Dishonest Previous Owner?
Discussion
Mods feel free to move, wanted this out of the way rather than in GG.
Right. Long post ahoy!
Last year I bought my Ibiza Cupra through an advert off PH classifieds. It was the right colour and spec (or at least I thought it was). I paid around market value if it was as described.
Now, when I bought the car as far as I was concerned it was stage 1 mapped. The boost readouts on the gauge confirmed this, holding a healthy 15psi and peaking at 16/17/18 depending on external temperature. I got the car home drive it around a bit, then started having problems, boost spikes, lots of lag, poor throttle response, not holding the same pressure as when I first drove it. Over time it died completely, lots of limp-home mode, and generally not much fun to drive.
I started logically, as maps don’t degrade, and the ECU was dry (a known fault, cheers SEAT), replacing sensors and fixing niggles, bypassing those that weren't needed. I had the ECU checked by a reputable mapper and it came back "encrypted", he was unable to see who installed the map and what software it was running, but someone had mapped it. Earlier this year I got sick of chasing my tail and bought a 2nd had standard ECU, and installed that, immediately power was smoother, not laggy and happy, if a little slow to respond, I did some data logs and replaced the MAF, sorted. I now had a happy, responsive factory-tune car.
In the mean-time, I decided to re-install the dodgy ECU as it was still peaking higher than standard and I missed the power.
This weekend I was at Edition 38 show, and a friend had his car on the REVO stand, I went over for a chat and they agreed to take a look at the software on the ECU after I told them about the "encrypted" software the previous mapper had found. Within 10 minutes the REVO tech had discovered that the last person to make changes to the ECU was a REVO dealer, and they had installed a map, good news I thought, the techs at the show were happy to update my map for free. Great. 5 minutes later I’m called back to my car. Bad news. The installed software was a REVO 5hr drive-time trial map. For f
ks sake. Motherfker.
it looks like the of a previous owner has taken it to his nearest REVO dealer and had a 5hr Stage 1 trial installed, taken it home, I have come, viewed it, driven it, decided that despite the "lost receipt" for the map, it pulls as it should and I’m happy. Paid over-the-odds for a standard car on suspension (that wasn’t as described, but I gave the benefit of the doubt at the time) and drove it home...
fking cock.
I still have his phone number, so what do the kind people of PH suggest...
1. Phone him. Tell him REVO have looked at my car, wait for the awkward silence, and then ask him if he wants to fill in the blanks.
2. Call him and aim to get the cost of mapping back.
3. Call his local REVO dealer; ask them if they have had the car there, what work they did...
4. Call his local REVO dealer AS HIM, ask them for another 5hr trial and see what happens...
5. Forget about it.
Sorry for the long post. Still really annoyed at him, but really happy that now it’s mapped, it’s as it should've been when I bought it.
Right. Long post ahoy!
Last year I bought my Ibiza Cupra through an advert off PH classifieds. It was the right colour and spec (or at least I thought it was). I paid around market value if it was as described.
Now, when I bought the car as far as I was concerned it was stage 1 mapped. The boost readouts on the gauge confirmed this, holding a healthy 15psi and peaking at 16/17/18 depending on external temperature. I got the car home drive it around a bit, then started having problems, boost spikes, lots of lag, poor throttle response, not holding the same pressure as when I first drove it. Over time it died completely, lots of limp-home mode, and generally not much fun to drive.
I started logically, as maps don’t degrade, and the ECU was dry (a known fault, cheers SEAT), replacing sensors and fixing niggles, bypassing those that weren't needed. I had the ECU checked by a reputable mapper and it came back "encrypted", he was unable to see who installed the map and what software it was running, but someone had mapped it. Earlier this year I got sick of chasing my tail and bought a 2nd had standard ECU, and installed that, immediately power was smoother, not laggy and happy, if a little slow to respond, I did some data logs and replaced the MAF, sorted. I now had a happy, responsive factory-tune car.
In the mean-time, I decided to re-install the dodgy ECU as it was still peaking higher than standard and I missed the power.
This weekend I was at Edition 38 show, and a friend had his car on the REVO stand, I went over for a chat and they agreed to take a look at the software on the ECU after I told them about the "encrypted" software the previous mapper had found. Within 10 minutes the REVO tech had discovered that the last person to make changes to the ECU was a REVO dealer, and they had installed a map, good news I thought, the techs at the show were happy to update my map for free. Great. 5 minutes later I’m called back to my car. Bad news. The installed software was a REVO 5hr drive-time trial map. For f
ks sake. Motherfker.it looks like the
of a previous owner has taken it to his nearest REVO dealer and had a 5hr Stage 1 trial installed, taken it home, I have come, viewed it, driven it, decided that despite the "lost receipt" for the map, it pulls as it should and I’m happy. Paid over-the-odds for a standard car on suspension (that wasn’t as described, but I gave the benefit of the doubt at the time) and drove it home...f
king cock.I still have his phone number, so what do the kind people of PH suggest...
