E60 M5's...how far will they drop?
Discussion
I've been looking through the classifieds and there are some real bargains to be had.
'08, 22,000 miles, nice spec for under £30k and so on. There are also some near £20k which is a steal for a 200mph super saloon (there also some people living in lala land hoping for top money for old cars!).
I understand the general running costs of this type of vehicle as I've had enough expensive cars, but technically the 'M5' is going to be very expensive to maintain.
Therefore, is the price of old leggy examples simply going to plummit, and when purchased by folk that that don't understand the financial commitment they are making and can't afford a warranty or repair costs, is the M5 and alike destined to become street furniture?
I suspect so, and what a shame that day will be.
'08, 22,000 miles, nice spec for under £30k and so on. There are also some near £20k which is a steal for a 200mph super saloon (there also some people living in lala land hoping for top money for old cars!).
I understand the general running costs of this type of vehicle as I've had enough expensive cars, but technically the 'M5' is going to be very expensive to maintain.
Therefore, is the price of old leggy examples simply going to plummit, and when purchased by folk that that don't understand the financial commitment they are making and can't afford a warranty or repair costs, is the M5 and alike destined to become street furniture?
I suspect so, and what a shame that day will be.
I had this argument in the 'M5 Pondering' topic. Neglected cars / cars bought by uneducated or wide eyed boyos will always lose value very quickly. Now that the older, leggier cars are coming into the range of said purchasers its gonna become more of an issue for those of us who want to keep our cars up to scratch. With the increasing number of cars in this zone its only gonna bring down the value of the better examples. Sure an enthusiast will pay good money for a well kept example but there are only a handful of these buyers around. That said, you can get a bargain in these situations if you can get a good car down to bad car prices. Uneducated or inexperienced drivers are also contributing to an increasing number of cat C's and D's on the market too, again bringing the prices of good cars down.
I'd recomend an E61 if you want your residuals to stay high. There are no plans for BMW to make and F10 M5 Tourer so the demand will always be there for the E61. They only made 222 RHD E61 M5's.
I'd recomend an E61 if you want your residuals to stay high. There are no plans for BMW to make and F10 M5 Tourer so the demand will always be there for the E61. They only made 222 RHD E61 M5's.
ecain63 said:
I had this argument in the 'M5 Pondering' topic. Neglected cars / cars bought by uneducated or wide eyed boyos will always lose value very quickly. Now that the older, leggier cars are coming into the range of said purchasers its gonna become more of an issue for those of us who want to keep our cars up to scratch. With the increasing number of cars in this zone its only gonna bring down the value of the better examples. Sure an enthusiast will pay good money for a well kept example but there are only a handful of these buyers around. That said, you can get a bargain in these situations if you can get a good car down to bad car prices. Uneducated or inexperienced drivers are also contributing to an increasing number of cat C's and D's on the market too, again bringing the prices of good cars down.
I'd recomend an E61 if you want your residuals to stay high. There are no plans for BMW to make and F10 M5 Tourer so the demand will always be there for the E61. They only made 222 RHD E61 M5's.
Good post.I'd recomend an E61 if you want your residuals to stay high. There are no plans for BMW to make and F10 M5 Tourer so the demand will always be there for the E61. They only made 222 RHD E61 M5's.
The bottom line is that as long as supply outstrips demand, these cars will inevitably fall to the sub £5k depths of the market, to the point where there are only a handful of good ones left and demand begins to outstrip supply...
Once they start hitting big miles and warranties are no longer possible, I'd wager that values will plummet rapidly. Ultimately, once the E60 M5 is no longer current, very few will want a V10 four door saloon with a reputation for fragility - even one that will do 200mph.
So, as said above, I'd expect the E60 to follow the same curve as it forbear, with 10yr old cars being available for £7/8k. Time, I predict will be a little kinder to the E61, but not by much.
Interesting thread, and a subject I've often spoken about with many enthusiasts!
Just wanted to add that in the longer term, I have a feeling a nice well looked after E60 will be on par or perhaps just slightly more than an E39 M5. Any of the 'mid rangers' I think will dip down below the E39 mid rangers - why?! the E60 with all those electronic sensors and control modules etc cost an absolute bomb when they go wrong. As car's age, it's quite likely some of the control modules will fail and as they're so integral to the car's systems, when one does go it'll probably render the car undriveable.
