E90 M3 Not that impressed
Discussion
Hi all
Went for a test drive in the E90 M3 and was kind of disappointed. It was a really nice car, fast, comfortable and refined, but it lacked something.
The seat position was too high, even on its lowest setting, the steering was numb and the V8 was too muted.
The car has definitely become more a GT car and less ultimate driving machine, felt like a very fast 5 series.
On the plus side, the interior was a big leap forward from my Z4M and suspension is much better controlled, you could drive 40K a year in the new M3 easy.
I did get the revs round to 8000 a few times on the test drive, so gave it full beans and did notice the backend is very adjustable with the throttle, but felt very removed from the action
Have I missed something or does it grow on you?
Please don't get all huffy, it's only my view on a limited test drive
Went for a test drive in the E90 M3 and was kind of disappointed. It was a really nice car, fast, comfortable and refined, but it lacked something.
The seat position was too high, even on its lowest setting, the steering was numb and the V8 was too muted.
The car has definitely become more a GT car and less ultimate driving machine, felt like a very fast 5 series.
On the plus side, the interior was a big leap forward from my Z4M and suspension is much better controlled, you could drive 40K a year in the new M3 easy.
I did get the revs round to 8000 a few times on the test drive, so gave it full beans and did notice the backend is very adjustable with the throttle, but felt very removed from the action
Have I missed something or does it grow on you?
Please don't get all huffy, it's only my view on a limited test drive
Bit on an onion of a car: many layers.
I can certainly see that on the face of it, in a short test drive you'd walk away wondering what all the fuss was about. The is an amazing amount of depth to the car and this can be made more obvious by EDC and M settings. The engine is a masterpiece, you shouldn't underestimate and by looks of things from the paris motorshow, if you want it to be more shouty then BMW will soon release an official performance exhaust.
It's fast and comfortable, handles very well and is reasonably sensible for all occassions. In the right hands, in the right mood it's a fantastic car.
I can certainly see that on the face of it, in a short test drive you'd walk away wondering what all the fuss was about. The is an amazing amount of depth to the car and this can be made more obvious by EDC and M settings. The engine is a masterpiece, you shouldn't underestimate and by looks of things from the paris motorshow, if you want it to be more shouty then BMW will soon release an official performance exhaust.
It's fast and comfortable, handles very well and is reasonably sensible for all occassions. In the right hands, in the right mood it's a fantastic car.
I drove one during a Palmer Sports day and was totally underwhelmed. It was the most disappointing car on the day. It felt as if I was driving a PlayStation. Allegedly it was properly set up, but I could feel the weight and it still understeered like a pig. Granted it had a forgiving chasis, but a properly set up CSL would have run rings around it. What made the experience worse is that I actually considered chopping the Z4MC and the Touring for an M3 before the day. It will definitely not happen now. Shame on BMW...
I have done 64K miles in mine, now and it gets better every day. It does take a while to gel with it, but when you are in tune with it it shrinks around you and you can place it anywhere you like.
The driving position is high if you are getting out of a 911, but feels perfect after acclimatisation.
I have a Miltek backbox to fruiten up the noise and it is a nice balance of not too loud, but nice and gruff bassy when pootling about.
I drive 99.5% of the time with EDC set to soft. It has great traction and is a wonderful ride compared to things like GT-Rs and CLK black series. Only time the nose doesn't go in fast enough on soft EDC is when really pressing on or on track. Then put to hard.
I have a manual, which I think is nicer than the DCT imho, but the shift takes some time to bed in and getting used to. Has some bizarre clutch helper that is intrusive until you have it timed properly.
Living with it will not disappoint. Mine has grown on me so much and is the most surprising car I have owned in terms of expectation and delivery. Looks better now than it did 3 years ago. The shape has become very svelte. (Coupe, E92, not the awkward looking Saloon, the E90)
Tyres last 15K miles, and disks / pads over 50K, so is not a disaster money wise to run. Likes 97 octane and better. Will complain if you run it on 95...
The driving position is high if you are getting out of a 911, but feels perfect after acclimatisation.
I have a Miltek backbox to fruiten up the noise and it is a nice balance of not too loud, but nice and gruff bassy when pootling about.
I drive 99.5% of the time with EDC set to soft. It has great traction and is a wonderful ride compared to things like GT-Rs and CLK black series. Only time the nose doesn't go in fast enough on soft EDC is when really pressing on or on track. Then put to hard.
