Replacement for the Cerbera 4.5, suggestions plz

[Methanol]

Hi all,

Well the Cerbera is officially a write off, so I’m looking for a replacement but I don’t know what to go for.

I’m not sure whether I want to go for another TVR or not, however if I did I quite fancy the Tuscan S but I’m a bit concerned about the performance figures quoted by TVR, I have not heard of anyone getting more than 179 mph max which is aways off 195+, and not to mention the inflated bhp figures. When it comes to events like vmax, and such this does bother me. And last but not least the dreaded reliability issues; although I am hopeful that if I do go the TVR route again I would be luckier this time around.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Thx guys

Methanol

>>> Edited by Methanol on Saturday 27th March 13:17

[GCerbera]

Sorry to hear this.

Not knowing what happened, would you not want another Cerbera?

[trefor]

179mph, 195mph - how often do you do those speeds (unless you visit the autobahn regularly). All of the current crop of TVRs are tarmac rippingly fast. If you want a roof get a T350, if you want a convertible get a Tamora/Tuscan ... OK so a Tuscan is both.

Sounds like you need to do some test driving

[julianhj]

Sorry to hear about your loss. How did it happen?
What sort of budget are you planning on?

[christof]

As having owned most of the current TVR range including a Cerbera RR and now a 400bhp Tuscan S, I can say that the Tuscan S is the fastest of all.

Quite surprising for me is that the S has the best high speed stability of all.

I've driven 175 mph and the beastie was still pulling.

Christof

[Que1]

christof said:

I've driven 175 mph and the beastie was still pulling. Christof

i think your answer is here
Q1

>> Edited by Que1 on Saturday 27th March 19:52

[Methanol]

GCerbera said:

Sorry to hear this. Not knowing what happened, would you not want another Cerbera?

GCerbera,

No not really, I’ve done the Cerbera thing if you know what I mean. Plus even though mine was a 2003 model, the model itself is getting on a bit.

trefor said:

179mph, 195mph - how often do you do those speeds (unless you visit the autobahn regularly). All of the current crop of TVRs are tarmac rippingly fast. If you want a roof get a T350, if you want a convertible get a Tamora/Tuscan ... OK so a Tuscan is both. Sounds like you need to do some test driving

Trefor,

I know they are fast but if that were the case, its not too often one does 140 mph, and when you consider:

Ruf R Turbo Adam 200
996 TT X50 Daz 192
Murcielago Sean 190
993TT Derestrictor 186
Brabus 6.3SL MikeS 184

The manufacturer’s figures for the 996 TT and especially the 993 TT don’t even quote as higher figure as do TVR, yet they seem to be performing better. However I think the imagery of the Tiv is awe-inspiring and this is what’s making it difficult to decide. When I was in the process of buying the Cerb last year I always pondered the question… where do I go from here. Well here is now.

[Methanol]

julianhj said:

Sorry to hear about your loss. How did it happen? What sort of budget are you planning on?

Julianhj,

It seems that the near side rear wheel shattered, sending me into a spin hitting the barrier on the slip road to the dual carriageway on the way to the Mid Essex meet two Sundays ago.

About 55k

[TimW]

Do you know why it shattered? i bet that left a brown mark on ya trousis!

[GCerbera]

Methanol said:

julianhj said: Sorry to hear about your loss. How did it happen? What sort of budget are you planning on? Julianhj, It seems that the near side rear wheel shattered, sending me into a spin hitting the barrier on the slip road to the dual carriageway on the way to the Mid Essex meet two Sundays ago. About 55k

Sorry to hear that, it naturally that sounds very scary.

Any idea how it occurred. What sort of wheels did you have on it?

Sorry for the questions, but the info could be useful to other Cerbera owners.

[Methanol]

Well let’s just say 10 more seconds and it would have left more than that on them.

GCerbera,

No problem mate, I wish I knew how/why it happened as to possibility stop it happening to anyone else.

I have no idea how it happened and when it did, it happened so quick I could not remember what I hit first.

I had the original wheels; the wheel had completely disintegrated, so finding out what happened would probably be near to impossible.

Some other Piston Headers were very kind and stopped to see if I was ok (Thx guys)

I was actually fine when it happened I was not going fast, what scared me was thinking what could have happened a little further down the road, as I was about to punch it.

>> Edited by Methanol on Saturday 27th March 20:35

[BCA]

Methanol said:

Trefor, I know they are fast but if that were the case, its not too often one does 140 mph, and when you consider: Ruf R Turbo Adam 200 996 TT X50 Daz 192 Murcielago Sean 190 993TT Derestrictor 186 Brabus 6.3SL MikeS 184 The manufacturer’s figures for the 996 TT and especially the 993 TT don’t even quote as higher figure as do TVR, yet they seem to be performing better. .

Just to clear this up, these figures were taken from Bruntingthorpe at a Vmax day. The speeds you see hear are what can be achieved *up to* the speed trap, for higher figures these cars need more space. The RUf had 550bhp/ the 996TT was an X50, so 460bhp/ the Murci 570/ the 993TT is breathed on and pushing 490(?)bhp/ the brabus must be pushing 600, maybe more still??

