too old for grad schemes, too inexperienced for workplace?
Discussion
I have a bit of a moot point in relation to my CV and general employability, so was wondering if there's any PH-er's that have advice on the issue. Apologise if this has been covered before, but another thread raised the idea in my conscience, so here goes:
I am approaching 24, with some financial comitments although not many, with the following education:
GCSE's (all A-C's)
AS & A levels in Business, ICT, Electronics and an AS in Law (not great grade)
2:1 BSc degree in Management, Communications and Technology (IT and Business mixed)
MSc in International Marketing
So, you could say my CV is fairly academic. Now for the opposing issue, my work related CV is mostly heavy industry, retail and hospitallity, i.e. relatively unskilled and includes some of the following jobs:
> 2years as a waiter in a chain pub
> 2years as a warehouse op for B&Q (through uni)
> retail work for a year
> 4months as a Marketing Co-Ordinator on a grad scheme with a small company, until it couldnt afford me any more.
> 6months warehouse op for another company (to make ends meet)
> 10months working for a quarry, as bagging operative and then operating heavy plant such as dumpers, conveyor systems, and loading HGVs
> since then, the last 9months as a Technical Clerk for the steel industry, which is predominantly office based, running KPI's and various reports as well as heavily monitoring contractors, especially resident daywork.
I know, a varied bag eh? The perks of living in Lincolnshire, where it's heavy industry everywhere and little in terms of white collar experience.
The problem I seem to be facing is that at near as damn it 24 I am too old, and too "world wise" for grad schemes (based on the feedback I'm getting) BUT through having little CV relevant experience, I am too inexperienced in "white collar" areas so to speak.
Unfortunately, due to circumstance I am yet again, facing the real possibillity of this temp job ending, and can't face being unemployed AGAIN.
Was just wondering if this is a common thing, or whether I am some form of freak of the system?
Courtesy of the experiences I have had, I am becoming less confident and less inclined to want office based monotony. Ideally I'd like some form of plant based role to gain experience, and then in later years apply the management element of the degree's to progress up the ladder so to speak.
Basically, am I expecting too much? is it time to accept that I'll still be agency'ing when 30?
Thanks, and apologies for this extended rant, it's been brewing for some months.
I am approaching 24, with some financial comitments although not many, with the following education:
GCSE's (all A-C's)
AS & A levels in Business, ICT, Electronics and an AS in Law (not great grade)
2:1 BSc degree in Management, Communications and Technology (IT and Business mixed)
MSc in International Marketing
So, you could say my CV is fairly academic. Now for the opposing issue, my work related CV is mostly heavy industry, retail and hospitallity, i.e. relatively unskilled and includes some of the following jobs:
> 2years as a waiter in a chain pub
> 2years as a warehouse op for B&Q (through uni)
> retail work for a year
> 4months as a Marketing Co-Ordinator on a grad scheme with a small company, until it couldnt afford me any more.
> 6months warehouse op for another company (to make ends meet)
> 10months working for a quarry, as bagging operative and then operating heavy plant such as dumpers, conveyor systems, and loading HGVs
> since then, the last 9months as a Technical Clerk for the steel industry, which is predominantly office based, running KPI's and various reports as well as heavily monitoring contractors, especially resident daywork.
I know, a varied bag eh? The perks of living in Lincolnshire, where it's heavy industry everywhere and little in terms of white collar experience.
The problem I seem to be facing is that at near as damn it 24 I am too old, and too "world wise" for grad schemes (based on the feedback I'm getting) BUT through having little CV relevant experience, I am too inexperienced in "white collar" areas so to speak.
Unfortunately, due to circumstance I am yet again, facing the real possibillity of this temp job ending, and can't face being unemployed AGAIN.
Was just wondering if this is a common thing, or whether I am some form of freak of the system?
Courtesy of the experiences I have had, I am becoming less confident and less inclined to want office based monotony. Ideally I'd like some form of plant based role to gain experience, and then in later years apply the management element of the degree's to progress up the ladder so to speak.
Basically, am I expecting too much? is it time to accept that I'll still be agency'ing when 30?