I have a manual, which I think is nicer than the DCT imho, but the shift takes some time to bed in and getting used to. Has some bizarre clutch helper that is intrusive until you have it timed properly.
Living with it will not disappoint. Mine has grown on me so much and is the most surprising car I have owned in terms of expectation and delivery. Looks better now than it did 3 years ago. The shape has become very svelte. (Coupe, E92, not the awkward looking Saloon, the E90)
Tyres last 15K miles, and disks / pads over 50K, so is not a disaster money wise to run. Likes 97 octane and better. Will complain if you run it on 95...
Cheburator mk2 said:
I drove one during a Palmer Sports day and was totally underwhelmed. It was the most disappointing car on the day. It felt as if I was driving a PlayStation. Allegedly it was properly set up, but I could feel the weight and it still understeered like a pig. Granted it had a forgiving chasis, but a properly set up CSL would have run rings around it. What made the experience worse is that I actually considered chopping the Z4MC and the Touring for an M3 before the day. It will definitely not happen now. Shame on BMW...
You need more time to learn how to drive it. All front engine production saloons understeer to some extent. A standard CSL understeers terribly too, in the same situations. Roll in slower (pref on the brakes to load the front axle) and fire it out on a late apex getting on the power nice and early. It isn't a caterham or elise It is a nice daily drive roadcar with good civil manners inside and 190 mph (derestricted) performance.Edited by phatgixer on Wednesday 13th October 16:38
phatgixer said:
I have done 64K miles in mine, now and it gets better every day. It does take a while to gel with it, but when you are in tune with it it shrinks around you and you can place it anywhere you like.
The driving position is high if you are getting out of a 911, but feels perfect after acclimatisation.
I have a Miltek backbox to fruiten up the noise and it is a nice balance of not too loud, but nice and gruff bassy when pootling about.
I drive 99.5% of the time with EDC set to soft. It has great traction and is a wonderful ride compared to things like GT-Rs and CLK black series. Only time the nose doesn't go in fast enough on soft EDC is when really pressing on or on track. Then put to hard.
I have a manual, which I think is nicer than the DCT imho, but the shift takes some time to bed in and getting used to. Has some bizarre clutch helper that is intrusive until you have it timed properly.
Living with it will not disappoint. Mine has grown on me so much and is the most surprising car I have owned in terms of expectation and delivery. Looks better now than it did 3 years ago. The shape has become very svelte. (Coupe, E92, not the awkward looking Saloon, the E90)
Tyres last 15K miles, and disks / pads over 50K, so is not a disaster money wise to run. Likes 97 octane and better. Will complain if you run it on 95...
Ditto, a very fair and factual appraisal, the sum of all it's parts is a very capable car.The driving position is high if you are getting out of a 911, but feels perfect after acclimatisation.
I have a Miltek backbox to fruiten up the noise and it is a nice balance of not too loud, but nice and gruff bassy when pootling about.
I drive 99.5% of the time with EDC set to soft. It has great traction and is a wonderful ride compared to things like GT-Rs and CLK black series. Only time the nose doesn't go in fast enough on soft EDC is when really pressing on or on track. Then put to hard.
I have a manual, which I think is nicer than the DCT imho, but the shift takes some time to bed in and getting used to. Has some bizarre clutch helper that is intrusive until you have it timed properly.
Living with it will not disappoint. Mine has grown on me so much and is the most surprising car I have owned in terms of expectation and delivery. Looks better now than it did 3 years ago. The shape has become very svelte. (Coupe, E92, not the awkward looking Saloon, the E90)
Tyres last 15K miles, and disks / pads over 50K, so is not a disaster money wise to run. Likes 97 octane and better. Will complain if you run it on 95...
I have one but sorry it's no looker and try it on 99octane, or if you are feeling flush 102 octane.
I must say that I also fancy a deeper exhaust note regarding the Miltek have they now ironed out the drone ?
I understand where the OP is coming from, i did 46,000 miles in mine and I liked it alot but I just couldn't see it as anything special, incredible engine but ultimately it didn't excite, if you're after thrills it's the wrong car, but if you're after a superb do it all then the M3 is the right beast
I find mine a little numb at times. I did have it at Spa last week and to be honest it was quick enough on the straights, but oversteered like nothing on earth in the corners! A Standard E46 M3 feels slightly better on the corners!! That was with EDC on max! The car really needs stiffened up, maybe some uprated anti roll bars?? I can't believe that BMW have designed this car with 265 tyres on the rear! It's got 420 BHP with bags of torque, what are 265's gonna do with a car with all that power and weight!? Let go, that's what they are gonna do!! My mates with the GT3's were constantly saying "told you so! Should have bought a GT3!".
