Cerbera Values

[davidd]

I'm selling in the new year and was interested to get the view on current values.

I notice there seem to be less cars in the classifieds than last time I looked, however the price range seems pretty vast from £8k to £27k. Its not a good time of year to be selling but do we think prices have fallen much over the last year, will they firm up much over the spring/summer?

Thoughts appreciated...

Cheers

D

[TDFPELTD]

I paid just over £9K for my 4.5, it's a pretty decent car that had a body off last year to sort the chassis etc. It had a huge amount of electrical issues, engine issues, general bits wrong and was in desperate need of a service etc. but on the basis of a sound chassis/body and fairly decent basic lump it made sense. Worth noting though to have all the issues resolved by an independant would by north of six grand which makes it no where near cheap!

[davidd]

TDFPELTD said:

I paid just over £9K for my 4.5, it's a pretty decent car that had a body off last year to sort the chassis etc. It had a huge amount of electrical issues, engine issues, general bits wrong and was in desperate need of a service etc. but on the basis of a sound chassis/body and fairly decent basic lump it made sense. Worth noting though to have all the issues resolved by an independant would by north of six grand which makes it no where near cheap!

Interesting, whats the spec, age etc of the car?

Thanks

D

[TDFPELTD]

1998 in Silver with red half leather interior, spiders, AC and a few shiney Leven bits.

It's C18 ERB which was for sale at Tempest near Brighton, there was some discussion about it on here a while back. It was certainly cheap for a 4.5 but as above needed a lot of attention to bring it back to spec. The original list of faults we identified once it was back at our workshops was:

- Inop Wipers
- Inop Washers
- Inop Horn
- Inop Main Beam
- Damaged head light
- Inop door speakers
- Inop indicators
- Inop rev counter
- Inop heater fan
- Suspect Lambda Sensors
- Persistant high RPM misfire
- Very low throttle opening caused stalling
- Odd bank throttle pot unresponsive
- Even bank throttle pot jittery
- Cracked airboxes
- Alternator charge low
- Aircon and Alternator belts due.
- Damaged/worn intake pipes
- Damaged air box brackets
- Oil leak from engine.
- Oil leak from gearbox
- Oil leak from rear diff
- Fuel leak from pressure regulator - tank line.
- Coolant leak from front of car
- Leak into drivers footwell
- Drivers side floor carpet unsecured
- Urgently needs a service
- Requires tappets service
- Bonnet hinge broken
- Drivers side bonnet securing pin missing
- Pas window does not drop on opening
- Drivers side external door open button cover missing
- Fuel gauge baclight bulb not present
- Fuel gauge reads incorrectly
- Requires Geo setup
- Rear dampers visibly corroded
- Inop Drivers side electric mirror
- Scuttle/beauty panel damaged
- Front engine bay beauty panel damaged
- Oil breather line weeping
- Side repeaters dulled
- Carbon windscreen trim on PAS side poorly secured.
- Engine oil dipstick damaged
- Engine coolant temperature gauge inaccurate
- Drivers side electric window slow to operate
- Boot release switch intermittant
- Drivers seat bolster worn
- Passenger seat bolster worn

So quite a list! Nothing massively mechanicaly wrong but a lot of time required to fix and resolve. It's currently being done as and when someone has a spare couple of hours as it can get rather quite this time of year so it's not a bad thing to have a bit of a project to crack on with.

[Mr Cerbera]

TDFPELTD said:

I paid just over £9K for my 4.5, it's a pretty decent car that had a body off last year to sort the chassis etc. It had a huge amount of electrical issues, engine issues, general bits wrong and was in desperate need of a service etc. but on the basis of a sound chassis/body and fairly decent basic lump it made sense. Worth noting though to have all the issues resolved by an independant would by north of six grand which makes it no where near cheap!

So, for 14K you've got a bloody good car - sounds like a bargain !

[spongy]

Sell it to a nice guy in Devon for 8 grand,there job done;)

[TDFPELTD]

Mr Cerbera said:

TDFPELTD said:

I paid just over £9K for my 4.5, it's a pretty decent car that had a body off last year to sort the chassis etc. It had a huge amount of electrical issues, engine issues, general bits wrong and was in desperate need of a service etc. but on the basis of a sound chassis/body and fairly decent basic lump it made sense. Worth noting though to have all the issues resolved by an independant would by north of six grand which makes it no where near cheap!

So, for 14K you've got a bloody good car - sounds like a bargain !

I've seen a couple of decent and useable 4.5's go for around £12.5K so if you were paying an independant to sort it then it wouldn't really make sense. £14K - £15K seems to be pre 2000 minter territory? If you can do it all yourself/through work it does make for a sorted fairly cheap Cerbera though

[Boatbuoy]

I considered your car TDFPELTD, but in the end it seemed to cheap to and I stayed clear. I ended up buying a 50,000 mile, 1997, 4.2 in (seemingly) excellent condition for a fiver short of £12k last weekend.

