Saab 9-3 Diesels - worth a look...?
Discussion
Basically Im going to be looking for a cheapish (<£5K) diesel over the next few months and have been looking at all the obvious VAG stuff (had a Bora previously and despite being pretty boring was pretty much indestructible and did 50 odd MPG), but was just wandering what the general opinion on Saab 9-3 TiD's is....?
Would probably be looking at a Leon Cupra (or FR) TDi out of the VAG stuff, how do you think the 9-3 would compare? Ive never driven one or known anyone with one so would be curious to hear off people who have...
The main things im after are something reliable, with decent MPG and that wont (completely) send me to sleep driving to work (20 odd miles of mainly motorway and A-roads).
Also if theres anything else I should be taking a look at, throw it in for good measure...!
Cheers all!
Would probably be looking at a Leon Cupra (or FR) TDi out of the VAG stuff, how do you think the 9-3 would compare? Ive never driven one or known anyone with one so would be curious to hear off people who have...
The main things im after are something reliable, with decent MPG and that wont (completely) send me to sleep driving to work (20 odd miles of mainly motorway and A-roads).
Also if theres anything else I should be taking a look at, throw it in for good measure...!
Cheers all!
Most of the common problems they have are the same as any GM or FIAT car using the same 1.9 TDI engine. Mainly EGR issues, early water pump/cambelt failures and cluch/DMF issues.
They're OK cars, not great, but OK and very cheap at the moment with the question marks hanging over Saab.
They're OK cars, not great, but OK and very cheap at the moment with the question marks hanging over Saab.
Ok, but get a higher spec'd, cheaper and exactly the same vectra.
Early ones had problems with the cat regeneration too. I always found them to torque steer a bit, but i drove an Aero and that was damn rapid.
Quite comfy, quite good looking, but not the most reliable (despite me looking only this week a 93 sportwagons
)
Early ones had problems with the cat regeneration too. I always found them to torque steer a bit, but i drove an Aero and that was damn rapid.
Quite comfy, quite good looking, but not the most reliable (despite me looking only this week a 93 sportwagons
)My BIL recently bought one, a 120bhp version, I think. For the money, they're decent value. I used to have a 9-5 with the 2.2 turbo diesel, but I've driven a 9-5 with the 1.9 and it was much better in every respect.
The following is my opinion: more stylish than a Passat or a Vectra, more upmarket than an Octavia (which I have, so don't jump on me!) and much cheaper than the equivalent Merc/Audi/BMW.
As a final thought, I know that nice ones at £5k are difficult to find, but have you considered an Accord or Mazda 6?
The following is my opinion: more stylish than a Passat or a Vectra, more upmarket than an Octavia (which I have, so don't jump on me!) and much cheaper than the equivalent Merc/Audi/BMW.
As a final thought, I know that nice ones at £5k are difficult to find, but have you considered an Accord or Mazda 6?
I've got an 05 plate one that I accidently bought a year ago. The trip computer is currently showing 54mpg. It's an ok place, the seat is comfy for the longest of journeys but make sure you get a new cambelt on it. Was bloody cold stood on the M4 when it snapped, however a Saab dealer only charged £800 to put it back together.
Handling is akin to riding a pregnant cow, not that I've done much pregnat cow riding, that's just a figure of speech, but it's not sharp, or precise, it's jsut a comfy place to sit in an armchair whilst reading a map as you travel to where you need to be.
Handling is akin to riding a pregnant cow, not that I've done much pregnat cow riding, that's just a figure of speech, but it's not sharp, or precise, it's jsut a comfy place to sit in an armchair whilst reading a map as you travel to where you need to be.
Well, I like mine. 150BHP Sportwagon. Agree to an extent about the ride, but I can tell you it will hustle if you want. There aint much that gets the better of me on my trip to & from LHR. My style of driving gets me about 46-48 MPG but getting to LHR from the other side of Oxford in 50 mins - I'm not complaining. And that is in the start of the rush hour; the home trip at night is only 45 mins.
It has so far been reliable; no EGR or other issues except for a bit of warranty wirk within a week of buying (inst panel replaced) and near the end of the warranty one front wheel bearing and front springs. 18k interval services (last one by me) current miles 75k. Always use Shell fuel, sometimes V-power (the last little lot I put in, a tank full, did us proud performance-wise towing the caravan)
I am resigned to probably having to eventually clean out the EGR but no sign of it yet (mostly m-way miles) - we'll see.