Then.........we packed up and drove to the ferry. All is forgiven!! This is when I remembered, I only do 1 or 2 track days a year with it! Why do I need a GT3? The M3 is a lovely car to be in for just driving around. I drove from Perth to Alton Towers the other month, and if I hadn't needed to stop for fuel, I could have driven it in one go! Very comfortable, very quick, very (too??) civilised and forgiving. I didn't resemble some 75 year old man with lumbago when we got out after a few hours behind the wheel, unlike the Porsche boys!! Lol.
Oh and in agreement with an earlier comment, the driver's seat is too high!!! Lol.
Then.........we packed up and drove to the ferry. All is forgiven!! This is when I remembered, I only do 1 or 2 track days a year with it! Why do I need a GT3? The M3 is a lovely car to be in for just driving around. I drove from Perth to Alton Towers the other month, and if I hadn't needed to stop for fuel, I could have driven it in one go! Very comfortable, very quick, very (too??) civilised and forgiving. I didn't resemble some 75 year old man with lumbago when we got out after a few hours behind the wheel, unlike the Porsche boys!! Lol.
Oh and in agreement with an earlier comment, the driver's seat is too high!!! Lol.
phatgixer said:
Cheburator mk2 said:
I drove one during a Palmer Sports day and was totally underwhelmed. It was the most disappointing car on the day. It felt as if I was driving a PlayStation. Allegedly it was properly set up, but I could feel the weight and it still understeered like a pig. Granted it had a forgiving chasis, but a properly set up CSL would have run rings around it. What made the experience worse is that I actually considered chopping the Z4MC and the Touring for an M3 before the day. It will definitely not happen now. Shame on BMW...
You need more time to learn how to drive it. All front engine production saloons understeer to some extent. A standard CSL understeers terribly too, in the same situations. Roll in slower (pref on the brakes to load the front axle) and fire it out on a late apex getting on the power nice and early. It isn't a caterham or elise It is a nice daily drive roadcar with good civil manners inside and 190 mph (derestricted) performance.Edited by phatgixer on Wednesday 13th October 16:38
I race a heavy (1400kg ready to go due to class rules) front engined/transaxle classic
, thus I believe I do know to a degree how to drive something similar. While I agree with you that the E46 M3 also understeers, hell, my Z4MC understeered from the factory too, the E92 is waayyy to safe in its setup and is even more unyielding. I loved its GT ability, which shone through the mockery of a track car that is the Palmer set-up, but forgive me for saying it, it is a lot less focussed than what I would expect from an M-car... A sign of the times I suppose?
Agree on the crushing straight line performance - it was more difficult than I expected to get past one on the straights of the Ring in the ancient Pork...
The z4m is a much more raw experience. It's by no means perfect but you aren't going to find something more exhilerating and engaging very easily. The e90/92 m3 is probably a much more capable car but it can only be more isolated. Compare it to another fast saloon instead of a bonkers 2 seater sports car and you'll probably understand it better.
Lots of sensible comments, am I on PH?
I was a bit unsure for the first few months (manual saloon) but 18 months into ownership I am hugely impressed.
The key thing must be what you are using as a benchmark and what you want the car for. I don't think you will find another practical four seater (or five) that is as exciting to drive.
I was a bit unsure for the first few months (manual saloon) but 18 months into ownership I am hugely impressed.
The key thing must be what you are using as a benchmark and what you want the car for. I don't think you will find another practical four seater (or five) that is as exciting to drive.
I agree that the Z4MC is a lot more fun to drive if less capable overall, but to be fair to the E92 M3 I was not comparing it to a Z-ed, but to my old E46 M3 SMG. I don't know how/why but the old E46 felt more raw and close to the action than the E92. Granted, the V8 blows it into the weeds in the performance stakes, but in terms of handling and feeling of the road I thought the E46 is that much closer to what an ///M car should be. My old E46 M3 had Hamann suspension, maybe that helped, although I doubt it?
Anyways, with BMWAUC E60 M5s in the mid-20s, surely that is making people think when it comes to chosing an M3 or M5 for their practical 4-door uber-performance car?
Anyways, with BMWAUC E60 M5s in the mid-20s, surely that is making people think when it comes to chosing an M3 or M5 for their practical 4-door uber-performance car?
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