Advice requested: stalling TVR Griffith 500
Discussion
Would greatly appreciate ideas/feedback.
I have a '98 Griff 500 and live in Switzerland, so, specialist garages are rare.
It was never quite "right" from ownership a year ago, it was running a cylinder short for a while but that was fixed.
I had a short period of running fine but then with Winter the car was not used much.
In the last couple of months the car has randomly cut out (not always at the same speed but often at motorway cruising speed).
Recently the engine died at about 50 mph and all electrics went out (no LEDs on dash) and no braking. Coasted to a stop. Shortly afterwards it died again driving at reasonable speed, this time the electrics seemed on. I attempted to "bump" it in 2nd gear while coasting to a halt but nothing happened. I stopped both times and inserted the immobiliser key, and the car re-started first time.
Additionally, the car has been occasionally "missing" but now not for a little while, I think the garage was ablwe to sort it but yesterday after being impeccable on a 2 hour drive, close to home at low speed it felt sudedenly lost power but kept driving, sounding rough. The sound was not "tractor" rough but certainly it was not the normal engine note.
Then there was a small "jolt" as if a blockage cleared and it was instantly fine again. Not sure if any of these are connected but a garage has checked the obvious stuff like the plugs, leads etc., and also all the connections on the ECU, and all seems connected OK.
When these quirks are not happening the car runs brilliantly, and while the mechanic had the car for three weeks and regularly drove it for 30-45 minutes to try and diagnose the reason for it cutting out, it never had a glitch so it was hard for him to isolate.
Only other possibly relevant thing is that one time recently I ran out of petrol so maybe yesterday's low power was some dirt somewhere and not connected with the cutting out.
Anyone with suggestions or having had similar problems they were able to solve- I'd be hugely grateful because it is ruining my first year of ownership of a car I otherwise love.
I have a '98 Griff 500 and live in Switzerland, so, specialist garages are rare.
It was never quite "right" from ownership a year ago, it was running a cylinder short for a while but that was fixed.
I had a short period of running fine but then with Winter the car was not used much.
In the last couple of months the car has randomly cut out (not always at the same speed but often at motorway cruising speed).
Recently the engine died at about 50 mph and all electrics went out (no LEDs on dash) and no braking. Coasted to a stop. Shortly afterwards it died again driving at reasonable speed, this time the electrics seemed on. I attempted to "bump" it in 2nd gear while coasting to a halt but nothing happened. I stopped both times and inserted the immobiliser key, and the car re-started first time.
Additionally, the car has been occasionally "missing" but now not for a little while, I think the garage was ablwe to sort it but yesterday after being impeccable on a 2 hour drive, close to home at low speed it felt sudedenly lost power but kept driving, sounding rough. The sound was not "tractor" rough but certainly it was not the normal engine note.
Then there was a small "jolt" as if a blockage cleared and it was instantly fine again. Not sure if any of these are connected but a garage has checked the obvious stuff like the plugs, leads etc., and also all the connections on the ECU, and all seems connected OK.
When these quirks are not happening the car runs brilliantly, and while the mechanic had the car for three weeks and regularly drove it for 30-45 minutes to try and diagnose the reason for it cutting out, it never had a glitch so it was hard for him to isolate.
Only other possibly relevant thing is that one time recently I ran out of petrol so maybe yesterday's low power was some dirt somewhere and not connected with the cutting out.
Anyone with suggestions or having had similar problems they were able to solve- I'd be hugely grateful because it is ruining my first year of ownership of a car I otherwise love.
Edited by Chriseaborn on Monday 25th April 11:17
Not running a griffith but a wedge with a RV8 engine (flapper type).
Standard items I would look for:
- Earth straps
- Coolant temperature sensor (between distributor and the plenum, it is the one closest to the plenum). As it can cause overfuelling and starting or driving when warm or hot becomes impossible. Shorting it out for testing purposes (on my ECU it get the signal engine is hot) can be done quickly.