In this company the TVR's did rather well, I doubt any of them had close to 400bhp, yet they were still within a few mph of the faster. Over 150mph the big power cars will always be faster. Add a Red Rose car into the equation and we may see similar speeds to the fastest standard cars (murci/TTX50.) A Typhon with 550bhp may have been enough to challenge for top honours - we will have to wait and see about that though...

I know TVR power figures and in some cases, weight figures are a little optimistic. However, the performance claims seem to be pretty much on the money. At the end of the day, 40k's worth of standard TVR was ahead of the mighty Ferraris, including some nicely tweaked ones. With a little more speed out of the corner through some suspension upgrades and they would have been going 180mph. Pretty damn good IMHO.

Anyway, back to the replacements... If you want more of the same but with better build/handling at a higher price, I would go for a 360. If you want something quicker at a higher price but less raw - go for a Porsche Turbo X50. If you want something faster for the same price, with the same practicality (boot space etc) its time to get into another TVR. Or perhaps a 993 Turbo (dont know what these cost now) and get some work done to it. For decent RHD 360 money/ Porker Turbo X50 money you are looking at a Typhon. Personally, I think I would have to make a verrrry difficult decision.

Dont underestimate the abilities of TVR's in a straight line. I bet I could have bought a 4.2 for £14k, shoved on some Nitrons, added some spiders (aesthetics..) + a Joospeed chip and enter it. For less than 20k I could have a car that would still be quicker than all the Ferraris. With a bigger budget, and a 4.5 Red Rose starting point - no doubt you could start pestering the faster Porsches too...

[Methanol]

BCA,

WOW!!! Speechless, you have cleared it all up for me, sincerely I do thank you. The thread can now be closed; my faith in TVR has been restored, apart from some little voice in the back of my head saying “reliability”. However I have a lot to consider, if I go for TVR which I’m leaning in that direction much more now, I’m going to think positive on the reliability issues.

BCA, thx again.

Methanol

P.S I don’t think this could have been summed up any better.

[the dodger]

Methanol, also remember (quote) "You always feel special driving a TVR"

[BCA]

For what its worth a standard Cerb 4.5 is geared for 195mph (REAL GPS varified), if it has the power to keep revving and the space to do so, I see no reason why it wouldnt get there. Of course, thats the point where you hit the rev limiter - whether it limits revs and whether you want to see if it can go further is for someone else to find out

I have heard of Cerberas sitting on 195mph speedometer-indicated for a few mins without trouble. Which if its anything like our speedo (we have compared ours with real speed several times) is 185mphish REAL GPS (they are reasonably accurate.)

According to evo 180ish is the Tuscan max speed, but Ehasler and someone else managed 179 at bruntingthorpe. No doubt thier Tuscans were still pulling- I think 185+ is realistic from any modern hard top TVR. Not sure why evo couldnt do better...

If you want to go faster, you need to spend a fair bit more. I know exactly what you mean by the reliability concerns, but to side step in performance and go up in reliability, again, you will need to spend more money.

Glad I could be of some use.

[ehasler]

BCA said:

If you want to go faster, you need to spend a fair bit more. I know exactly what you mean by the reliability concerns, but to side step in performance and go up in reliability, again, you will need to spend more money.

Yep - totally agree with BCA on this one.

My Tuscan S did 179, a Red Rose Tuscan also did 179 and Big-T's Cerbera 4.5 did 178.

All 3 could have gone slightly quicker on the day, and even quicker had the runway been longer. Although I don't think I'd have got much more than 185 from mine (red change up light was beginning to come on, so there weren't many revs left), that's still fg quick, and quicker than all but a handful of cars on the day (some costing well in excess of £100k). Mine was also very stable at that speed, and braking hard from nearly 180mph was completely drama free as well.

If you look at the list of cars that were slower than the TVRs, there are some very desirable, quick and expensive motors that weren't as quick as the 3 fastest TVRs!

As for reliability, admittedly 2 of the TVRs at VMax did go home on the back of an AA truck, and another was missing it's rear window, however at least 1 Ferrari also had to be recovered home, and another was suffering a slipping clutch by the end of the day. I also believe that there was another car on the day (Porsche I think?) that had problems with it's immobiliser, so problems certainly weren't exclusive to TVR.

>> Edited by ehasler on Monday 29th March 10:11

[Corin Denton]

Noble?

[cacatous]

Personally I would go for a Sagaris Supercharged with sequential box...

You would get the stability, looks and power.

As for reliability I never had any problems with my Tuscan S at all.

The new ones push out 400hp and this makes a bit of difference I gather. Get some Dreadnought throttle bodies, Nitrons and CCC cans and you have one helluva machine!!

[Don]

996 X50 Turbo. Sure you can't have a new one for your budget...but three years old, possibly LHD.

450bhp.

[Alf Essex]

Yep agree with Ed and BCA, the Tuscans put in a great show...ok I only did 168 but should have gone faster just my own right foot that didn't!

Considering the money paid for the other cars on show...the only car that beat me off the line was the RUF Porsche and no one was going to beat that

Remember these TVR's do not have gadgets with traction control, ABS etc etc and we still did very fast speeds in wet/damp conditions, especially in the Tuscans which were stable and controllable.

Pretty impressive if you ask me

But am no waiting on the Sagaris at the motor show as to whether I progress further then my current deposit

Alan.

>> Edited by Alf Essex on Monday 29th March 12:37