Water softner problem - water not soft!
Discussion
I have an all singing dancing water softner http://www.ukwater.net/waterSofteners/minimax/
Its a twin cylinder system, which is metered and does not plug into the mains. It is supposed to take blocks of salt, but we have on the advice of the plumber just used normal loose tablet salt. It takes the salt and seems to work. That is until I tested it, and the water is rock hard. My mother in law has a cheaper/less sophisticated electric softner next door and their water is very soft.
Its plumbed in correctly. The only thing I can think is that it has to use blocks of salt and not tablets?
Unless it is broken of course!
Its a twin cylinder system, which is metered and does not plug into the mains. It is supposed to take blocks of salt, but we have on the advice of the plumber just used normal loose tablet salt. It takes the salt and seems to work. That is until I tested it, and the water is rock hard. My mother in law has a cheaper/less sophisticated electric softner next door and their water is very soft.
Its plumbed in correctly. The only thing I can think is that it has to use blocks of salt and not tablets?
Unless it is broken of course!
If it's meant for blocks of salt why use something else? I think your plumber is giving you crap advice. If he's doing that, and he's the one that installed it, I'd also wager he's done something wrong with the install or given you a duff unit.
I've had block softeners for years and they've always done the job perfectly!
I've had block softeners for years and they've always done the job perfectly!
garyhun said:
If it's meant for blocks of salt why use something else? I think your plumber is giving you crap advice. If he's doing that, and he's the one that installed it, I'd also wager he's done something wrong with the install or given you a duff unit.
I've had block softeners for years and they've always done the job perfectly!
Googling seems to indicate that it is possible to swap block for tablets, mind you the plumber is my father in law so you never know....... The connections are correct I checked. I will get hold of a couple of blocks of salt. I've had block softeners for years and they've always done the job perfectly!
lost in espace said:
garyhun said:
If it's meant for blocks of salt why use something else? I think your plumber is giving you crap advice. If he's doing that, and he's the one that installed it, I'd also wager he's done something wrong with the install or given you a duff unit.
I've had block softeners for years and they've always done the job perfectly!
Googling seems to indicate that it is possible to swap block for tablets, mind you the plumber is my father in law so you never know....... The connections are correct I checked. I will get hold of a couple of blocks of salt. I've had block softeners for years and they've always done the job perfectly!
I have to say I have always been advised to ONLY use blocks and never had issues.. you never know!
I have the Kinetico version of what you have...and I have often thought the water was still hard. But when I do a suds test on softened vs unsoftened it always, but always shows it's working.
If you haven't already get a testing kit and do a side by side. You may just be living in a really hard water area and it can't quite cope!
Secondly it may need a service. The ion exchange system (beads in the softening chamber I think) eventually wears out and they have to be replaced. The system should last ten years, though. So if it's not been in long and it's not working then it may be defective.
Of course there may be a mechanical problem which a service would find. For example: do you know if it is regenerating?
If you haven't already get a testing kit and do a side by side. You may just be living in a really hard water area and it can't quite cope!
Secondly it may need a service. The ion exchange system (beads in the softening chamber I think) eventually wears out and they have to be replaced. The system should last ten years, though. So if it's not been in long and it's not working then it may be defective.
Of course there may be a mechanical problem which a service would find. For example: do you know if it is regenerating?
Don said:
I have the Kinetico version of what you have...and I have often thought the water was still hard. But when I do a suds test on softened vs unsoftened it always, but always shows it's working.
If you haven't already get a testing kit and do a side by side. You may just be living in a really hard water area and it can't quite cope!
Secondly it may need a service. The ion exchange system (beads in the softening chamber I think) eventually wears out and they have to be replaced. The system should last ten years, though. So if it's not been in long and it's not working then it may be defective.
Of course there may be a mechanical problem which a service would find. For example: do you know if it is regenerating?
Don does your water ever get salty, ours does now and again. I am thinking the unit is duff now.If you haven't already get a testing kit and do a side by side. You may just be living in a really hard water area and it can't quite cope!
Secondly it may need a service. The ion exchange system (beads in the softening chamber I think) eventually wears out and they have to be replaced. The system should last ten years, though. So if it's not been in long and it's not working then it may be defective.
Of course there may be a mechanical problem which a service would find. For example: do you know if it is regenerating?
ShadownINja said:
lost in espace said:
My mother in law... next door
Wait... you live next door to your parents-in-law??I have taken it apart as best I can and given it a good clean, there is a float in a chamber which works fine. There wasn't much else to look at, just one rotating slot at the top which seems to have started a recharge off. The water which was in the case was very salty so I am fairly sure the tablets work fine. Not sure what to do if it does not work. Probably ebay it off for parts and get a metered one. The reason why I bought this one is that its a big house and I thought that this particular model would cope with the throughput.
Ferg said:
Have you checked the bypass valve is shut????
FergI am not sure where the bypass valve is. Presumably this is the switch you hit when you go on holiday. There is very little in the way of user intervention/switches/buttons on the unit, just the regeneration button on the top. I will double check though, thanks.
lost in espace said:
Ferg said:
Have you checked the bypass valve is shut????
FergI am not sure where the bypass valve is. Presumably this is the switch you hit when you go on holiday. There is very little in the way of user intervention/switches/buttons on the unit, just the regeneration button on the top. I will double check though, thanks.
Edited by Ferg on Saturday 25th September 16:30
lost in espace said:
ShadownINja said:
lost in espace said:
My mother in law... next door
Wait... you live next door to your parents-in-law??
Jesus. I got on with my parents-in-law but still, I wouldn't want them popping over every 5 minutes.
Ferg said:
If you follow the two pipes out of the back of the machine (via those two speedfit elbows) there should be a valve on each to isolate it and a valve tee'd across the two pipes to maintain water when the machine is isolated. This is the valve that should be shut.
Ahh Ferg the valve you are describing is external to the unit, my father in law plumbed it in place without one. We have gate valves which isolate the whole unit if need be at the pipes. If we needed to bypass it I would just get a few joints out and get around it.OK Next question is....
Does it draw the brine out of the brine tank when it regenerates? If not there is likely to be a bit of crap in the injector. If it DOES draw it, it's bizarre, 'cos I've never seen a machine draw brine, but not soften. Oh, wait I had one that had the centre tube in the resin bed cut too short and it allowed the water to bypass internally.
Does it draw the brine out of the brine tank when it regenerates? If not there is likely to be a bit of crap in the injector. If it DOES draw it, it's bizarre, 'cos I've never seen a machine draw brine, but not soften. Oh, wait I had one that had the centre tube in the resin bed cut too short and it allowed the water to bypass internally.
Ferg I feel a prat now as there is a bypass valve, I just followed the pipes back from the main. And I now have soft water coming out of the cold taps, I purged about 3 or 4 times and it must have kick started things. My hot water is still showing as hard though, we have a 300l megaflo am I right in saying that the soon to be hot water actually passes through the cylinder and is heated by the stored water? So it should go soft fairly soon?
Many thanks for everyone's help, I was beginning to think I had a £400 bookend, and would be looking at similar money again for a new one!
Many thanks for everyone's help, I was beginning to think I had a £400 bookend, and would be looking at similar money again for a new one!
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