Thanks, and apologies for this extended rant, it's been brewing for some months.
bigandclever said:
How tied to this arrangement are you?
Not massively, previously worked in:Sheffield, Chesterfield, Manchester.
Wouldn't want to go any further south than Birmingham really, courtesy of having the OH working this way on and studying at Harrogate.
A yorkshire wise commute doesn't phase me though
okgo said:
Why have you left it so long?
Left what so long? I have been continuously applying for grad schemes, and mainstream employment. The agency jobs have been a way of keeping cash coming in, and avoiding being stuck at home unemployed...... last time nearly put me in depression. Cyder said:
I started a Grad Scheme at 24 (interviews and stuff at 23 but still).
No harm in applying is there?
Don't get me wrong, I'm still applying.... Usually to a good number. Just recently had a few responses insinuating that my work related experience is wrong for Grad Schemes as it means Im not "moldable" I guess. No harm in applying is there?
Kind of got me wondering if I should be approaching it from a new angle? I.e. take a night course in something more hands on, for a bit of wider appeal
mgmrw2003 said:
Don't get me wrong, I'm still applying.... Usually to a good number. Just recently had a few responses insinuating that my work related experience is wrong for Grad Schemes as it means Im not "moldable" I guess.
Omit some of it?Keep Marketing Coordinator. Title your time between uni and now with "Various Temp Roles".
Stevenj214 said:
Omit some of it?
Keep Marketing Coordinator. Title your time between uni and now with "Various Temp Roles".
Keep Marketing Coordinator. Title your time between uni and now with "Various Temp Roles".
Exactly what I was thinking (I'd also consider keeping another one or two roles in IF they're going to add other strings to your bow - i.e. customer focus etc which you're likely to want to expand upon greatly at interview)...In my (limited but still quite significant) experience of recruiting for grad schemes, we've normally been looking for people in their early to fairly late twenties, so I wouldn't see your age as even being an issue... I'd also much rather see some work experience than someone with non at all (I've known this to be a clear prerequisite in selecting grads for assessment centres sometimes)...
The only reason for omitting some of it in my view is that usually some stakeholders (often an HR person, possibly quite junior, put in charge of the grad scheme as a project with little experience of either academia or the real world) have a thing for seeing 'squeaky-clean' CVs for grad roles and hence get worried when they see wads of 'non-grad' experience - even when the chances are you've gained something from all of it!
Thanks very much for the advice. Makes sense when I think about it...... Suppose in truth I've just become dissolusioned with repeated rejections, or wasted time in dragging my arse across yorkshire for an interview to be met by some "junior from HR" (quite well put) who instantly makes me feel highly uncomfortable by being alarmed at the industry ground floor work that I've done.
Irony of the matter being that I've spent 9months temping within the steel industry, applied for various roles within the company I'm contracting for, but am seen as having no useful experience for the plant roles (i.e. mechanical or electrical engineering) and little in the way of grad scheme experience.
My final worry comes from being sceptical about jacking in a 20k temp job, that is vaguely secure, for a grad scheme that could result in me being redundant 3months later
Irony of the matter being that I've spent 9months temping within the steel industry, applied for various roles within the company I'm contracting for, but am seen as having no useful experience for the plant roles (i.e. mechanical or electrical engineering) and little in the way of grad scheme experience.
My final worry comes from being sceptical about jacking in a 20k temp job, that is vaguely secure, for a grad scheme that could result in me being redundant 3months later
Vron said:
Have you thought about sales - I mean professional where a degree is mandatory not selling double glazing etc? A business degree is usually looked upon very favourably.
How many areas of sales that 'require' a degree are anything more than box ticking excersises?And a business degree? From what I've heard and seem they're so general that they're almost useless in terms of actual knowledge.
okgo said:
How many areas of sales that 'require' a degree are anything more than box ticking excersises?
And a business degree? From what I've heard and seem they're so general that they're almost useless in terms of actual knowledge.
Sales - the marketing grad scheme was basically that, mixture of that and events organisation.And a business degree? From what I've heard and seem they're so general that they're almost useless in terms of actual knowledge.