1. Phone him. Tell him REVO have looked at my car, wait for the awkward silence, and then ask him if he wants to fill in the blanks.
2. Call him and aim to get the cost of mapping back.
3. Call his local REVO dealer; ask them if they have had the car there, what work they did...
4. Call his local REVO dealer AS HIM, ask them for another 5hr trial and see what happens...
5. Forget about it.
Sorry for the long post. Still really annoyed at him, but really happy that now it’s mapped, it’s as it should've been when I bought it.
You may have more luck with constructive advice in the Speed, Plod and Law forum.
Plenty of recent threads about private sales and it is a complex area around proving a sale and having any recourse - it isn't black and white - but either way will probably cost you some legal advice.
Whilst technically you may have some recourse, option 5) is probably the best for your blood pressure and the cheapest long term.
Plenty of recent threads about private sales and it is a complex area around proving a sale and having any recourse - it isn't black and white - but either way will probably cost you some legal advice.
Whilst technically you may have some recourse, option 5) is probably the best for your blood pressure and the cheapest long term.
The logical thing would be to forget about it. Will save you tears and stress.
However, regardless of 'buyer beware' it sounds like fraud of some kind to me (although Im no solicitor).
If a solicitor could confirm that there is recourse to this I would pursue it to the end at any cost.
However, regardless of 'buyer beware' it sounds like fraud of some kind to me (although Im no solicitor).
If a solicitor could confirm that there is recourse to this I would pursue it to the end at any cost.
I thought REVO had sorted out their 'free 5hr maps'. They were spikey and surgey 3 or 4 years ago.
Modded cars aren't generally worth the sum of their parts, and in some cases actually worth less, so assuming you only 'overpaid' (compared to a 'standard' car of similar condition / age) by the cost of the map it's not too much of a hit to the pocket. On the other hand, the guy sounds like an acutal twunt and on principle I'd be as annoyed as you are.
Modded cars aren't generally worth the sum of their parts, and in some cases actually worth less, so assuming you only 'overpaid' (compared to a 'standard' car of similar condition / age) by the cost of the map it's not too much of a hit to the pocket. On the other hand, the guy sounds like an acutal twunt and on principle I'd be as annoyed as you are.
KrazyIvan said:
Quick question, how long between you buying the car, and REVO guy telling you it was a trail map?
Either way i'd go for number 1 but be ready to fall back to 5. You never know he may be happy to pay you the cost of a pucka re-map.
a year.Either way i'd go for number 1 but be ready to fall back to 5. You never know he may be happy to pay you the cost of a pucka re-map.
problems started not long after buying it, but i assumed i'd broken something.
JB! said:
I still have his phone number, so what do the kind people of PH suggest...
1. Phone him. Tell him REVO have looked at my car, wait for the awkward silence, and then ask him if he wants to fill in the blanks. There will be no awkward silence. He will simply say 'buyer beware' and hang up.
2. Call him and aim to get the cost of mapping back. See above.
3. Call his local REVO dealer; ask them if they have had the car there, what work they did. I might have misunderstood but haven't REVO have already told you what was done to the ECU?
4. Call his local REVO dealer AS HIM, ask them for another 5hr trial and see what happens. Presumably this 5 hour trial is intended to drum up business and so will either be free or very cheap. Assuming there's no '1 per customer' rule, I would think they'd be happy to offer 'him' another trial.
5. Forget about it. You bought a modified car. Privately. A year ago. This might not be the most satisfying option, but it'll at least mean you won't waste any more time/effort/money on the matter.
1. Phone him. Tell him REVO have looked at my car, wait for the awkward silence, and then ask him if he wants to fill in the blanks. There will be no awkward silence. He will simply say 'buyer beware' and hang up.
2. Call him and aim to get the cost of mapping back. See above.
3. Call his local REVO dealer; ask them if they have had the car there, what work they did. I might have misunderstood but haven't REVO have already told you what was done to the ECU?
4. Call his local REVO dealer AS HIM, ask them for another 5hr trial and see what happens. Presumably this 5 hour trial is intended to drum up business and so will either be free or very cheap. Assuming there's no '1 per customer' rule, I would think they'd be happy to offer 'him' another trial.
5. Forget about it. You bought a modified car. Privately. A year ago. This might not be the most satisfying option, but it'll at least mean you won't waste any more time/effort/money on the matter.
Edited by Risotto on Monday 6th September 13:10
You have no come back. I just wouldn't bother chasing it up and buy a new remap if you really want it that much.
I would contact him if you had bought it last week but a year is pushing it. He probably wont have a clue who you are, if his phone number is still the same, and even if it is, you can only rely on his goodwill to get anything out of it. He has no legal obligation to give you any money.
I would contact him if you had bought it last week but a year is pushing it. He probably wont have a clue who you are, if his phone number is still the same, and even if it is, you can only rely on his goodwill to get anything out of it. He has no legal obligation to give you any money.
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