What put me off the Audi A4 was the prices of cars with comparable miles to mine - most of the Audis with around 50k miles on were at the time about 2 grand more than I paid for the Saab, and no heavier duty cooling fan needed on the Saab for towing, also a good deal with the dealer-fitted towbar including the upgrade of the software for towing. Was advised about £100 just to have that done for an A4.
I still like the look of the Audis, and agreed the Saab dash is a bit bland but it works. I am now just about used to all the buttons (the later ones have just the normal three circular controls for climate)
I would love a TTid for the towing for grunt under 2k RPM.
It has so far been reliable; no EGR or other issues except for a bit of warranty wirk within a week of buying (inst panel replaced) and near the end of the warranty one front wheel bearing and front springs. 18k interval services (last one by me) current miles 75k. Always use Shell fuel, sometimes V-power (the last little lot I put in, a tank full, did us proud performance-wise towing the caravan)
I am resigned to probably having to eventually clean out the EGR but no sign of it yet (mostly m-way miles) - we'll see.
What put me off the Audi A4 was the prices of cars with comparable miles to mine - most of the Audis with around 50k miles on were at the time about 2 grand more than I paid for the Saab, and no heavier duty cooling fan needed on the Saab for towing, also a good deal with the dealer-fitted towbar including the upgrade of the software for towing. Was advised about £100 just to have that done for an A4.
I still like the look of the Audis, and agreed the Saab dash is a bit bland but it works. I am now just about used to all the buttons (the later ones have just the normal three circular controls for climate)
I would love a TTid for the towing for grunt under 2k RPM.
If you're going for a 9-3, try and get the 2007 model year onward - has a much better dash.
It's easy to spot - has 3 controls for the climate control, not the bazillion buttons on the older version. It also has a shiny trim around the edge of the dash. Sound system isn't bad, but at least it can be upgraded - the pre 2007 version is a weird fibre-optic setup which is a bugger to change.
It's easy to spot - has 3 controls for the climate control, not the bazillion buttons on the older version. It also has a shiny trim around the edge of the dash. Sound system isn't bad, but at least it can be upgraded - the pre 2007 version is a weird fibre-optic setup which is a bugger to change.
cptsideways said:
Bit of a sore subject for Saab fans, google "Saab bulkhead failure" MOT'ers are now on the lookout for it too & LOTS are failing on it. its a fatigue related issue (major design fault) so they will all do it sooner or later.
As hora said - this is for the first generation 9-3 (up to 2002 ish), and even if you did get one, you can employ preventative maintenance by putting in one of these. £5k gets you well into the 9-3 "Sports Saloon" shape.Can't speak for the 9-3 diesel as I've not driven one (though that doesn't stop some commenting anyway). I've got a 9-5 1.9 TiD and I'm more than happy with the performance and economy for such a big car (auto estate). The engine is a bit agricultural, but I have had up to 53.1 mpg on my journey back from work (73 miles).
When I was looking for mine, I did consider BMW and Audi, but I was looking at cars that were 2 - 3 years older for the same cash. At the time of looking, there was a 56 plate 520d Estate, though that was almost £5k more for a car that was 18 months older, and had done more than double the miles.
What I'm trying to say is these cars are very good value. They are not as terrible to drive as some would suggest. Best bet would be to drive a few yourself and see what you think. I have heard that the audio is poor in the lower spec models, so if that matters, go for one of the higher spec cars (Vector?)
Octavia diesels are very good, though wouldn't be surprised if they are more expensive to buy now than a similar aged 9-3ss.
Edited by kprm77 on Wednesday 4th May 09:28
Presuming Ed said:
Probably better off looking at a VW Passat 2.0 Sport fo rthe same money. The dash of the saab always looks rather horrid and apparently there not much to drive.
I've got a 9-3 vector sport tid 150.... and yeah the dash is a bit "grey". BUT......the interior is so well built and comfy beyond belief, even at 6ft7 and 15st of me, I have leg room for a 600mile round trip in a day, with a boot full of car parts for the project weapon.
