Rising rate FPR
Discussion
Why a rising rate reg ?
Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
stevieturbo said:
Why a rising rate reg ?
Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
I've seen 5 FSE's fail this year alone, agree on the SARD ones though.Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
Vixpy1 said:
stevieturbo said:
Why a rising rate reg ?
Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
I've seen 5 FSE's fail this year alone, agree on the SARD ones though.Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
Rob
stevieturbo said:
Why a rising rate reg ?
Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
The engine is pretty extreme and we need the headroom/extra range of the rising rate. Technically it can be compensated for in the ECU (quite easily), but rising rate allows another degree of freedom/control/headroom. Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
UV, speak to Mark at Lateral as he stocks the fuelab ones. All types and sorts :
http://www.lateralperformance.co.uk/
Say i sent you, he will prob swear when you mention me, but its friendly swearing
http://www.lateralperformance.co.uk/
Say i sent you, he will prob swear when you mention me, but its friendly swearing
350zwelgje said:
How can failure of a fuel pressure regulator be identified?
Rob
A fuel pressure gauge is a good way to start.Rob
As for the rising rate thing. There are very few of these about. So is it a rising rate one you want, or a standard 1:1 rate ?
Rising rate implies a ratio greater than the normal 1:1 with boost.
Ultra Violent said:
stevieturbo said:
Why a rising rate reg ?
Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
The engine is pretty extreme and we need the headroom/extra range of the rising rate. Technically it can be compensated for in the ECU (quite easily), but rising rate allows another degree of freedom/control/headroom. Surely the common 1:1 is perfectly fine ?
And whilst FSE look crap, Ive never had any problems with them. Absolutely avoid SARD regulators though. They really are crap.
As above though, Aeromotive, Magnafuel, SX, Fuelab, Turbosmart, there are plenty.
Or even the standard one on the car would work. Why is 5 bar base needed ?
Mr2Mike said:
stevieturbo said:
Is it lack of injector, or what is the problem ? And what pump are you using ?
I was wondering about the pump, what pressure does the internal relief valve typically operate at? Flow will also be down unless it's specced for 5 bar operation.Although it would make more sense to build a fuel system that didnt rely on inflated pressures for it to work, especially if using higher boost levels.
I personally don't understand the need for a rising rate regulator in a fully mapped system. It's just one more thing to go wrong or out of calibration and it's not that easy to check properly if it has. The ecu map will also look very odd and non intuitive and not be able to run standard boost compensation adjustments.
A normal regulator connected to the inlet manifold maintains a fixed amount of fuel pressure over and above boost pressure and it's easy to check if the base pressure is still correct.
Moreover if you run injectors at too high a pressure their reliability and service life will suffer so all in all I don't see the point.
A normal regulator connected to the inlet manifold maintains a fixed amount of fuel pressure over and above boost pressure and it's easy to check if the base pressure is still correct.
Moreover if you run injectors at too high a pressure their reliability and service life will suffer so all in all I don't see the point.
Problem is we are running the biggest injectors we are prepared to run. These will run at 80% duty at full boost and that is too much for us (its an endurance engine). We could run higher base pressure, but that would be overkill most of the time and unnecessarily stress parts that don't need to be stressed .
This build is tried and tested with high BHP Turbo endurance engines. As mentioned Bosch do a Motorsport part, but its £600+
If I have to pay up, thats fine, but there must be a cheaper quality solution somewhere out there.
This build is tried and tested with high BHP Turbo endurance engines. As mentioned Bosch do a Motorsport part, but its £600+
If I have to pay up, thats fine, but there must be a cheaper quality solution somewhere out there.
Ultra Violent said:
Problem is we are running the biggest injectors we are prepared to run. These will run at 80% duty at full boost and that is too much for us (its an endurance engine). We could run higher base pressure, but that would be overkill most of the time and unnecessarily stress parts that don't need to be stressed .
This build is tried and tested with high BHP Turbo endurance engines. As mentioned Bosch do a Motorsport part, but its £600+
If I have to pay up, thats fine, but there must be a cheaper quality solution somewhere out there.
You still havent explained what you need.This build is tried and tested with high BHP Turbo endurance engines. As mentioned Bosch do a Motorsport part, but its £600+
If I have to pay up, thats fine, but there must be a cheaper quality solution somewhere out there.
Is it a 1:1 regulator the same as 99% of FPR's in existence, or one that has a higher ratio than 1:1 with boost ?
Also "Problem is we are running the biggest injectors we are prepared to run." raises queries.
What size are they, and what is the reason for not going large enough to operate a sensible fuel system ? 1000cc and 2000cc injectors are readily available that perform very well.
If you think your injectors cant handle 80% duty, then they are crap and you should be sourcing better ones anyway.
Even if it was some sort of endurance racer, any decent injector could sit at 80% all day long with no problems.
As mentioned, i'm looking for a rising rate.
Can you point me in the direction of injectors that have a good spray pattern at low RPM and can flow sufficiently well at the top-end. My concern with larger injectors is they just become a hose and low RPM atomisation is compromised.
I'm all for a simple solution and would like to avoid Rising Rate if possible, but equally I need a reliable, capable solution.
Can you point me in the direction of injectors that have a good spray pattern at low RPM and can flow sufficiently well at the top-end. My concern with larger injectors is they just become a hose and low RPM atomisation is compromised.
I'm all for a simple solution and would like to avoid Rising Rate if possible, but equally I need a reliable, capable solution.
Ultra Violent said:
As mentioned, i'm looking for a rising rate.
Can you point me in the direction of injectors that have a good spray pattern at low RPM and can flow sufficiently well at the top-end. My concern with larger injectors is they just become a hose and low RPM atomisation is compromised.
I'm all for a simple solution and would like to avoid Rising Rate if possible, but equally I need a reliable, capable solution.
Rising rate, 5 bar base and 2bar boost will far exceed the ability of most pumps and injectors so would be a totally counter productive system that would not work.Can you point me in the direction of injectors that have a good spray pattern at low RPM and can flow sufficiently well at the top-end. My concern with larger injectors is they just become a hose and low RPM atomisation is compromised.
I'm all for a simple solution and would like to avoid Rising Rate if possible, but equally I need a reliable, capable solution.
If you gave us a clue of engine or power involved along with the control system, sensible help might be more forthcoming. At the minute don't know if its 1 cyl or 16, or 10bhp or 1000.
Im not sure if this is a terminology thing, but my guys use this approach all the time.
Basically, the engine is 3.6ltr, 6 cyl, built to support 1.6bar boost and should put out over 700bhp. The engine is very similar to a tried and tested 935 endurance engine my Mech runs.
My understanding is I need the FPR to provide 5 Bar over manifold boost pressure. If FP doesn't scale with boost then all your MAP'ing goes to tits as you Delta (manifold/FP) decays with rising boost. With a rising rate FPR, as boost increases your relative fuel pressure remains constant...
Basically, the engine is 3.6ltr, 6 cyl, built to support 1.6bar boost and should put out over 700bhp. The engine is very similar to a tried and tested 935 endurance engine my Mech runs.
My understanding is I need the FPR to provide 5 Bar over manifold boost pressure. If FP doesn't scale with boost then all your MAP'ing goes to tits as you Delta (manifold/FP) decays with rising boost. With a rising rate FPR, as boost increases your relative fuel pressure remains constant...
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