small amount of relieving maybe necessary to get adequate clearance, I found a few minutes with a file did the trick.
I used Mintex MDB1407M1144 pads to suit the calipers.
This is just my experience and has worked well on my car, BUT brakes are so important (understatement!) if you are unsure of your technical abilities you should leave this sort of modification work to a competent professional.
ETA Forgot to mention as Clive has said the spacers/washers should be parallel faced to ensure clamping forces of the mounting bolt are transferred to the upright
Edited by MisterT on Sunday 22 August 12:33
Clive mentioned my name in one of his posts... I used Ford Focus RS discs (324mm) and calipers (4 pot aluminium - so very light) and had an adaptor plate made up that bolts on to the standard hubs. I have 17" wheels on the front, but it should be OK with 16" wheels. It's a similar idea to the Godspeed conversion for the Impreza.
Here's a couple of development photos:
ETA: I think I have a couple of the adaptor plates still kicking around, so it shouldn't be too hard to put together a kit if anyone can source the calipers.
Here's a couple of development photos:
ETA: I think I have a couple of the adaptor plates still kicking around, so it shouldn't be too hard to put together a kit if anyone can source the calipers.
Edited by dnb on Sunday 22 August 13:08
dnb said:
Clive mentioned my name in one of his posts... I used Ford Focus RS discs (324mm) and calipers (4 pot aluminium - so very light) and had an adaptor plate made up that bolts on to the standard hubs. I have 17" wheels on the front, but it should be OK with 16" wheels. It's a similar idea to the Godspeed conversion for the Impreza.
Here's a couple of development photos:
ETA: I think I have a couple of the adaptor plates still kicking around, so it shouldn't be too hard to put together a kit if anyone can source the calipers.
PM Sent.Here's a couple of development photos:
ETA: I think I have a couple of the adaptor plates still kicking around, so it shouldn't be too hard to put together a kit if anyone can source the calipers.
Edited by dnb on Sunday 22 August 13:08
Going to be using 17" wheels on front so clearance shouldnt be a problem.
What year Focus RS are the Calipers &^ discs off that you used.
clive f said:
Barkychoc said:
Hansdaal Has been selling good value kits - drop him a PM he may have some left.
but you can save £500 and do it yourself.AP calipers £400 a pair commonly
Rotors are Hi Spec's and are £206.80
Bells I don't know the price of . .
Then you'll need brackets for the calipers
Pads, your able to choose here, but DS2500's are £92 unless you buy the set in the classified currently.
So far then, that's £698.80, without the brackets or bells for the rotors . . . You'll have to work out the dimensions etc for those . .Say £100 for the rotors at least and you're already at £800 before you start with getting the brackets fabricated if you can't do it yourself.
This is to replicate Hans kit exactly, if you want to do it with disks then I'm sure there are other options, but I know Hans is likely doing a lot less of the kits as it's not worth it due to costs of calipers these days as there's less and less available second hand.
Doing the kit slightly differently I can't cost up as I've never had too. There are lot's of 4 pot options, Wilwoods, Hi Spec and others . . . The Hans kit is good value for money for what you get. I'm biased as I've done 30k + miles with mine and have had to change the rotors recently as I've worn them out . .
To replicate his kit exactly for £600, is going well I'd suggest . ..
dnb said:
My upgrade came in for much less than £600.
Discs were 108 (standard Ford part)
Calipers were 120 (2nd hand, and plenty on sale)
Pads were over 100, don't remember exactly.
I allowed 50 for the kit of bits for the fittings.
So all done for about £400.
I'm not questioning the costs for a second of your kit DNB, just that replicating Hans kit for £600 is not going to happen without luck, a fair wind and doing some of the fab yourself.Discs were 108 (standard Ford part)
Calipers were 120 (2nd hand, and plenty on sale)
Pads were over 100, don't remember exactly.
I allowed 50 for the kit of bits for the fittings.
