Trade abusing "for sale" section...

[Diesel130]

OK. Friday's rant. I went to view "997's for sale", sorted by advert age and the first 6 adverts (yes 6) are from 911Virgin for "cars wanted".

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2444978.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2445004.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2445010.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2445013.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2445019.htm
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2445024.htm

I know Henry's been doing well selling lots, but there is a specific section for "wanted" cars.

And he's not the worst... at least his says "wanted" in the title. There are others (Paragon & Romans) who show a picture of a nice car, with an attractive price and you click on it and find its a "wanted" advert.

e.g: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2236888.htm
& http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2327456.htm

What's the matter with these people - aren't they aware there's a "wanted" section, or are they so bullish they think they can just barge in and clog up the "for sale" section with wanted ads??

[kusee pee]

It bugs me too.

[keysersoze]

I'm sick of seeing the 3 997' that Sterlings bump up the for sale section many times a day.... they have been for sale for months now...

[SignalGruen]

I'm guessing that they have a better response when posting in that section. I assume that most people who are thinking of selling their car would browse the 'for sale' section first to get a feel for prices of a similar model.

[ammw]

Annoys me too.

Also annoying is the dealers that list cars with no price, so when you order by price (Low->High), you have to skip past all these ads with no price.

[IMac]

Or just click the "report..." button at the top right of the ad.

I agree with the previous post that price should be a mandatory field.

[Henry-F]

We put adverts in like that because many people look through Pistonheads to gauge a price for their cars and aren't aware that there are traders who offer a credible alternative to a private sale or trade in. We also advertise in the wanted section but many people don't think to look in there.

We try not to flood a section with adverts, unfortunately we put a series of adverts on P/H a few weeks ago now and so they will be grouped together on a most recent based search. I have to say I'm surprised they came up on the first page on Friday. By then they should have slipped well down the order. We don't refresh them to keep them "most recent".

We space the adverts out so as to target different sections within the 997 range. You will appreciate there is quite a large spread from £30k to well over £60k and we are involved across the range. Hence the number of adverts.

When we sell a car Pistonheads keeps the advert live (so as to big up the fact they have sold another car !!), and to some extent that's not a bad thing. If you saw a car you liked but then spent 10 minutes trying to find it again because it had been removed instantly following a sale it's better to keep it there but show it as sold.

Ultimately traders pay to advertise on Pistonheads and it is that revenue which allows Pitonheads to exist, you to enjoy lively debate and more importantly in the classified section you to advertise your private sale car for free.

It's a bit like the adverts on commercial TV. I get upset that even after paying over £70 a month on Sky I have to sit through hours of commercials.

I hope that explains things a little.

Henry

[Henry-F]

Just to add, I also think that "Price on application" on unpriced adverts are a bit underhand.

I did think it was a legal requirement to advertise the price of cars, certainly there had to be a price list available somewhere. I may be wrong.

Either way I totally ignore products that are advertised without prices, I don't want to embarrass myself with back pedalling when enjoying the dealer's hospitality only to then discover I'm ten grand light

Keep smiling

Henry

[Carlton Banks]

Why don't you use the correct section then?

[Mr Will]

Henry-F said:

We put adverts in like that because many people look through Pistonheads to gauge a price for their cars and aren't aware that there are traders who offer a credible alternative to a private sale or trade in. We also advertise in the wanted section but many people don't think to look in there.

We try not to flood a section with adverts, unfortunately we put a series of adverts on P/H a few weeks ago now and so they will be grouped together on a most recent based search. I have to say I'm surprised they came up on the first page on Friday. By then they should have slipped well down the order. We don't refresh them to keep them "most recent".

We space the adverts out so as to target different sections within the 997 range. You will appreciate there is quite a large spread from £30k to well over £60k and we are involved across the range. Hence the number of adverts.

When we sell a car Pistonheads keeps the advert live (so as to big up the fact they have sold another car !!), and to some extent that's not a bad thing. If you saw a car you liked but then spent 10 minutes trying to find it again because it had been removed instantly following a sale it's better to keep it there but show it as sold.

Ultimately traders pay to advertise on Pistonheads and it is that revenue which allows Pitonheads to exist, you to enjoy lively debate and more importantly in the classified section you to advertise your private sale car for free.

It's a bit like the adverts on commercial TV. I get upset that even after paying over £70 a month on Sky I have to sit through hours of commercials.

I hope that explains things a little.

Henry

I understand why you do it, but unfortunately Henry we don't allow wanted adverts in the for sale sections and move them over to the correct category whenever we spot them. I know they work well for you, but the wanted section exists for a reason and we like to keep the "For Sale" sections tidy for prospective buyers.

If there is anyone else doing the same thing, then hit the "Report to Administrator" button and we'll make sure they get sorted too.

[anonymous-user]

Henry-F said:

Ultimately traders pay to advertise on Pistonheads and it is that revenue which allows Pitonheads to exist

and ultimately the traders who don't follow the simple classified section rules are pissing of their potential customers in the same way that due to the large amount of scamming nigerian emails that I receive now means that I no longer send large sums of money via western union to unknown beneficiaries

Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 11th February 12:34

[Carlton Banks]

acer12 said:

Henry-F said:

Ultimately traders pay to advertise on Pistonheads and it is that revenue which allows Pitonheads to exist

and ultimately the traders who don't follow the simple classified section rules are pissing of their potential customers in a way that scamming nigerian emails mean that I no longer send large sums via western union to unknown beneficiaries

[Wadeski]

Not to mention the cars (not usually Porsches to be fair) that are in New York or California, with a stock photo and no price...

