Speed camera's for Traffic lights
Discussion
From SFgate.com in America
In a move unprecedented in the Bay Area, the city's traffic engineers have created a traffic signal with attitude. It senses when a speeder is approaching and metes out swift punishment.
It doesn't write a ticket. It immediately turns from green to yellow to red.
Residents and commute-jockeys said Tuesday that the light, which the city plans to unveil today on Vineyard Avenue at the intersection of Montevino Drive, is either an inspired leap into the future or a blatant example of government overzealousness.
"It's kind of big-brotherish, but sometimes it's the price we pay for safety," said JoAnne Brewer, 49, who walked her golden retriever past the new signal Tuesday morning and predicted it would be a success.
"I'm not much of a speeder myself," Brewer added. "It's my husband that it will catch."
Drivers on the two-lane Vineyard, as they approach Montevino, will see an electronic sign that gives the speed limit -- 40 mph heading west and 35 mph going east -- then flashes their actual speed.
A camera about 350 feet from the intersection measures speed and tells the light whether to do its business. Traffic engineers plan to give drivers a few miles per hour of wiggle room. But once speeding is detected, the red light will turn on for at least 10 seconds -- or 30 seconds-plus if cross traffic is waiting.
It's all a little too much for Ken Pattee, a 52-year-old construction inspector from Livermore who sometimes rides his Harley-Davidson down Vineyard Avenue. He said he doesn't feel good about the electronic eye.
"It's depriving you of another one of your liberties -- going fast," Pattee said. "If they implement it everywhere, there will be nothing but red lights. Nobody does the speed limit."
Except Pattee, that is.
"I do the speed limit," he said. "That's my story, and I'm sticking with it."
The signal is a sign of the times. The Bay Area is increasingly consumed with its traffic woes, as seen in a recent fight over neighborhood traffic barriers that divided Palo Alto residents.
Top political issue
Pleasanton has become a capital of traffic hand-wringing, with a spot between Interstates 580 and 680 that invites cutting commuters. Traffic is easily the No. 1 political issue in the city, informing nearly every decision. The Police Department even allows citizens to borrow radar guns to document speeders near their homes and send out warning letters to offenders.
The punitive nature of the signal on Vineyard appears to have the united support of neighbors and the Police Department, which hasn't seen an unusual number of accidents on the route but envisions a low-cost way to make people feel safe.
The intersection sits near large stucco and brick homes with manicured landscaping. The route, connecting downtown Pleasanton to the Ruby Hill gated community and Highway 84 in Livermore, is not the country road it used to be, and it attracts a healthy stream of regional commuters.
Many neighbors are so peeved with the popularity of the road that they didn't want a traffic signal at all at Montevino because it would allow traffic to flow better than the stop sign it replaced. At least the stop signs made speeding impossible and persuaded some commuters to steer clear, neighbors said.
Pleasanton public works director Rob Wilson said the city has no plans to build more of the signals. But police Lt. Mark Senkle, who heads traffic enforcement, said, "If it works, I'd like to see it done in a few other areas in town. I don't anticipate problems, but the truth is, we just don't know. No one's done this."
Thousand Oaks light
At least one other place in California has put together a traffic signal that is deputized against speeders. The Ventura County city of Thousand Oaks installed one in 2000 that Pleasanton traffic chief Jeff Knowles, who used to work in Thousand Oaks, has been watching closely.
"The people who were concerned about speed are pleased with it, but you'll hear a different story from some of the users of the road," said Thousand Oaks senior civil engineer Jim Mashiko.
Thousand Oaks has discovered a few hiccups, Mashiko said. Pedestrians, for example, must be given the green on all four crosswalks in the intersection at the same time, so they are not confused by a sudden yellow and red aimed at a speeder.
In addition, red rage could become an issue as drivers can be guilty by association if a speeder is just in front of them, just behind them or moving simultaneously in the opposite direction.
Pleasanton plans to address at least one of those issues: the opposite- direction speeder. The Pleasanton signal will allow a red light to shine in just one direction, letting the light stay green for the nonspeeding driver in the opposite direction. In such cases, any cross traffic will continue receiving the red light.
In a move unprecedented in the Bay Area, the city's traffic engineers have created a traffic signal with attitude. It senses when a speeder is approaching and metes out swift punishment.
It doesn't write a ticket. It immediately turns from green to yellow to red.
Residents and commute-jockeys said Tuesday that the light, which the city plans to unveil today on Vineyard Avenue at the intersection of Montevino Drive, is either an inspired leap into the future or a blatant example of government overzealousness.
"It's kind of big-brotherish, but sometimes it's the price we pay for safety," said JoAnne Brewer, 49, who walked her golden retriever past the new signal Tuesday morning and predicted it would be a success.
"I'm not much of a speeder myself," Brewer added. "It's my husband that it will catch."
Drivers on the two-lane Vineyard, as they approach Montevino, will see an electronic sign that gives the speed limit -- 40 mph heading west and 35 mph going east -- then flashes their actual speed.
A camera about 350 feet from the intersection measures speed and tells the light whether to do its business. Traffic engineers plan to give drivers a few miles per hour of wiggle room. But once speeding is detected, the red light will turn on for at least 10 seconds -- or 30 seconds-plus if cross traffic is waiting.
It's all a little too much for Ken Pattee, a 52-year-old construction inspector from Livermore who sometimes rides his Harley-Davidson down Vineyard Avenue. He said he doesn't feel good about the electronic eye.
"It's depriving you of another one of your liberties -- going fast," Pattee said. "If they implement it everywhere, there will be nothing but red lights. Nobody does the speed limit."
