Got my Sprint...

[coetzeeh]

and a very interesting article on the new Ultimate FFF Speed Six engine. 475hp from a 4.0 coming to you soon! The peope who developed the Ultimate FFF certainly have the right credentials.

[Gazzab]

Did I read a murky story about the design for this engine ? But 475bhp sounds fab, is that supercharged?

[deeen]

? Where's mine ?

[Don1]

Good, it's out in the wild.

This engine is a piece of art. Seriously stunning - the guy making it reckons over 500bhp with a different set of cams! Then more than that, normally aspirated, with a bit more work. All from the normal 4.0 block...

I know I'm going to RG to have a test drive at the end of the month. If it's as good and powerful as it looks, then the hard decision will be 4.3/5, FFF mk2 or LSx. All around the same bhp... OK, slightly different torque, but wow.

[TVRMARKUB]

Don't think it's that hard to get big BHP from the engine, torque and low down grunt without having to rev the bkss out of it now that's another matter.

[T350 Al]

Did they quote any prices?

I think the work RG have done on the FFF and Pascal's S/C FFF is outstanding, but as I recall the first FFF was a lot more expensive than Power's 4.3. I really hope the price is competitive and that they offer a transferable warranty.

[DonkeyApple]

TVRMARKUB said:

Don't think it's that hard to get big BHP from the engine, torque and low down grunt without having to rev the bkss out of it now that's another matter.

It's a straight 6 not a V8. two different engines that do two different jobs.

[gifdy]

There seemed to be a little dig ; 'increasing capacity of an engine is not the logical first step....'.

Response to the baiting from Power on other threads perhaps ?

[Tvr Power]

Don1 said:

Good, it's out in the wild.

This engine is a piece of art. Seriously stunning - the guy making it reckons over 500bhp with a different set of cams! Then more than that, normally aspirated, with a bit more work. All from the normal 4.0 block...

I know I'm going to RG to have a test drive at the end of the month. If it's as good and powerful as it looks, then the hard decision will be 4.3/5, FFF mk2 or LSx. All around the same bhp... OK, slightly different torque, but wow.

if you want serious hp go the LS route there bullet proof....

Dom

[DonkeyApple]

gifdy said:

There seemed to be a little dig ; 'increasing capacity of an engine is not the logical first step....'.

Response to the baiting from Power on other threads perhaps ?

Who knows but I don't think TVR even gasflowed their heads, so a bit of polishing could well release as much power as stroking or boring out the engine.

I was staggered at how rough the internals of the heads were and how nothing seemed to have been ported, polished or anything.

Maybe I have seen bad examples but I always assumed that polishing up the head nicely and porting everything would deliver a considerable improvement in BHP.

[TVRMARKUB]

Tvr Power said:

Don1 said:

Good, it's out in the wild.

This engine is a piece of art. Seriously stunning - the guy making it reckons over 500bhp with a different set of cams! Then more than that, normally aspirated, with a bit more work. All from the normal 4.0 block...

I know I'm going to RG to have a test drive at the end of the month. If it's as good and powerful as it looks, then the hard decision will be 4.3/5, FFF mk2 or LSx. All around the same bhp... OK, slightly different torque, but wow.

if you want serious hp go the LS route there bullet proof....

Dom

[Don1]

I know what you mean Dom....

[Tvr Power]

gifdy said:

There seemed to be a little dig ; 'increasing capacity of an engine is not the logical first step....'.

Response to the baiting from Power on other threads perhaps ?

Virtual design is a wonderful marketing feature; increasing capacity is the real world and far less hassle for the development engineers and the paying customer


Dom

[Tvr Power]

Don1 said:

Good, it's out in the wild.

This engine is a piece of art. Seriously stunning - the guy making it reckons over 500bhp with a different set of cams! Then more than that, normally aspirated, with a bit more work. All from the normal 4.0 block...

I know I'm going to RG to have a test drive at the end of the month. If it's as good and powerful as it looks, then the hard decision will be 4.3/5, FFF mk2 or LSx. All around the same bhp... OK, slightly different torque, but wow.

4 ltr 500 bhp normally aspirated give me the guys name i'll employ him for sure

Dom

[Gazzab]

I have some water could he turn it into wine?

[Flintstone]

T350 Al said:

I really hope the price is competitive and that they offer a transferable warranty.

What's their warranty at the moment? Any reliability feedback on their FFF engine?


Edit. Didn't Al Melling promise 500bhp and get shouted down?

Edited by Flintstone on Wednesday 8th September 21:30

[DonkeyApple]

Tvr Power said:

Don1 said:

Good, it's out in the wild.

This engine is a piece of art. Seriously stunning - the guy making it reckons over 500bhp with a different set of cams! Then more than that, normally aspirated, with a bit more work. All from the normal 4.0 block...

I know I'm going to RG to have a test drive at the end of the month. If it's as good and powerful as it looks, then the hard decision will be 4.3/5, FFF mk2 or LSx. All around the same bhp... OK, slightly different torque, but wow.

4 ltr 500 bhp normally aspirated give me the guys name i'll employ him for sure

Dom

For the S6 or in general? over 100bhp per litre is chicken feed, it has been being done for decades and reliability has increased every year with quality and design improvements.

I'm sure there are plenty of solid engines pushing out well over that level.

Increasing capacity is usually a cheaper option but the gains from sorting out a head cannot be ignored, especially when S6's appear to be starting from such a low point.

Combine that with a much more intelligent ECU over the dumb one in the standard Tiv and I would hazard you'll start getting better results than from stroking or boring out. Those are crude options which fail to redress obvious flaws.

Surely, gas flowing the head, fitting a top notch ECU and increasing the capacity would allow this engine to produce some outstanding figures without risking reliabilty beyond what boring out would do?

[Don1]

Tvr Power said:

4 ltr 500 bhp normally aspirated give me the guys name i'll employ him for sure

Dom

Good luck - he worked for Mclaren and Ilmor.... Including being a race engineer for a certain Finnish world champion! There is a little side bar on him in Sprint.

As for the figues... as it is race cams (hence not the normal street figure), then 125bhp/litre isn't insane, is it?

[Graham]

It must be about time we saw a TVR Power and a RG FFF Speed six fight it out on the track.


That would really prove the needed jump in reliability, I dont think a speed 6 has lasted more than one race yet...........

admittedly with the s6's track reliability you'd need balls of steel and unshakable belief in your engine to put your reputation on the line, but race on sunday sell on monday...

[clive f]

Graham said:

It must be about time we saw a TVR Power and a RG FFF Speed six fight it out on the track.


That would really prove the needed jump in reliability, I dont think a speed 6 has lasted more than one race yet...........

admittedly with the s6's track reliability you'd need balls of steel and unshakable belief in your engine to put your reputation on the line, but race on sunday sell on monday...

a excelent idea, but will it ever happen?

lots of excellent development work has been going on with the speed 6 engines and if I was producing a new version of the engine then the race track would be the one place to prove its reliability and performance.

I remember Joolz and Cliff struggling at times with the Wilder engine in Cliff`s T350 race car, it would be good to see the speed6 out on track and see how it fairs over a race season, its all nice and rosy to see bhp dyno graphs being produced but lets see it in the real world being put through its paces in competition.

any plans for next season Dom?