Old car but sold as new !!
Discussion
Wife bought her Merc A Class from Merc Dealer here in Sep 2009. Car has been back to another Merc Dealer twice for routine service. Last service, 4 weeks ago they replaced part of a rear non functioning seat belt under warranty. Now , 4 weeks later wife gets call from this Merc Dealer that she owes them €150 as her car is a new old car, ie its "several " years old.Dealer says Merc Ireland has refused the claim. She bought it new from the showroom of the first Merc Dealer, who since Sep 09 has gone bust, and the new dealer says her car was old stock and that merc here in Ireland has refused her warranty claim, even tho its within the 2 years as they consider the car old, ie secondhand. When she got it , it was bought as new and unregistered.
Any advice from anyone on here who has had a similar problem ? I feel that even if they accept she has warranty that when she comes to sell the car , it will be on some sort of internal Merc blacklist. Should she go legal, attempt to hand the car back and get a refund etc. Thanks in advance.
Any advice from anyone on here who has had a similar problem ? I feel that even if they accept she has warranty that when she comes to sell the car , it will be on some sort of internal Merc blacklist. Should she go legal, attempt to hand the car back and get a refund etc. Thanks in advance.
She is the first keeper and has her receipt from new. My worry is that there is an internal Merc Black list here in Ireland when we come to trade it in we'll get a bad price . It s a small market here and dealers ring up each other when you go to trade in. And what if something goes wrong in future, engine say, they probally wont do it without payment up front.
pioneer said:
majordad said:
Sorry , I meant to post this under gassing, but pressed the wrong button. I live on the Porsche forum so perhaps someone knows the answer from experience. Please can a mod move this post to gassing.
I would tell them to bugger off. Warranty starts from the time you buy the car, not the date it was made. They wouldnt have a leg to stand on if you can prove the date you bought it and are the first reg keeper....Edited by pioneer on Tuesday 18th January 22:37
pioneer said:
Monkeylegend said:
pioneer said:
majordad said:
Sorry , I meant to post this under gassing, but pressed the wrong button. I live on the Porsche forum so perhaps someone knows the answer from experience. Please can a mod move this post to gassing.
I would tell them to bugger off. Warranty starts from the time you buy the car, not the date it was made. They wouldnt have a leg to stand on if you can prove the date you bought it and are the first reg keeper....Edited by pioneer on Tuesday 18th January 22:37
I live in Ireland, bought the car new from one of the Irish Merc Dealers. The V5 shows the date we bought the car. It was like you buy any new car, go into dealer, agree deal. pay up, they AFTERWARDS register the caar. It was not pre-registered. Irish Merc Warranty is 2 years, maybe you have 3 in UK, and this would explain the What Car Readers problem.
pioneer said:
majordad said:
I live in Ireland, bought the car new from one of the Irish Merc Dealers. The V5 shows the date we bought the car. It was like you buy any new car, go into dealer, agree deal. pay up, they AFTERWARDS register the caar. It was not pre-registered. Irish Merc Warranty is 2 years, maybe you have 3 in UK, and this would explain the What Car Readers problem.
Then if you bought the car is sep 2009, your warranty runs out in sep 2011. I really can't see it any other way? Call your local trading standards or consumer advise?my wife and i both drive mercedes we have never had a problem even with imports,merc tend to do non warranty work on goodwill or with a contribution.check if irish merc dealers are franchised or merc owned.good luck.
If there's 3 years here and 2 in Ireland then I imagine it's like BMW, Audi, VW where the factory cover the first 2 years and the UK network covers the 3rd year (and whilst, for Audi & VW, the first 2 years are unlimited mileage the third year carries a 60,000 mile limit, unless you advance purchase a derestriction to this from Audi/VW).
That aside, it is possible to buy new unregistered cars in the UK on which the warranty has already begun. These are usually sold by non-franchise dealers and have been supplied new by foreign dealerships - Holland, Belgium, Cyprus etc so when it left their dealership the warranty cover started. If it's 9 months later that you buy it as new from the UK dealer they are still allowed to register it as new with DVLA (subject to under a certain mileage on the clock I think, to allow for foreign collection on export plates) but your warranty has already run for 9 months.
This sounds like the situation you're in Dave, but very unusual in that it was a franchise dealer you've bought from. As they no longer exist I don't think you're in a strong position legally, but it's worth contacting Mercedes Ireland as they have allowed one of their dealers to trade using their name and hence expectation of service & back-up and then are failing to provide it.
If you're ever in this situation again, check the chassis number of the car to confirm the model year, and check with the manufacturer about warranty cover if necessary. I had a 1993 registered 964 last year which from the chassis number was actually a 1991MY - unusual with Porsche but there were cars unsold for some time back then. However, as it was sold as new by an OPC it should have had 2 years warranty from then.
HTH
That aside, it is possible to buy new unregistered cars in the UK on which the warranty has already begun. These are usually sold by non-franchise dealers and have been supplied new by foreign dealerships - Holland, Belgium, Cyprus etc so when it left their dealership the warranty cover started. If it's 9 months later that you buy it as new from the UK dealer they are still allowed to register it as new with DVLA (subject to under a certain mileage on the clock I think, to allow for foreign collection on export plates) but your warranty has already run for 9 months.
This sounds like the situation you're in Dave, but very unusual in that it was a franchise dealer you've bought from. As they no longer exist I don't think you're in a strong position legally, but it's worth contacting Mercedes Ireland as they have allowed one of their dealers to trade using their name and hence expectation of service & back-up and then are failing to provide it.
If you're ever in this situation again, check the chassis number of the car to confirm the model year, and check with the manufacturer about warranty cover if necessary. I had a 1993 registered 964 last year which from the chassis number was actually a 1991MY - unusual with Porsche but there were cars unsold for some time back then. However, as it was sold as new by an OPC it should have had 2 years warranty from then.
HTH
Further info has come to light so someone , Goose ?, might be able to advise. AS I said we bought the car new unregistered from the Merc Dealer 4/8/2009. The V5 says date of manufacture 2009 and the printed receipt on the headed paper from the dealer says date of manufacture 2009. The new dealer says the car was built May 2006. I've checked the tyres, orginal set still on car and code is 2006, so they are May 2006, and confirm things. What should I do, I suppose go legal and hand the car back. It was dishonest of the first dealer to enter the wrong dates or fraud ? Advice please.
Not good.
I can't see how going legal would help as the original supplying dealer are no longer trading? In the warranty paperwork does it say that the warranty lasts two years from registration or from manufacture? If the latter, then your car never had a warranty in the first place when sold to you. If the former, I can't see the problem and any mercedes dealer should be able to honour a warranty claim.
I know you're looking just for some advice/guidance, I just want to point out the obvious that bringing this up in such a public forum mightn't be the best idea, if you do want to keep this off any possible "black list". I'm sure we're all aware that dealers/insurers etc monitor forums.
Apologies if I'm stating the bleeding obvious here.
I can't see how going legal would help as the original supplying dealer are no longer trading? In the warranty paperwork does it say that the warranty lasts two years from registration or from manufacture? If the latter, then your car never had a warranty in the first place when sold to you. If the former, I can't see the problem and any mercedes dealer should be able to honour a warranty claim.
I know you're looking just for some advice/guidance, I just want to point out the obvious that bringing this up in such a public forum mightn't be the best idea, if you do want to keep this off any possible "black list". I'm sure we're all aware that dealers/insurers etc monitor forums.
Apologies if I'm stating the bleeding obvious here.
Edited by anniesdad on Thursday 27th January 14:26
Zip106 said:
Have a look at the seat belts.
There should be a tag on them stating the year.
And on the windscreen too, but it doesn't really seem in doubt that the car was manufactured 2006.There should be a tag on them stating the year.
It looks like the dealer has pulled a fast one but as
a) they are no longer in business and
b) were an official Mercedes dealer at the time
I would try Mercedes Ireland HQ as they should really take some responsibility for their appointed dealer's actions (they expect you to put trust in a dealership because they are officially appointed so they should expect to deal with any issues where that trust is broken). If they fail to then you could try Germany I suppose otherwise unfortunately you're probably stuffed
If Merc Ireland don't offer any help then you could threaten them with legal action but actually taking any such action may not be worth the risk if you rack up legal bills doing so. In the UK you can claim a specified amount up to £5000 in the small claims court, where no-one can claim legal costs (and lawyers aren't necessarily needed anyway) but I'm not sure what happens in Ireland.
Was it an 'old model' that you bought at a discounted price or the current 2009 model ?
I would have thought if the later, then Mercedes Ireland should honor their warranty as it was sold to you as a current new model and you had no idea that you where buying anything different than another new A Class in any other Mercedes showroom.
If the former and you did get a discounted 'old model' then that might explain why they are hesitant to give you the full warranty.
I would have thought if the later, then Mercedes Ireland should honor their warranty as it was sold to you as a current new model and you had no idea that you where buying anything different than another new A Class in any other Mercedes showroom.