- My ECU needs a signal from the amplifier on the distributor to inject fuel. If the signal is intermittent the fuel is not always injected..... If you have an amplifier, follow the cable and check it. On mine the bullet connector close to the airflow meter was the cause. Cleaned it and taped it for security and no issues since.
Regards from Belgium to Switzerland,
Rob
Standard items I would look for:
- Earth straps
- Coolant temperature sensor (between distributor and the plenum, it is the one closest to the plenum). As it can cause overfuelling and starting or driving when warm or hot becomes impossible. Shorting it out for testing purposes (on my ECU it get the signal engine is hot) can be done quickly.
- My ECU needs a signal from the amplifier on the distributor to inject fuel. If the signal is intermittent the fuel is not always injected..... If you have an amplifier, follow the cable and check it. On mine the bullet connector close to the airflow meter was the cause. Cleaned it and taped it for security and no issues since.
Regards from Belgium to Switzerland,
Rob
Chriseaborn said:
Would greatly appreciate ideas/feedback.
In the last couple of months the car has randomly cut out (not always at the same speed but often at motorway cruising speed).
Recently the engine died at about 50 mph and all electrics went out (no LEDs on dash) and no braking. Coasted to a stop. Shortly afterwards it died again driving at reasonable speed, this time the electrics seemed on. I attempted to "bump" it in 2nd gear while coasting to a halt but nothing happened. I stopped both times and inserted the immobiliser key, and the car re-started first time.
Losing all the dash lights would seem to indicate some sort of electrical fault (loose connection, failing relay) before the ignition switch (or possibly a faulty ignition switch); but the fault doesn't seem to be consistent. When all the lights went out was anything else electrical still working (clock, stereo, indicators, fuel gauge)? What did you do besides turning off the ignition and then turning it back on and inserting the immobiliser key to get the lights to come back on?In the last couple of months the car has randomly cut out (not always at the same speed but often at motorway cruising speed).
Recently the engine died at about 50 mph and all electrics went out (no LEDs on dash) and no braking. Coasted to a stop. Shortly afterwards it died again driving at reasonable speed, this time the electrics seemed on. I attempted to "bump" it in 2nd gear while coasting to a halt but nothing happened. I stopped both times and inserted the immobiliser key, and the car re-started first time.
Engine cutting out while driving could also be the ignition amp or possibly the coil but I would expect you to have problems restarting it until it had cooled down a little. You may have more than one problem. I don't think the immobiliser key is relevant. If it was an immobiliser fault you would still have dash lights. I would see if you can find a good auto electrician to check it over.
I am sure you will have come across references to the dreaded 100amp fuse located on the chassis, well there is another 80amp fuse in an identical holder behind/to the side of the fuse board.
Both the 100 & 80amp fuses suffer from the same fault in that they can crack but still pass current through until it moves but then they seem to maracuously make contact again....
If the 100amp fuse faults you loose the alternator output, if the 80amp fuse faults you loose everything.
Another thing to cross off the checked list....
Bodders
Both the 100 & 80amp fuses suffer from the same fault in that they can crack but still pass current through until it moves but then they seem to maracuously make contact again....
If the 100amp fuse faults you loose the alternator output, if the 80amp fuse faults you loose everything.
Another thing to cross off the checked list....
Bodders
I can't add anything to the electrical cut out issue but the rest of your problems sound uncannily similar to mine. In addition I have experienced occasional cutting out at 5000 rmp as though the limiter had cut in early. When mine cut out or ran roughly, I would turn off the ignition whilst coasting wait two seconds turn ignition on wait another two seconds then bump start or turn the starter over and off it would go. This suggested that resetting the ECU was clearing the problem, however extensive testing could not determine what the problem was. Many of the usual suspects were replaced during recent modifications. So thoughts turned to fuel flow, turning ignition off and then on again reprimes the fuel pump and the latest work involved cleaning out fuel tank filter, replacing in line fuel filter and new fuel pump. It's early days yet but so far so good. I'll update either way in a week.