Business degree - mine was a mixture of management, IT, and marketing. Each depends upon the modules taken and specific area of study surely? culminating in the study topic that the thesis you do is specific to?
The MSc was highly specific from beginning to end
Relevant while you're in that little bubble (education), then when you get a job you find out that you learn everything THEY want you to learn anyway, which by and large is not really anything like what you've already learned.
I think outside of a few professions they're almost all box ticking. Nobody walks from uni into a job and knows exactly what they're doing.
I think outside of a few professions they're almost all box ticking. Nobody walks from uni into a job and knows exactly what they're doing.
okgo said:
I think outside of a few professions they're almost all box ticking. Nobody walks from uni into a job and knows exactly what they're doing.
Couldn't agree more. I've learnt far more through being a quarry op, tech clerk, dumper driver and warehouse op than uni ever taught me. During my time in academia, I had no end of "debates" where tutors who were education 100% couldn't accept that things don't always go according to theory.My issue/question lies within the problem that I don't know the best way of applying my self I suspect. I.e. try another grad scheme, OR pursue entry level oportunities witin heavy industry and try and climb.
Several managers and colleagues have suggested that I re-train and do an apprenticeship (3-4years) as then I would have the practical knowledge AND management qualifications on paper, to allow me to progress up. Unfortunately, this would mean 4years of £100 a week bursary, AND retraining in an industry that is dying slowly
From my previous jobs, which in lots of cases are no means glam I've always been good at one thing, identifying transferable skills, and then selling myself on them like mad! Age is on your side!
I'm the same age and doing the above has seen me go from working in a computer shop (I don't have anything above GCSE's) to working for one of the largest and best known companies in the world, where needless to say most people are graduates.
So in essence, I reckon get your foot in the door in an area that maybe isn't your first choice (sales is good for this, as many grads are too stuck up to try it as they think they're above it) and then spend your time getting those transerable skills, and more importantly points to talk about in interviews, interviews are more important than nearly every other aspect (obviously getting one is why most people have a degree). If you can't interview then it doesn't matter where you've been or what you've got.
I'm the same age and doing the above has seen me go from working in a computer shop (I don't have anything above GCSE's) to working for one of the largest and best known companies in the world, where needless to say most people are graduates.
So in essence, I reckon get your foot in the door in an area that maybe isn't your first choice (sales is good for this, as many grads are too stuck up to try it as they think they're above it) and then spend your time getting those transerable skills, and more importantly points to talk about in interviews, interviews are more important than nearly every other aspect (obviously getting one is why most people have a degree). If you can't interview then it doesn't matter where you've been or what you've got.
okgo said:
If you can't interview then it doesn't matter where you've been or what you've got.
This is my current weak spot........Used to be good at it, BUT recently I've found myself becoming increasingly inept at portraying/conveying my thoughts/answers as I desire. i.e. in my head I know the answers, know the perfect way to phrase it, but then when mouth opens it all comes out as "FLUFF......... b
kS...........ARGH..........IM USELESS"With regards to sales, I found it was an area that I had little abillity within unless I was convinced by what I was selling....... Engineering, industry, and manufacturing are in my blood, in the sense that it excites me and motivates me. I suspect pursuing this area could be tricky, BUT pay-off well if I get it right
Further to all your advice, and a "major announcement" at work first thing this morning, basically saying that our temping days are numbered....... So all inspired and fuelled with dread I've managed to secure a couple of hours quiet time and done the following:
> trawled the intranet at current employer to find any relevant internal positions
> trawled the usual graduate websites to find any relevant positions
> overhauled my CV, omitting the pointless stuf and grammar checking
> found 2x jobs to apply for. So altered my CV to suit each, and the applied for both.
Now time to sit and wait until the end of May when the applications close.
> trawled the intranet at current employer to find any relevant internal positions
> trawled the usual graduate websites to find any relevant positions
> overhauled my CV, omitting the pointless stuf and grammar checking
> found 2x jobs to apply for. So altered my CV to suit each, and the applied for both.
Now time to sit and wait until the end of May when the applications close.
Gassing Station | Jobs & Employment Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff