Lose fat then bulk up?

[Momentofmadness]

Hi all,

Don't hate me for another gym thread

I'm 37 years old, 5' 8", 11 stone, carry little muscle and a slight family pack going on

Soooo as far as I get understand, to put muscle on, I have to take in more calories than I would normally - so am I best losing the tummy with lots of cardio / calorie cutting (this is when I usually look unhealthly thin!) then start to build-up cos I really don't want to make my tummy bigger than it is

Hope this makes sense - I've done lots of searching but all the differing information has confused me a little (ok, a lot !)

TIA

[grumbledoak]

Er, pick one. You'll confuse the Hell out of yourself trying to do both at once.

[Momentofmadness]

grumbledoak said:

Er, pick one. You'll confuse the Hell out of yourself trying to do both at once.

That's kinda what I mean, do I lose the gut completely then embark on the muscle gain or would a little bit of tummy go as part of the muscle building process? I'd imagine not, if I'm taking extra calories in?

Confused.com

[rudecherub]

most body builders bulk up then cut ie lose weight

for what it's worth resistance training is the best way to lose fat, I'd look at my diet - of course - aim to eat well, real food rather than prepackaged junk.

If you're going to train you need to eat.

[grumbledoak]

Momentofmadness said:

if I'm taking extra calories in?

And there you go again.

How about you just get a bit more exercise and ignore the scales? For a few months. Judge yourself by the belt.

[Ordinary_Chap]

rudecherub said:

most body builders bulk up then cut ie lose weight

for what it's worth resistance training is the best way to lose fat, I'd look at my diet - of course - aim to eat well, real food rather than prepackaged junk.

If you're going to train you need to eat.

Resistance training is the best way to lose fat?

To the OP, don't bulk if you're already over weight you'll look awful. Get down to a good weight then clean/slow bulk and you'll look far better and be far more healthy.

[RV8]

Are you sure you need to lose weight, are you slight built? Only reason I ask is that I'm just 2 inches taller but 12.5 stone, do not look overweight but do a physical job and cycle. Do you want to look big or simply gain strength? I've always advocated physical work as a means to gain strength, digging footings by hand and pushing full wheel barrows up hills for eight hours a day and the like, some of the strongest people I've known have been laborers. Seeing as this is perhaps an unrealistic scenario for most you could try doing some lighter weights and increase the reps and go for a regular run, build up the weights as you increase stamina and strength.

[goldblum]

Best way to lose fat is dieting.Combine that with cardio and lastly weights.However..

In the OPs case the easiest option would be to go for muscle growth and then incorporate diet.More muscle equals a higher BMR so you burn more cals just standing

around.Push the weights and when you notice growth (about a month give or take)Increase protein and cut fats etc.Add a bit of cardio.

The above is by far the easiest option,and by Spring,with some determination,you should easily see the results as your stomach flattens and muscle bulk

increases.

You CAN lose fat and try to bulk at the same time but it's hard work,watching food,counting cals,monitoring cardio/heartrate etc..if you don't have to then I'd

bulk first then diet.

[RJB_666]

I'd suggest that you did a bit of both. But always do your primary target first. Say you want to lose a bit of weight start with cardio then lifting after. Just do more reps when doing weights to start with. Also do not under estimate diet. This is possibly more important than the training aspect. Keep it varied as well. For two reasons. Your body needs to be shocked and also it will stop you getting bored and losing interest.

[Fatman2]

Personally I'd look at losing body fat as a goal but start lifting some weights in addition to your cardio. As someone else has said though, start out lifting slightly lower weights with higher reps (maybe 12-15 reps at ~70% of your 1 rep max).

I'm not sure if you've lifted weights before but if not then doing a stint of lighter weights will set you off nicely. By the time you've lost the bulk of your body fat then you can start ramping the weights up and doing it as cleanly as possible.

[Momentofmadness]

Thanks for all the replies everyone, PH is banned at work so I'm only catching up now!

I've looked at ordinary_chap's very impressive thread but I'm starting from skinny and no muscle (and a bit of a tummy - about 3 months pregnant is not the look I want )

As suggested, I'll keep up the cardio and weights until I am as lean as a lean thing, and only then go for the 'clean' bulk - I'm just a bit scared that I'll end up as a porker like I once was, but the too-thin, no muscle look is not very appealing to me either!

Thanks everyone

[mcelliott]

I don't understand why people make things so complicated....clean bulk, high reps, low reps....WTF?

Just go to the gym, lift some weights using compound/core exercises and strict form, keep your reps between 8 and 12; high reps waste of time. Sort your diet out, do the necessary amount of aerobic exercise, get plenty of rest. It really is that simple (note, simple, not easy).

[Fatman2]

mcelliott said:

I don't understand why people make things so complicated....clean bulk, high reps, low reps....WTF?

Just go to the gym, lift some weights using compound/core exercises and strict form, keep your reps between 8 and 12; high reps waste of time. Sort your diet out, do the necessary amount of aerobic exercise, get plenty of rest. It really is that simple (note, simple, not easy).

I see what you did there. Slate folks for advising high reps/low reps and then you go for the safe middle ground with 8-12

I may be making an assumption here but it doesn't sound like the OP has lifted weights recently, in which case high reps are a good idea (12-15 reps that is). Maybe high reps are not for semi or experienced weight lifters but it isn't easy to get your form right when pushing at 85% of your capability. Plus it helps condition/prepare your body for lifting heavier later on. Kind of like running 1 or 2k first and building it up before taking on a 10k run.

Progressive training, it really is that simple

[ambuletz]

from my understanding, you can lose fat by combining cardio, with lifting weights, or doing just one (or doing none in some cases)
for weight loss, its all about creating a daily calorie deficit, regardless what form it comes in. just make sure you burn more then you consume. if you are lifting weights, its important to keep a good intake of protein. aiming for 50% protein 40% carb, 10% fat. lots of water, lots of vegetables.


with regards to bulking/gaining muscle. its a case of more lifting weights. don't do a calorie deficit. eat plenty of protein, and sources of 'good' fats. and making sure u get hte whole 1g of protein for every lb of lean body mass.

[mcelliott]

Fatman2 said:

mcelliott said:

I don't understand why people make things so complicated....clean bulk, high reps, low reps....WTF?

Just go to the gym, lift some weights using compound/core exercises and strict form, keep your reps between 8 and 12; high reps waste of time. Sort your diet out, do the necessary amount of aerobic exercise, get plenty of rest. It really is that simple (note, simple, not easy).

I see what you did there. Slate folks for advising high reps/low reps and then you go for the safe middle ground with 8-12

I may be making an assumption here but it doesn't sound like the OP has lifted weights recently, in which case high reps are a good idea (12-15 reps that is). Maybe high reps are not for semi or experienced weight lifters but it isn't easy to get your form right when pushing at 85% of your capability. Plus it helps condition/prepare your body for lifting heavier later on. Kind of like running 1 or 2k first and building it up before taking on a 10k run.

Progressive training, it really is that simple

I wasn't slating, I was merely pointing out that some people make going to the gym a rocket science. There is nothing more simple than packing on decent muscle with what I basically outlined in my original post. As regards the rep range, I stated 8 - 12 because like you, I assumed he's a newbie at the gym and may want to get the feel of the exercises that he's doing. I hope that's cleared up your confusion.

[Ordinary_Chap]

mcelliott said:

I wasn't slating, I was merely pointing out that some people make going to the gym a rocket science. There is nothing more simple than packing on decent muscle with what I basically outlined in my original post. As regards the rep range, I stated 8 - 12 because like you, I assumed he's a newbie at the gym and may want to get the feel of the exercises that he's doing. I hope that's cleared up your confusion.

I agree 8-12 is good and over 3 sets will be plenty with maybe two exercises per body part and 3 after a few months.

Here's what I'd do, start on a quite lean diet, weight train 4 times a week and add HIIT training to the end of each weights session for around 20 minutes.

I'd then use probably one or two off days for some cardio work, I always try to do the things I find fun, so I go swimming, cycling or a play a sport.

Although at the moment, I'm trying to add muscle fairly quickly so I'm not doing any CV at all but want too as I've lost some tone.

[Fatman2]

mcelliott said:

I wasn't slating, I was merely pointing out that some people make going to the gym a rocket science. There is nothing more simple than packing on decent muscle with what I basically outlined in my original post. As regards the rep range, I stated 8 - 12 because like you, I assumed he's a newbie at the gym and may want to get the feel of the exercises that he's doing. I hope that's cleared up your confusion.

I was taking the piss

[Momentofmadness]

Rob287 said:

Momentofmadness said:

Thanks for all the replies everyone, PH is banned at work so I'm only catching up now!

I've looked at ordinary_chap's very impressive thread but I'm starting from skinny and no muscle (and a bit of a tummy - about 3 months pregnant is not the look I want )

As suggested, I'll keep up the cardio and weights until I am as lean as a lean thing, and only then go for the 'clean' bulk - I'm just a bit scared that I'll end up as a porker like I once was, but the too-thin, no muscle look is not very appealing to me either!

Thanks everyone

I did a similar thing a few years ago. I'm 6' dead on and started at 80kg, which 23% of me was fat.

Over 8 weeks I got myself down to 72Kg at 10% body fat. I looked ill mind you. To do this I was doing about 40mins of cardio a day with a few bits of resistance training, but I was new to it at the time.

I then started to cut back on the cardio and focused more on weight training. I'm now at 84Kg and 15% body fat.

I'm not that strict with my diet but do eat every 3 hours trying to get a good balance of protein fat and carbs. Don't be scared to eat too much! I spent nearly a year 'worried' I would get fat again, when infact I wasted my time because I wasn't eating enough and never put any weight on.

Over the last 6 months I've put on about 7Kg just by eating everything I can get my hands on. Don't waste your time making the same mistake as me!

Cheers Rob, that does sound just like me - when I lost the tummy, people said I looked ill and I nearly put someones eye out whith my shoulder bones sticking out

That's just the type of result I'm looking for - well done!

[ukwill]

Rob287 said:

I did a similar thing a few years ago. I'm 6' dead on and started at 80kg, which 23% of me was fat.

Over 8 weeks I got myself down to 72Kg at 10% body fat. I looked ill mind you. To do this I was doing about 40mins of cardio a day with a few bits of resistance training, but I was new to it at the time.

I then started to cut back on the cardio and focused more on weight training. I'm now at 84Kg and 15% body fat.

I'm not that strict with my diet but do eat every 3 hours trying to get a good balance of protein fat and carbs. Don't be scared to eat too much! I spent nearly a year 'worried' I would get fat again, when infact I wasted my time because I wasn't eating enough and never put any weight on.

Over the last 6 months I've put on about 7Kg just by eating everything I can get my hands on. Don't waste your time making the same mistake as me!

You lost 13% bodyfat in 8wks?

how?!