So far all I've found wrong is that the frost warning light doesn't work and the clutch pedal squaeks. It's going up on the ramp for a good look at the underside on Saturday so I wont say too much until then.

Hopefully all will prove good, then I just need the weather to improve and can get on and enjoy my new toy.

[TDFPELTD]

The only reason I had it was it was a 4.5 and I have a very well kitted workshop with chaps that are pretty bored during Decemeber as it's our quitest month. It's keeping them out of trouble if nothing else

It has needed a lot of bits and time to get it sorted, we'll see how sorted that turns out to be as it's on the dyno next week. The engine bay is looking much better now though:



I think you made a good choice, there was a lot wrong with this one when we acquired it and 4.2s rev nicer than standard 4.5s anyway

Edited by TDFPELTD on Thursday 2nd December 21:59

[davidd]

Crikey, thats a big list!

I would suspect that any car will have some niggles that the new owner will want to rectify, I'll get all the ones sorted on mine that I am aware of, or I'll tell the owner, but I'll price it with them in mind..

So if you are buying a 97 4.2 for £12k, should a 2000 4.5 be worth more. given that it also has a squeaky clutch pedal

[PMcHenry]

Hi David,

Can you text me your number.

Would like to talk about the car

Cheers

P.S M3!!

[Hedgetrimmer]

David, If you fancy a loverrrly condition 2001 BMW E39 M5 as PX let me know.

[Rocketron10]

C18 ERB was my old car, sold in August this year to a chap who part exd two months later. I spent over 3K on getting the outriggers replaced and another 5K on odds and sods - yeh it needed work but still put a smile on my face every time I drove it - when it started that is!
Good luck with the work, let me know if you ever want to sell it on, I may be interested.

[TDFPELTD]

Rocketron10 said:

C18 ERB was my old car, sold in August this year to a chap who part exd two months later. I spent over 3K on getting the outriggers replaced and another 5K on odds and sods - yeh it needed work but still put a smile on my face every time I drove it - when it started that is!
Good luck with the work, let me know if you ever want to sell it on, I may be interested.

You'll be happy to hear C18 ERB is looking much, much healthier now and starts every time. I'll copy and paste the jobs complete list so you can see what she's had so far, some bits may be missing as not everything gets logged on our workshop system:

- Remake steering wheel ribbon cable
- Remove Engine loom strip and rebuild
- Fit New washer jet pump and new spade termianls
- Fit New starter motor clutch assembly
- Fab and fit new high pressure oil lines
- Remove and clean oil cooler assembly
- Source and fit new PAS side head light reflector
- Remake door looms and replace unsealed connectors with Econoseal
- Replace main fuse assembly and fuse
- Replace battery with correct type (terminals need to be opposite to current battery)
- Rebuild battery mount/clamp.
- Replace damaged fuses in fuse box
- Replace indicator microswitch assembly @ask matt for switch spec as i cant find it@
- Remake hot fan control PCB, dry joints.
- Fit new throttle pots
- Fit new coil packs @use X85 packs from X85 spares package, should be same packs but check pin out vs PSA spec ones@
- Change air filter element
- Fit good used airboxes. Remove and replace rivnuts with washered version
- Fit short intake kit
- Fit Js chip
- Fit new lambda sensors @matt has them@
- Replace fuel return line
- Fab and fit new airbox brackets
- Fit new speakers @matt has them@
- Fit new head unit @matt has it@
- Reseal gearbox drain plug
- Remade fuel level sender connector, fuel gauge works now
- Fit new alternator
- Fit new alternator belt
- Fit new aircon compressor belt
- Replace bearing in aircon belt tensioner @phone transpower for bearing@
- Fit new wiper motor park switch
- Fit HID lights @H4s from elise spares package should be some balasts somewhere@
- Reglue drivers side carpet @ask sue to stick it in the wash first@
- Remake bonnet hinge etc.
- Fab and fit new bonnet securing pins
- Reseal brake fluid res and clutch fluid inspection panel
- Perform geo setup @it needs castor shims making!!!!!!!@ @it needs rear toe in under compression more!!!!!!@
- Remove and rebuild rear dampers
- Fit new fuel gauge bulb
- Fit new spark plugs
- Fit carbon trim bits to seat bolsters
- Underseal chassis @all of it???.....@ @as much as you can get to @
- Replace oil and filter, Motul 5W50
- Flush and replace coolant Motul Inugel
- Replace brake fluid Motul
- Strip and rebuild front calipers.
- Replace oil pressure relief spring @behind 24mm nut on oil pump ass@
- Replace front upper ball joints and reseal front uprights
- Make new earth for ECU
- Fit decat pipes
- Fit new window seals

Didn't realise until now quite how much work we'd snunk into it

Still to do is replace the 'small' fan as that's goosed, refurb the wheels and remove and pattern the metal coolant lines in the nose so we can make some stainless replacements. Aside from that I think she's pretty much done but I might treat it to some Quantums early next year.