Except Pattee, that is.
"I do the speed limit," he said. "That's my story, and I'm sticking with it."
The signal is a sign of the times. The Bay Area is increasingly consumed with its traffic woes, as seen in a recent fight over neighborhood traffic barriers that divided Palo Alto residents.
Top political issue
Pleasanton has become a capital of traffic hand-wringing, with a spot between Interstates 580 and 680 that invites cutting commuters. Traffic is easily the No. 1 political issue in the city, informing nearly every decision. The Police Department even allows citizens to borrow radar guns to document speeders near their homes and send out warning letters to offenders.
The punitive nature of the signal on Vineyard appears to have the united support of neighbors and the Police Department, which hasn't seen an unusual number of accidents on the route but envisions a low-cost way to make people feel safe.
The intersection sits near large stucco and brick homes with manicured landscaping. The route, connecting downtown Pleasanton to the Ruby Hill gated community and Highway 84 in Livermore, is not the country road it used to be, and it attracts a healthy stream of regional commuters.
Many neighbors are so peeved with the popularity of the road that they didn't want a traffic signal at all at Montevino because it would allow traffic to flow better than the stop sign it replaced. At least the stop signs made speeding impossible and persuaded some commuters to steer clear, neighbors said.
Pleasanton public works director Rob Wilson said the city has no plans to build more of the signals. But police Lt. Mark Senkle, who heads traffic enforcement, said, "If it works, I'd like to see it done in a few other areas in town. I don't anticipate problems, but the truth is, we just don't know. No one's done this."
Thousand Oaks light
At least one other place in California has put together a traffic signal that is deputized against speeders. The Ventura County city of Thousand Oaks installed one in 2000 that Pleasanton traffic chief Jeff Knowles, who used to work in Thousand Oaks, has been watching closely.
"The people who were concerned about speed are pleased with it, but you'll hear a different story from some of the users of the road," said Thousand Oaks senior civil engineer Jim Mashiko.
Thousand Oaks has discovered a few hiccups, Mashiko said. Pedestrians, for example, must be given the green on all four crosswalks in the intersection at the same time, so they are not confused by a sudden yellow and red aimed at a speeder.
In addition, red rage could become an issue as drivers can be guilty by association if a speeder is just in front of them, just behind them or moving simultaneously in the opposite direction.
Pleasanton plans to address at least one of those issues: the opposite- direction speeder. The Pleasanton signal will allow a red light to shine in just one direction, letting the light stay green for the nonspeeding driver in the opposite direction. In such cases, any cross traffic will continue receiving the red light.
already got those here, not such a bad idea really, more to stop nutters who run red lights, you shouldn't really speed through intersections anyway, though I always used to speed up to make that orange light... none of that now, but I guess this is at least intelligent use of speed cameras, unlike theothers they stick at the bottom of a hill so they can catch you out ...
Sounds like a defence to me. It's one thing to be speeding, it's another to change the sequence of traffic lights to force the speeder to run the red light. It's an accident waiting to happen. Pointless too as the current red light cameras tell the Court the speed the car ran the red light at and how long the red light had been showing.
Sadly, the Magistrates treat this potentially fatal and reckless cation quite leniently. Let's face it, would you want to be going through a set of lights on green to find someone running the red light often at 40mph or more after the red light had been showing for well over a second? A bit more serious than speeding IMHO. Consider also that the amber would have been showing for 2 seconds.
Sadly, the Magistrates treat this potentially fatal and reckless cation quite leniently. Let's face it, would you want to be going through a set of lights on green to find someone running the red light often at 40mph or more after the red light had been showing for well over a second? A bit more serious than speeding IMHO. Consider also that the amber would have been showing for 2 seconds.
They already have these in Germany.... used mainly in those 2 donkey collection of houses which isn't a village but may be/is deserving of a slower limit because of possible pedestrians. And they're not switched because of speed, just because you're there!!! FFS!!!
However at 3 in the morning the damn things just switch to red, you stand there polluting the "village" and then (it feels like) 5 minutes later it changes back to green. Mind you there's not even a fox or a hare moving at that time of night, so I do make a point of high revving and possible tyre smoke starts if it happens.....
However at 3 in the morning the damn things just switch to red, you stand there polluting the "village" and then (it feels like) 5 minutes later it changes back to green. Mind you there's not even a fox or a hare moving at that time of night, so I do make a point of high revving and possible tyre smoke starts if it happens.....
They have these in France, if you are speeding in a built up area, it just triggers the next set of lights, so it takes longer to cover A to B. If you take it steady, all the lights stay green and you make good progress. I think its a good idea, better than speed cameras and points, as long as it is used in a sensible places in say 30 and 40 zones.
Not far a way from me in a place called Quarndon they have just intalled a big sign that says 'SLOW DOWN' if you are over the limit, again I think this is better than a camera, although you could ignore it.
Not far a way from me in a place called Quarndon they have just intalled a big sign that says 'SLOW DOWN' if you are over the limit, again I think this is better than a camera, although you could ignore it.
Slough is designed like this.
The theory was that the traffic lights cause a "green Wave" (sounds like something involving a hankey).
On The A4 arriving at Slough from the Reading direction there are about 10 sets of lights phased so that a car travelling at the 30 mph limit will arrive at each as they change to green.
Russ
The theory was that the traffic lights cause a "green Wave" (sounds like something involving a hankey).
On The A4 arriving at Slough from the Reading direction there are about 10 sets of lights phased so that a car travelling at the 30 mph limit will arrive at each as they change to green.
Russ
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