JF
JF
Hi, i have recently had the same problem in my 500, excepting the electrical part of the problem.
my stalling/cutting out was getting progressively worse during my day out, the only thing i could see that was different was i had let the car run lower on fuel than normal, so i pulled into a petrol station. When i took the cap off there was a large rush of air, i filled the car up and have not had a problem since.So, it might be that i had fuel starvation/vacuum ( leave the cap a little undone, or cut a notch in the cork washer. There may have been a blockage? or which somebody else suggested, as it was a very hot day and the engine temperature was up and the amount of fuel was low, that maybe the fuel was evaporating so not enough was getting through. I dont know if this will help at all, i hope so
Lester
my stalling/cutting out was getting progressively worse during my day out, the only thing i could see that was different was i had let the car run lower on fuel than normal, so i pulled into a petrol station. When i took the cap off there was a large rush of air, i filled the car up and have not had a problem since.So, it might be that i had fuel starvation/vacuum ( leave the cap a little undone, or cut a notch in the cork washer. There may have been a blockage? or which somebody else suggested, as it was a very hot day and the engine temperature was up and the amount of fuel was low, that maybe the fuel was evaporating so not enough was getting through. I dont know if this will help at all, i hope so
Lester
Did you check the connections on your magnetic pickup inside of the distributor?
On my car, it has been diagnosed that one of the two wires was shot.
The car would therefore start but as soon as a small amount of heat would be produced, the wire would tend to break the circuit open and the car would stop.
On my car, it has been diagnosed that one of the two wires was shot.
The car would therefore start but as soon as a small amount of heat would be produced, the wire would tend to break the circuit open and the car would stop.
many thanks for the feedback. There are a number of very interesting theories here, and I will take the information to my local mechanic and have him check them all.
Thanks again for the really useful ideas and when I have had it looked at I will re-post in a week or so, to say how it has gone.
Typically, for the moment, it is running like clockwork!
Chris
Thanks again for the really useful ideas and when I have had it looked at I will re-post in a week or so, to say how it has gone.
Typically, for the moment, it is running like clockwork!
Chris
I had what sounds like a similar issue with mine....intermittently when cruising along it appeared to drop a cylinder & stink of fuel. This was very intermitment and on checking the garage couldn't replicate it.
Then one day on my way to work it stalled and wouldn't start. So it went to garage on an AA truck and the garage couldn't get it to start. They took off & tested all HT & other leads and found no fault with them. They put it all back together and it's run perfectly ever since...So that would seem to suggest a dodgy connection somewhere casuing my issues. So, could be worthwhile disconnecting and reconncecting all leads. Good luck sorting it.
Then one day on my way to work it stalled and wouldn't start. So it went to garage on an AA truck and the garage couldn't get it to start. They took off & tested all HT & other leads and found no fault with them. They put it all back together and it's run perfectly ever since...So that would seem to suggest a dodgy connection somewhere casuing my issues. So, could be worthwhile disconnecting and reconncecting all leads. Good luck sorting it.
Cheers Dave.
The mechanic who looked at it is not a TVR specialist but a top-notch guy (race prepares things like 2.7 RSs, old Ferraris and so on), and he said he did that but is baffled. The darned thing is running like a Swiss watch right now, but I am in that frustrating zone of wanting to give it welly to see if it will go wrong again in the mountain twisties but of course I do not want to find I have no brakes, as happened previously... rock and hard place spring to mind. I really think I'll have to just take the list and get him to check everything everyone has mentioned.
The mechanic who looked at it is not a TVR specialist but a top-notch guy (race prepares things like 2.7 RSs, old Ferraris and so on), and he said he did that but is baffled. The darned thing is running like a Swiss watch right now, but I am in that frustrating zone of wanting to give it welly to see if it will go wrong again in the mountain twisties but of course I do not want to find I have no brakes, as happened previously... rock and hard place spring to mind. I really think I'll have to just take the list and get him to check everything everyone has mentioned.
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