Audi TT (mk1) vs Leon Cupra R
Discussion
Just intrigued on your thoughts on this... the mk1 TT (225bhp) gets a general slating everywhere on here, but the Leon Cupra R is pretty much considered to be a good car.
But fundamentally they share the same engine (VAG 1.8T 225bhp).
I know there's more to a car than just the engine, but it's obviously a huge part of the appeal (or not) of the car... so is a TT considered "bad" largely because of it's image, whereas without the TT-image the LCR is considered "good"?
(for what it's worth, I like them both
)
But fundamentally they share the same engine (VAG 1.8T 225bhp).
I know there's more to a car than just the engine, but it's obviously a huge part of the appeal (or not) of the car... so is a TT considered "bad" largely because of it's image, whereas without the TT-image the LCR is considered "good"?
(for what it's worth, I like them both
)Have owned both. The Leon is much better setup in the way of brakes, handling, suspension and the general drive. The Audi is quite a bit heavier and it feels it - much more prone to understeer and wallows out of the box - not a bad car, but dont expect sports car, ie Boxster feel - it drives exactly the same as a Mk4 golf.
The TT gets a bad press generally by people who haven't driven one, and who jump on the hairdressers/golf-in-a-party frock bandwagon.
Neither are the last word in dynamic handling, but they have plenty of mechanical grip and can can be chucked around with confidence and as such are excellent fun to hustle down a B road. For me, the cupra R is the slightly better drivers car, but I would have the TT out of the two as it's just a more special place to sit.
Looks wise the TT is the clear winner for me too.
Neither are the last word in dynamic handling, but they have plenty of mechanical grip and can can be chucked around with confidence and as such are excellent fun to hustle down a B road. For me, the cupra R is the slightly better drivers car, but I would have the TT out of the two as it's just a more special place to sit.
Looks wise the TT is the clear winner for me too.
I quite fancy a TT, I drove an S3 and was impressed with its performance (mapped) and for most situations I would imagine the TT will grip pretty much enough for me, the 4wd will help compared to the Leon as in the wet anything with that kind of poke through just the front is going to struggle so I quite like the idea of a TT, plus though familiarity has brought some contempt I still think the MK1 is a stunning design, ok it may not be the last word in fun but for 5 grand or so for say a 2002 225 they aren't bad value, the common faults are easily sorted now.
The handling can be much improved via an uprated Haldex controller and careful selection of ARB sizes, a lot of the problem with the TT was dialled in at the recall because of a few high profile crashes in Germany where people died when doing high speed so the corporate response was to make it super safe with ESP, changed suspension settings and the spoiler.
I think price wise they have dropped about as far as they are going to go, even the earliest mega miles ones are 3k upwards, I cant see they dropping much more, I am thinking my money is safer in a TT than my current Saab or pretty much anything else you can buy for 5 grand, like it or not as Petrolheads, non Petrolheads cant get enough of them, I think we want to like it but the handling thing gets overplayed plus we don't like anything that trendy, non petrolheads like by default.
The handling can be much improved via an uprated Haldex controller and careful selection of ARB sizes, a lot of the problem with the TT was dialled in at the recall because of a few high profile crashes in Germany where people died when doing high speed so the corporate response was to make it super safe with ESP, changed suspension settings and the spoiler.
I think price wise they have dropped about as far as they are going to go, even the earliest mega miles ones are 3k upwards, I cant see they dropping much more, I am thinking my money is safer in a TT than my current Saab or pretty much anything else you can buy for 5 grand, like it or not as Petrolheads, non Petrolheads cant get enough of them, I think we want to like it but the handling thing gets overplayed plus we don't like anything that trendy, non petrolheads like by default.
rhinochopig said:
The TT gets a bad press generally by people who haven't driven one, and who jump on the hairdressers/golf-in-a-party frock bandwagon.
Neither are the last word in dynamic handling, but they have plenty of mechanical grip and can can be chucked around with confidence and as such are excellent fun to hustle down a B road. For me, the cupra R is the slightly better drivers car, but I would have the TT out of the two as it's just a more special place to sit.
Looks wise the TT is the clear winner for me too.
Agree entirely. My sister had the TT225 with the baseball glove interior, and no, it didn't handle in any way as well as my MR2 Turbo, or even the race prepped leda suspension Astra GTE that I used to hoon in. BUT, it was fun. The engine was good, in my humble opinion, and suited the car. It looks nicer than the Leon, and felt a bit more special. I only drove the Leon Cupra back in the late 90's, and whilst it was nice, it didn't, to me, feel any different to the other hatchbacks I'd driven at the time. Neither are the last word in dynamic handling, but they have plenty of mechanical grip and can can be chucked around with confidence and as such are excellent fun to hustle down a B road. For me, the cupra R is the slightly better drivers car, but I would have the TT out of the two as it's just a more special place to sit.
Looks wise the TT is the clear winner for me too.
I test drove a couple of the Mk1 225's last year. I think they're a lovely place to sit and be wafted about in, the interior is fantastic. They're not as fast the Cupra R though, or at least they don't feel it. As has been mentioned, they don't handle particularly well because they feel very 'fat' and front heavy, and you feel somewhat insulated from the speed. They're still a good car though, and the image never particularly bothered me. The handling was the slightly leaden affair you might expect from an Audi but the way the car loads up with it's bulk when braking and cornering is quite well telegraphed to the driver and inspires confidence when pressing on.
The Cupra R though, while I haven't driven one I have been a passenger in one. The interior isn't as good as as the Audi and it lacked that low slung seating position but it made much better use of the engine, being an extremely fast and capable car.
That said, they are two completely different cars that just happen to share the same engine. They'd both make excellent commuters although the Leon is more of the "Jekyll and Hyde" car, it can pass as a nice place to sit on a commute and then become a hilariously uncouth hot hatch as the impressive turbo spools up and hits you over the head with torque. You'd really have to drive them both to decide which one you preferred. I love the mk1 Audi T; it never got the praise it deserved and the mk2 looked too dull for my tastes. On the other hand, the Leon is an excellent hot hatch and is more in keeping with other cars in it's class like the Focus RS, the Scirocco R, the Civic Type R etc etc.
The Cupra R though, while I haven't driven one I have been a passenger in one. The interior isn't as good as as the Audi and it lacked that low slung seating position but it made much better use of the engine, being an extremely fast and capable car.
That said, they are two completely different cars that just happen to share the same engine. They'd both make excellent commuters although the Leon is more of the "Jekyll and Hyde" car, it can pass as a nice place to sit on a commute and then become a hilariously uncouth hot hatch as the impressive turbo spools up and hits you over the head with torque. You'd really have to drive them both to decide which one you preferred. I love the mk1 Audi T; it never got the praise it deserved and the mk2 looked too dull for my tastes. On the other hand, the Leon is an excellent hot hatch and is more in keeping with other cars in it's class like the Focus RS, the Scirocco R, the Civic Type R etc etc.
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