I think I've given the example here before, but on another 5 series focussed forum, a member with a 530d E60 posted up that his complete idrive system was non functioning - no satnav, AC, radio, computer functions. I believe the car was still driveable though. He'd had a quote from BMW that the iDrive control module had failed and he needed a new one, at like £1900 !!!After a week or so he posted back on the forum he'd got a 2nd hand one for an eye watering £1100 or so! Now I'm guessing here a little, that some of the other electronic modules and systems will over time fail, pretty much like all cars have common failure items etc, and I bet they're going to be very expensive to replace. With that 'fear' I think the 2005 and onwards BMW's and M's across the board will experience plummeting values on the 2nd hand market. Most likely over on other Marques cars as well.
I think in 3-5 years time when some of those mid range M5/M6 cars and their owners don't fancy a £1500 module replace and values plummet, many will be broken up and their engines and drivetrain sold on for tinkerers and modifiers and perhaps only those with a fat enough wallet will take on the running costs of these cars at that time as is.
Very hard to predict though, maybe those modules won't fail as often?!!
Cheers, Dennis!
Just wanted to add that in the longer term, I have a feeling a nice well looked after E60 will be on par or perhaps just slightly more than an E39 M5. Any of the 'mid rangers' I think will dip down below the E39 mid rangers - why?! the E60 with all those electronic sensors and control modules etc cost an absolute bomb when they go wrong. As car's age, it's quite likely some of the control modules will fail and as they're so integral to the car's systems, when one does go it'll probably render the car undriveable.
I think I've given the example here before, but on another 5 series focussed forum, a member with a 530d E60 posted up that his complete idrive system was non functioning - no satnav, AC, radio, computer functions. I believe the car was still driveable though. He'd had a quote from BMW that the iDrive control module had failed and he needed a new one, at like £1900 !!!After a week or so he posted back on the forum he'd got a 2nd hand one for an eye watering £1100 or so! Now I'm guessing here a little, that some of the other electronic modules and systems will over time fail, pretty much like all cars have common failure items etc, and I bet they're going to be very expensive to replace. With that 'fear' I think the 2005 and onwards BMW's and M's across the board will experience plummeting values on the 2nd hand market. Most likely over on other Marques cars as well.
I think in 3-5 years time when some of those mid range M5/M6 cars and their owners don't fancy a £1500 module replace and values plummet, many will be broken up and their engines and drivetrain sold on for tinkerers and modifiers and perhaps only those with a fat enough wallet will take on the running costs of these cars at that time as is.
Very hard to predict though, maybe those modules won't fail as often?!!
Cheers, Dennis!
M-J-B said:
'08, 22,000 miles, nice spec for under £30k and so on.
That one does seem to be below price for a model of that age and mileage. I would have certainly looked at that one before buying my current one. Mine cost £5k more, with 1000 miles less.Edited because I can't add up.
Edited by groucho on Sunday 5th December 11:10
groucho said:
M-J-B said:
'08, 22,000 miles, nice spec for under £30k and so on.
That one does seem to be below price for a model of that age and mileage. I would have certainly looked at that one before buying my current one. Mine cost £6k more, with 1000 miles less.I dont think that car is representative of plummiting values, simply a car priced to sell quickly.
Great Pretender said:
Once they start hitting big miles and warranties are no longer possible, I'd wager that values will plummet rapidly. Ultimately, once the E60 M5 is no longer current, very few will want a V10 four door saloon with a reputation for fragility - even one that will do 200mph.
Agreed.I very nearly bought another e60 m5 a few months ago - it was a 2009 car with less than 5,000 miles on it (so it had the HDD idrive) for just under £50k. But, despite having had one before, the "reputation for fragility" and the idiosyncracies of the SMG put me off buying it in the end, because I decided that the car's value would bomb with the unveiling/arrival of the F10 (due to its rep/SMG). Mostly because of the "marmite" nature of the SMG, I think that the residuals of the e60s will suffer far more than those of the e39 did with the arrival of the new model. At least with the e39, buyers did not have to worry about messing around with SMG; it was a rock solid car with a no-nonsense manual.
I'll be keeping my eye on the market over the next year, waiting for values to drop further so that I can pick up another e60, and in the meantime seeing what they do with the f10.
M-J-B said:
ArmaghMan said:
Roll on the day....
The E39 M5 has been at "sensible" money for ages now. The E60 still has a long long way to go.
Anyone care to predict when the £15k E60 M5 will become areality?