[Diesel130]

Mr Will said:

I understand why you do it, but unfortunately Henry we don't allow wanted adverts in the for sale sections and move them over to the correct category whenever we spot them. I know they work well for you, but the wanted section exists for a reason and we like to keep the "For Sale" sections tidy for prospective buyers.

If there is anyone else doing the same thing, then hit the "Report to Administrator" button and we'll make sure they get sorted too.

Thanks for the clarification...

I'll keep smiling now

[Henry-F]

acer12 said:

and ultimately the traders who don't follow the simple classified section rules are pissing of their potential customers in the same way that due to the large amount of scamming nigerian emails that I receive now means that I no longer send large sums of money via western union to unknown beneficiaries

Edited by acer12 on Friday 11th February 12:34

I don't think we are unique in how we use the classified section.

I would rather see a nice clear wanted advert in there rather than a "legal" just sold similar required advert which you might not immediately spot.

Possibly the answer is for us to stop advertising on Pistonheads and rely purely on Autotrader and other places. Fingers crossed others don't follow.

I hardly think we are representative of a "Nigerian Scam" as you put it. Customers are paid out in full before they even leave us, we have been established for many years, are fully self financed, own all our stock outright (no stocking loans), own our premises and there is zero risk for someone selling a car to us.

I wonder if you could afford someone the same protection were you purchasing their car on a private basis ?

Henry

[Mr Will]

Henry-F said:

I would rather see a nice clear wanted advert in there rather than a "legal" just sold similar required advert which you might not immediately spot.

They aren't legal either (unless the advert is marked as sold, in which case they are easy to spot...)

[Diesel130]

There are clearly defined categories for Wanted vs. For Sale and a number of Traders have been abusing it for a while.

I think that is quite different to a genuine advert for a genuine car staying on for a week or two after it has sold, so you know its been sold.

However, some traders have also been putting up adverts along the lines of "sold this one, but now looking for similar", which is clearly a "wanted" advert, which should reside in the wanted section, so as not to clutter up / mislead and waste time of those wanting search for cars for sale.

[Henry-F]

Mr Will said:

I understand why you do it, but unfortunately Henry we don't allow wanted adverts in the for sale sections and move them over to the correct category whenever we spot them. I know they work well for you, but the wanted section exists for a reason and we like to keep the "For Sale" sections tidy for prospective buyers.

If there is anyone else doing the same thing, then hit the "Report to Administrator" button and we'll make sure they get sorted too.

And are you going to stop the rather slippery tactic of removing cars instantly that are tagged as "sold" but retain cars on the site that are tagged as "sold via pistonheads" so that decent traders such as ourselves who want to let customers who may have been following a car know it's sold have to say that it was Pistonheads who sold the car even though it wasn't.

You in return use that information to make spurious claims about the number of cars sold via your website.

Do as I say not as I do !!

We do it because it works, so why not listen to us and work with us rather than sitting in your ivory tower and dictating. It won't be long before Pistonheads takes over from eBay.

We had a discussion many years ago about this very topic with Pistonheads, we stopped putting wanted adverts in the for sale section and only came back recently when the section was proliferated with far worse adverts than ours. Number plates, car parts, servicing adverts, at least we buy and sell porsches.

Anyway, you do what you need to do. We'll do what we need to.

Henry

[Mr Will]

Henry-F said:

And are you going to stop the rather slippery tactic of removing cars instantly that are tagged as "sold" but retain cars on the site that are tagged as "sold via pistonheads" so that decent traders such as ourselves who want to let customers who may have been following a car know it's sold have to say that it was Pistonheads who sold the car even though it wasn't.

You in return use that information to make spurious claims about the number of cars sold via your website.

Do as I say not as I do !!

We do it because it works, so why not listen to us and work with us rather than sitting in your ivory tower and dictating. It won't be long before Pistonheads takes over from eBay.

It's not my place to decide upon the rules, I'm only trying to clarify them. If you want them changed then you are welcome to email Garlick, Stuart or chat to the sales team, but I am just a techie. There are changes to the classifeds afoot, so now is probably a good time to make suggestions if you have them, and we do listen!

Henry-F said:

We had a discussion many years ago about this very topic with Pistonheads, we stopped putting wanted adverts in the for sale section and only came back recently when the section was proliferated with far worse adverts than ours. Number plates, car parts, servicing adverts, at least we buy and sell porsches.

This is part of the problem, as soon as one person starts doing it, another joins in, and then two more, and then everyone is at it.

I know you don't mess around and overrun sections with adverts like these and do your best to post them in a sensitive fashion but we can't apply one rule for some people and a different one for others, and I can't ignore your adverts and still crack down on those who do take the mick. Once they are pointed out, we need to do something or the next person who's adverts we remove will just point the finger and say "but why is he allowed?"

As you said, Work with us rather than against us and we'll find something that works for everyone. I'm not just trying to be awkward.

[Martian O]

And what about the 996 cars advertised in the 997 sections? That's annoying too!