Here's a few random pics I have on my phone:

















The big test for it will be a run to Ascari in Feb (3000 mile round trip), if it completes that without much of an issue I'll consider it pretty much done

Hope the above is of some interest, I'm planning to keep it for a while yet but will drop you a line if I do decide to sell it.

Edited by TDFPELTD on Tuesday 21st December 23:58

[Rocketron10]

Sounds like your well on the way to sorting it out - before I undertook to get the outriggers replaced it was only worth scrap according to the guys at the TVR Centre. The water leaks were a pain too, my jean bottoms used to get soaked every time I went out for a drive in the rain (it was my daily driver for 18 months). Got to the point where I used to throw a cover over it even when parked in a car park on a wet day! Am secretly looking for another Cerb for next Spring, but keep having to look over my shoulder in case my better half gets wind - will end in divorce I suspect.

[TDFPELTD]

The leaks seem to be sorted now, even with the pressure washer on it nothing gets into the footwells so hopefully it'll be dry carpets from now on.

Did you have any other issues with it? I'm keen to see if I've found them all whilst there's still workshop time spare.

[.Mark]

Rocketron10 said:

Am secretly looking for another Cerb for next Spring, but keep having to look over my shoulder in case my better half gets wind - will end in divorce I suspect.

It's not the wife you want to worry about. If the current Cerb hears you are looking for a replacement it'll develop wallet stinging issues

[Rocketron10]

TDFPELTD said:

Did you have any other issues with it? I'm keen to see if I've found them all whilst there's still workshop time spare.

Battery used to drain if not used everyday, had the alternator replaced with a 'serviceable' item when the body was off for the outrigger work - didn't seem to fix the problem so I just carried a battery pack in the boot to give it a kick when it played up. I drove every day (except for snow) so never a major problem. Sounds like you may have sorted that one out, fingers crossed.

Stiff steering was another, had the power sterring rack reconditioned at the same time as above but only a minor improvement - suspect track rods and ball joints were goosed too. Vibration at 70-80mph, had the wheels reconditioned same time, minor improvement but still a bit of a vibration at around these speeds, suspect the front tyres might have been worn unevenly as front geometry was way out when I bought the car. If it still vibrates, try swapping the wheels from another car.

Rear window demist doesn't work, soldered terminal has come off but didn't work prior to this anyway.
Air con is pretty ineffective, regassing? Front aircon condenser looked pretty ropey but I never bothered to get this replaced - wasn't high up on my priority list!

Surprised about the poor state of the electrics that you have noted, everything else worked during my ownership - that is, except for the wiper motor park, which had a mind of its own and relied on precision timing to get the wipers to where I wanted them.

One last issue I had was, when warm, poor starter engagement. Would sometimes take 3-4 attempts before starter engaged. Sounds like you may have sussed this one as well!

[Rocketron10]

.Mark said:

It's not the wife you want to worry about. If the current Cerb hears you are looking for a replacement it'll develop wallet stinging issues

I'm Cerbless at the moment, going to spend some money on my old Citroen DS (after 24 years) and spruce it up. The replacement Cerb will have to wait for now - was fun owning the two at the same time and both extracted different responses from people in the street. The DS would make people smile and wave (particularly women) whilst the Cerb used to get me shouted at by the ubiquitous dog walkers around the villages where I live :-(

[TDFPELTD]

When we tested the alternator we found it was only putting out about .5V above battery charge so whilst it was (just) charging the battery lights, fans etc. would slowly deplete the battery. With the new alternator fitted there's a steady 13.8V engine running and I've had no issues with it flattening the battery, there's just the usual back ground drain from the alarm etc.

Stiff steering was down to a semi-siezed joint, no play in it and once cleaned up and regreased it seems fine. Vibration was most likely from a totally fubared upper ball joint on the front (I have rebalanced the wheels since as well) there's no vibration present now and I have put it down the runway at an indicated 170

Rear window demist I shall investigate!

Starter engagement was a duff clutch/gearbox in the starter (http://www.ccw-tools.com/product.asp?strParents=&CAT_ID=0&P_ID=29204&strPageHistory=search&numSearchStartRecord=1 if anyone needs one) once replaced the starter has been fine.

Thanks for pointing out the rear window demist, hadn't spotted that!