Stupid towing question...

[Crazy Torque]

Can anyone answer this - once in a while I need to tow a large trailer, in the past I've used a Jeep. All fine, but I'd rather something more interesting, like an Audi RS4.

So, is having turboed 500BHP estate suitable for towing (compared to 4.0 litre V8), or is this some kind of hot air horsepower that doesn't really compare to 'real' engine power, with the torques and displacement?

[busta]

I tow an 18ft flat bed trailer with a 122hp Volvo, I think you'll be fine.

[Cecil]

IIRC Audi do not recommend towing with the RS6, not 100% sure about the RS4.

[sunbeam_alpine]

Generally, 4x4's are allowed to tow heavier trailers than normal cars - think more in term of control under braking etc. than actually being able to pull. What is the total weight of the trailer you want to tow?

[Superhoop]

Before jumping in and buying an RS4, check that it's actually approved for towing.....

Not certain if it was the RS4 or RS6 but remember reading that they are not approved for towing... If I remember it right, it was something to do with the gearbox not coping with full power whilst towing - Audi will invalidate the warranty if a tow bar has been installed

[rallycross]

2 things to worry about

1) fuel bills (think 10 mpg)

2) will it blow up?

I blew up my low mileage cosworth sierra when I foolishly tried to tow a mastercraft ski boat to scotland with it. Probably would have been fine if I'd driven gently but the temptation got the better of me to show what 280 bhp could do(280 bhp was a lot back in those days!).

Last turbo tow car i had was a T5 vovlo it went ok, but only managed about 12 mpg and i was only towing an 800 kg race car on the trailer.

[Animal]

Audi did not type approve the RS4 (B5 and B7) for towing; I'd assume that any warranty you have would be invalidated.

Evo ran an RS6 as a long-term test car and reported that there was a chance that the gearbox oil would overheat http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/evolongtermtests/2.... Presumably this would only happen on a Run What Trailer Ya Brung day at Santa Pod...

However, it looks like there are plenty of tow bars that would fit an RS4.

[v8will]

Crazy Torque said:

Can anyone answer this - once in a while I need to tow a large trailer, in the past I've used a Jeep. All fine, but I'd rather something more interesting, like an Audi RS4.

So, is having turboed 500BHP estate suitable for towing (compared to 4.0 litre V8), or is this some kind of hot air horsepower that doesn't really compare to 'real' engine power, with the torques and displacement?

Large in size or heavy?

Torque and power measurements are pretty standardised. Of course how the engine makes the power and torque makes the differences. Just bear in mind that a standard TD5 Landrover is rated to pull 3500KG with around 136BHP, of course it will have the gearing and chassis strength to do that day in day out.

You might be better to hire a suitable tow car when needed than risk damaging something like an RS4

[jbi]

it's not just power output, you need to consider chassis strength and vehicle weight.

For towing typically you want a heavier vehicle for stability, preferably with a full frame for durability and strength.

Personally I would not tow anything of any significant size or weight with a car... you tend to want to leave a bit of headroom and not run the vehicle at it's maximum capacities.

you also run the risk of overheating and ruining your turbo as it was not built with towing in mind and will lack adequate cooling.

Edited by jbi on Wednesday 25th August 00:21

[davepoth]

If you want something interesting that can tow, get something else American, maybe a Mustang.

[NiceCupOfTea]

Guy who had my 900 T16S before me towed a large caravan with it - it's now on 180k miles, original turbo, engine & gearbox.

The only possible issue with towing with a turbocharged car is a lack of low down torque depending on the way it's set up. Anything remotely modern will have a more progressive power delivery than early turbos and so will be fine.

My dad has towed trailers and caravans for years with Saab 9000 turbos (and a Rover 600ti IIRC) with no problems at all.

As previously said, it's about weight - you want something fairly substantial.

[scorcher]

Also bear in mind that if the car hasn't been approved for towing ( IE no towing weights on the V5)and you then fit a towbar and tow with it and have an accident you may not be covered by your insurance.

[bull996]

So what about vans? I am looking at them, and for example a 2.5 diesel has very low bhp, but they seem to tow OK...so how does that work?

[joe_90]

I think (also) I read in Evo about no towbars on the rs models.

However, I use a Honda Accord Type-S 2.4 to tow my e36 around with no issues, It drives fine, brakes fine, and pulls away on hills with no worries.

Edited by joe_90 on Wednesday 25th August 08:44

[Bluebarge]

bull996 said:

So what about vans? I am looking at them, and for example a 2.5 diesel has very low bhp, but they seem to tow OK...so how does that work?

Torque is more important for towing than BHP.

All cars have an approved tow weight (or are not approved for towing - gen high performance or v.small eg Ford Ka). This will be stated in the vehicle handbook, on the stats section of the makers website (or if not in production, on something like parkers website) and sometimes in publications like What Car. You should never exceed this tow weight and it is generally best to avoid getting too close to it - a bit of headroom will put less strain on the clutch etc. It is also recommended that the trailer weight should not exceed 85% of the vehicle weight unless you are experienced at towing; otherwise you can end up with the tail wagging the dog.

[GreatGranny]

bull996 said:

So what about vans? I am looking at them, and for example a 2.5 diesel has very low bhp, but they seem to tow OK...so how does that work?

What?!? Just because pikeys do it!

Strictly speaking you shouldn't go much above 85% of the cars max weight. This is recommended by the Caravan Club.

Also watch for nose weights, ie. the weight on the towing eye. There is a recommended limit and most go over this.

A vehicle with a short rear overhang such as a 4x4 or MPV are ideal for towing.

I tow a 1.4 tonne caravan with a Alhambra TDi 130bhp. Fully loaded with family etc. the whole thing must weight about 3.3 tonnes yet it pulls really well and is very stable at 60-65 on the motorway.
My Mondeo 2.0l petrol estate before that wasn't.

[XG332]

No real help, but i saw a Cobra towing a caravan last month. Not sure if it was a real or replica tho.

[busta]

GreatGranny said:

bull996 said:

So what about vans? I am looking at them, and for example a 2.5 diesel has very low bhp, but they seem to tow OK...so how does that work?

What?!? Just because pikeys do it!

Strictly speaking you shouldn't go much above 85% of the cars max weight. This is recommended by the Caravan Club.

Also watch for nose weights, ie. the weight on the towing eye. There is a recommended limit and most go over this.

A vehicle with a short rear overhang such as a 4x4 or MPV are ideal for towing.

I tow a 1.4 tonne caravan with a Alhambra TDi 130bhp. Fully loaded with family etc. the whole thing must weight about 3.3 tonnes yet it pulls really well and is very stable at 60-65 on the motorway.
My Mondeo 2.0l petrol estate before that wasn't.

That's caravans though, which have a massive volume/weight ratio. Towing 2 tonnes of bricks on an 8x5ft trailer is a totally different kettle of fish to a 2 tonne, twin axle, 24ft caravan so the 85% rule does not apply for all towing. Towing 200% is perfectly reasonable if the numbers all add up (1.7 tonne landrover 90 with 3.5 tonne trailer, do it all day long, no probs.)

Edited by busta on Wednesday 25th August 18:22

[netherfield]

My nephew has a Nissan double cab pickup which he got when the nipper came along,seems these are designed more for recreation than work,1st gear is too high to start off on a hill and consequently the clutch gets hammered,previously had the single cab version which was no problem.

[cptsideways]

It all very well towing a heavy load with a normal car until you need to pull away on an incline.

I used to tow with my drift car & trailer all up weight about 1800kg with my V70 estate Volvo, it would manage fine until you got stuck at a junction with a hill involved. Cue lots of tyre smoke or clutch smoke the choice was yours my theory was tyres are cheaper than a clutch, forward progress was rather difficult at times.

Same scenario with an Omega estate RWD, somewhere near the centre of Sheffield, some steep hill & traffic lights, no chance of pulling away in any shape or form & no chance of spinning the wheels, cue one lunched clutch.

Ended up buying a proper towcar, my Landcruiser 4.2 td no issues whatsover to date, handbook states it will tow 8 tons off road Though I did pull a 40 tonner with it once on the ice & snow, (rather easily I might add) I know of plenty of people who have destroyed Navara clutches when towing with them, seems a common fault.