If the former and you did get a discounted 'old model' then that might explain why they are hesitant to give you the full warranty.
The warranty is 2 years from date you buy the car new and it's a mercedes warranty, not the dealer. Covers worldwide for that time.
What do you mean the new 2009 model, mine looks identical to all the other 2009/10/11 ones I've seen. When did the most recent one come in, 2005 I think.
The dealer putting 2009 as year of manufacture on the V5 and on my receipt would surely be fraud or negligence. When a dealer goes bust the liability for the car moves to the manufacturer, they were officially appointed agents.
I'll keep you posted and let you know what happens.
What do you mean the new 2009 model, mine looks identical to all the other 2009/10/11 ones I've seen. When did the most recent one come in, 2005 I think.
The dealer putting 2009 as year of manufacture on the V5 and on my receipt would surely be fraud or negligence. When a dealer goes bust the liability for the car moves to the manufacturer, they were officially appointed agents.
I'll keep you posted and let you know what happens.
A couple of points to note:
The manufacture date on a V5 is always the date the car is registered and never relates to the date the car was actually manufactured.
There is no Mercedes-Benz Ireland like we have Mercedes-Benz UK. MB cars are imported to Ireland by a 3rd party (i.e. not part of Daimler AG) called Motor Distributors Ltd.
All MB cars have a standard 2 year warranty backed by the factory. UK cars have an additional 3rd year warranty backed by MBUK. Warranties on UK cars always start from the date of registration irrespective of the actual age of the car - I'd be amazed if it was different in Ireland.
However, on the assumption that either the dealer or Motor Distributors Ltd are being an arse, I would contact the European customer service centre on 00800 9777 7777 and ask if they can assist.
The manufacture date on a V5 is always the date the car is registered and never relates to the date the car was actually manufactured.
There is no Mercedes-Benz Ireland like we have Mercedes-Benz UK. MB cars are imported to Ireland by a 3rd party (i.e. not part of Daimler AG) called Motor Distributors Ltd.
All MB cars have a standard 2 year warranty backed by the factory. UK cars have an additional 3rd year warranty backed by MBUK. Warranties on UK cars always start from the date of registration irrespective of the actual age of the car - I'd be amazed if it was different in Ireland.
However, on the assumption that either the dealer or Motor Distributors Ltd are being an arse, I would contact the European customer service centre on 00800 9777 7777 and ask if they can assist.
On the V5 it's the "Date of Registration" right - not the date of manufacture?
If so, and as you say the warranty runs from this date I fail to see the issue and this is simply a case of MB trying to wriggle out of paying a warranty claim on a 5 year old car. Albeit one that was registered less than 2 years ago.
If so, and as you say the warranty runs from this date I fail to see the issue and this is simply a case of MB trying to wriggle out of paying a warranty claim on a 5 year old car. Albeit one that was registered less than 2 years ago.
I believe it is date of regristration, otherwise all the cars that have been sat at the docks for 18 months would be sold off dirt cheap as warranty will be almost out.
OP suggest you go to another Mercedes dealer and say you are interested in buying a new merc but heard rumours that warranty is from manufacture date and not sale date and can they confirm.
Im sure they will say sale date to you. if they do ask for it in writing and use that as your stick!!!
OP suggest you go to another Mercedes dealer and say you are interested in buying a new merc but heard rumours that warranty is from manufacture date and not sale date and can they confirm.
Im sure they will say sale date to you. if they do ask for it in writing and use that as your stick!!!
I'm trying to post this in a manner that relates to you people in the UK. In Ireland we do not have a V5 identical to yours, ours is one of the standard European ones. There's a part of it that has a space for year of first registration and another space for year of manufacture and another still for year of regristration in Ireland. Many of our cars secondhand are UK Imports.
I agree Mercedes Ireland are trying to wriggle out paying my warranty claim but it s future possible warranty claims and resale value that concerns me. As it is now, I will be legaly bound to tell any future buyer that my car is an old new car, even though I was not told by the dealer'
Def I will go legal, IMHO Mercedes Ireland via their dealer were dishonest and fraudalent.
Watch this space but it might take 3 years.
I agree Mercedes Ireland are trying to wriggle out paying my warranty claim but it s future possible warranty claims and resale value that concerns me. As it is now, I will be legaly bound to tell any future buyer that my car is an old new car, even though I was not told by the dealer'
Def I will go legal, IMHO Mercedes Ireland via their dealer were dishonest and fraudalent.
Watch this space but it might take 3 years.
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