So all done for about £400.
Will it really fit under a 16" rim ?
Not intending to argue about Hans' kit. To me it seems a fair price, but it uses too many low volume manufacture parts... That's why I built mine from the Ford parts bin.
I dropped the hub assembly in one of my Estorils before I sold them, and clearance was there but very small. I am not convinced that all 16" runs will work.
I dropped the hub assembly in one of my Estorils before I sold them, and clearance was there but very small. I am not convinced that all 16" runs will work.
Johno said:
clive f said:
Barkychoc said:
Hansdaal Has been selling good value kits - drop him a PM he may have some left.
but you can save £500 and do it yourself.AP calipers £400 a pair commonly
Rotors are Hi Spec's and are £206.80
Bells I don't know the price of . .
Then you'll need brackets for the calipers
Pads, your able to choose here, but DS2500's are £92 unless you buy the set in the classified currently.
So far then, that's £698.80, without the brackets or bells for the rotors . . . You'll have to work out the dimensions etc for those . .Say £100 for the rotors at least and you're already at £800 before you start with getting the brackets fabricated if you can't do it yourself.
This is to replicate Hans kit exactly, if you want to do it with disks then I'm sure there are other options, but I know Hans is likely doing a lot less of the kits as it's not worth it due to costs of calipers these days as there's less and less available second hand.
Doing the kit slightly differently I can't cost up as I've never had too. There are lot's of 4 pot options, Wilwoods, Hi Spec and others . . . The Hans kit is good value for money for what you get. I'm biased as I've done 30k + miles with mine and have had to change the rotors recently as I've worn them out . .
To replicate his kit exactly for £600, is going well I'd suggest . ..
many people on here have been down this road, and have saved a few quid, however if you want convinience just get out the plastic.
I'm sure you could scour the bay and classified and pick up some cheaper and knock up the rest of the kit but it strikes me as odd that the wisdom of the forum is to do the job yourself ? That seems at odds to the normal flurry of "it's a safety item, don't skip on costs" etc etc that normally comes in these threads (I know well . . . 
)
The basis of Hans kit is the Hi Spec kit for the Griffith and Chimaera, who I think know more about brakes than anyone else I've encountered on this forum. Given the abuse mine take, versus making it up myself, I know where my monies going when I'm trying to stop as I come down the Furkapass, then the Grimselpass, then the Sustenpass and then up the Gotthard Pass . . . you get the idea.
Hans kits have been fitted to a large number of cars, have produced the results as they're based on a known upgrade from a respected supplier. I don't get a discount for my comments supporting them, I don't look for one either. What I do is use my car a lot and demand a lot from the braking set up I have . . ..
To the OP, you pays your money and takes your choice. . . . I could quite happily make up a kit, it's not that hard as has been said, however, I take my choice of tried and tested but costs a bit and apply that in an equation over hours in garage measuring hub, spacers, sourcing disks, checking clearances etc and decide I'd prefer to be driving and using the brakes instead .. . .
)The basis of Hans kit is the Hi Spec kit for the Griffith and Chimaera, who I think know more about brakes than anyone else I've encountered on this forum. Given the abuse mine take, versus making it up myself, I know where my monies going when I'm trying to stop as I come down the Furkapass, then the Grimselpass, then the Sustenpass and then up the Gotthard Pass . . . you get the idea.
Hans kits have been fitted to a large number of cars, have produced the results as they're based on a known upgrade from a respected supplier. I don't get a discount for my comments supporting them, I don't look for one either. What I do is use my car a lot and demand a lot from the braking set up I have . . ..
To the OP, you pays your money and takes your choice. . . . I could quite happily make up a kit, it's not that hard as has been said, however, I take my choice of tried and tested but costs a bit and apply that in an equation over hours in garage measuring hub, spacers, sourcing disks, checking clearances etc and decide I'd prefer to be driving and using the brakes instead .. . .
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