12-18 months max for a leggy one I would suggest.The E39 M5 has been at "sensible" money for ages now. The E60 still has a long long way to go.
Anyone care to predict when the £15k E60 M5 will become areality?
I imagine plenty of those 20k miles a year owners who bought the first cars will look to get rid once the numbers on the oddo hit six digits.
God help them in a trade in
M-J-B said:
ArmaghMan said:
Roll on the day....
The E39 M5 has been at "sensible" money for ages now. The E60 still has a long long way to go.
Anyone care to predict when the £15k E60 M5 will become areality?
12-18 months max for a leggy one I would suggest.The E39 M5 has been at "sensible" money for ages now. The E60 still has a long long way to go.
Anyone care to predict when the £15k E60 M5 will become areality?
Great Pretender said:
M-J-B said:
ArmaghMan said:
Roll on the day....
The E39 M5 has been at "sensible" money for ages now. The E60 still has a long long way to go.
Anyone care to predict when the £15k E60 M5 will become areality?
12-18 months max for a leggy one I would suggest.The E39 M5 has been at "sensible" money for ages now. The E60 still has a long long way to go.
Anyone care to predict when the £15k E60 M5 will become areality?
I imagine plenty of those 20k miles a year owners who bought the first cars will look to get rid once the numbers on the oddo hit six digits.
God help them in a trade in
ecain63 said:
Yeah, a bit of research shows that 05 and 06 cars are the only ones to have the SMG issues. But isnt that what a warranty is for?
True. There were also some minor improvements from about 2007 or early 2008, but so minor that I can't really remember many of them; e.g. different rear lights (LED?); programmable favourites buttons; and the later cars seemed to sound much smoother on startup than earlier ones. The car is awesome.....I'm sick of all the ill-informed crap about fragile SMG, bla bla bla....
I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. f
k IT
Life's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. f
k ITLife's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
Jazzer said:
The car is awesome.....I'm sick of all the ill-informed crap about fragile SMG, bla bla bla....
I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. fk IT
Life's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
A tenet for life itself, well said that man. A more depressing thread I`ve not seen. I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. f
k ITLife's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
jontysafe said:
Jazzer said:
The car is awesome.....I'm sick of all the ill-informed crap about fragile SMG, bla bla bla....
I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. fk IT
Life's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
A tenet for life itself, well said that man. A more depressing thread I`ve not seen. I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. f
k ITLife's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
Of course life is too short, and I am the worlds worst at buying things for that very reason. I do still find it sad that such works of art will in the not too distant future be just that.
I was also hoping for some positive comments, my intention was not simply to depress!
interesting thread...I too are potentially buying an m5 (for 19k in fact) but the same old demons keep putting me off the deal
1.SMG Issues etc...its a 2005 car 55' plate
2. Typical BMW inability to drive in the winter....my 335d's been in the garage for 2 weeks cause of the snow!
3. The "D" word....big car with a big engine is a perfect combination of substantial depreciation...look at the Audi v10 S8!
4. A 996 Turbo keeps sitting on my shoulder as a temptation...but another kid on the way is making this one look less likely
5. I know the previous poster said fk it but i suppose the pre-buying behavior of us humans needs others to give us confidence and reason to buy various cars.
1.SMG Issues etc...its a 2005 car 55' plate
2. Typical BMW inability to drive in the winter....my 335d's been in the garage for 2 weeks cause of the snow!
3. The "D" word....big car with a big engine is a perfect combination of substantial depreciation...look at the Audi v10 S8!
4. A 996 Turbo keeps sitting on my shoulder as a temptation...but another kid on the way is making this one look less likely
5. I know the previous poster said f
k it but i suppose the pre-buying behavior of us humans needs others to give us confidence and reason to buy various cars. jontysafe said:
Jazzer said:
The car is awesome.....I'm sick of all the ill-informed crap about fragile SMG, bla bla bla....
I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. fk IT
Life's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
A tenet for life itself, well said that man. A more depressing thread I`ve not seen. I just love mine and frankly don't give a damn about depreciation, as that only spoils the ownership experience.....
Three steps to happiness govern my life:
1. BUY IT
2. DRIVE IT
3. f
k ITLife's just too short to worry unduly.....you'll soon be at the Doc with abdominal pain, then it'll be Goodnight Vienna.....you'll be fooked and might even regret not getting your dream cars!
Jazzer
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