Driving experience: steering is a bit vague/over-lightened as its hydro electric. BUT if you can find one in budget with the sports pack (springs etc) then they drive nice.
I live in Lincolnshire, and am surrounded by A and B roads, begging for a hoon and whilst the 9-3 may feel a bit tubby off the line, once above 30 and out on the road it's a hoot for the size of the car. Not as sharp as a beemer, but for the same money the beemers are tired.
The brakes on the saab are good at speed, a little "dull" round town, and the gearbox (6speeder) works well.
If you're after big fuel figures, be gentle. Mine will do between 45 and 50 on a run BUT you're on cruise control at 70.
That said, when pressing on at a lepton it will still return 42mpg. Only time it suffers is round town, down to between 37 and 42 depending on your concrete soles. (mine are heavy, and the OH has digital feet..... throttle on, throttle off, thats it)
Pound for pound, I struggled to find anything else that could match the drive, luxury levels, and kit.... barring a volvo (no diesel C70s in that price budget)
As for the poossat...... drove two on test, compared to the saab they feel huge, heavy, slow and basically so dull I wondered how long until the boredom would kill me.
Also, for the same money as a 56k miles vector sport 9-3 (150) I could find a pov spec SE poossat with 110k on clock and "REP WAGON" stamped across it so big you could see it from space. hateful things
Yep its the good old GM engine which I love in my 2005 Vectra 1.9CDTi 150.
6 Speed gearbox, and a DTUK plug and play tuning box taking it to a very believable 197BHP (and actually feels like it).
She averages an indicated 54.8mpg too with a tank of fuel (about 75 quid) stretching to 540 miles when brimmed. Not bad at todays prices especially considering the performance. (real-world MPG average is 45.82, covering 540 miles using 11.78 gallons of fuel) but this is driving in rush hour over a 110 mile round trip each day with a good mixture of speeds and is without even trying to be economical.
I have had lots of commuting cars and this is BY FAR the best;
Many Pug 2.0 HDI's, Citroen 2.0 HDI's, VW Passat 1.9tdi's, Laguna 1.9 DCi (nasty).
I also run a BMW 530D Sport which we've had from new and in another life I also owned Porsches (911 RSL Rep, Boxster), Scoobies and plenty-a-tweaked turbo - so have a good background to compare against.
In terms of my commuting vehicle this is the best of the bunch by a LONG way. It is fast (not just "quick for a diesel"...I mean actually quite fast and continues to pull way, way over any speed you will realistically want to drive at - and amusingly embarrases a LOT of other cars competing in the morning Diesel Derby! Great torque thorughout the gears and rev range - brilliant engine.
I havent had a SAAB but the engines are the same I believe. Things to watch for as already mentioned are EGR issues (but Fiat have designed a revised EGR Gasket which cures this I believe, and there are plentiful DIY guides to strip and clean the EGR valve and replace the gaskets which would take anybody around 1 hour if ever needed). Dual Mass Flywheels can rattle a bit so check for this. Depress the clutch and slowly release it - it can be rather like a thrust bearing rattle. I think they can have a problem with the ?3rd? injector but Ive been ok so cant go any further on this. I had a cambelt done as soon as I bought mine. The Vectras also suffer from Thermostats - easy and cheap fix but the symptoms cause the temp guage to sit well below what it should, indicating that its not heating up to running temp (need to get mine done at some point) but Ive been quoted less £100 fitted.
Do take a look at the Vectra 1.9CDTi - You should get a nice facelifted SRi for your budget wich will come with all the toys, nice alloys as standard and decent suspension. (Mine's an SXi which is practically the same, minus electric rear windows and trip computer - but I've fitted the latter as all the wiring is already in there so its just plug in and go!).
If you go with Saab, I reckon you will love the performance of the engine - but do look to go DTUK (or similar i.e Bluefin etc) in order to release it to it's full potential. When I first got in my Vectra it felt spritely at 150BHP but the DTUK box totally transformed the vehicle and without it, it feels heavy.
The Vectra gets cheap tax too - so maybe the case for the Saab.
G.
6 Speed gearbox, and a DTUK plug and play tuning box taking it to a very believable 197BHP (and actually feels like it).
She averages an indicated 54.8mpg too with a tank of fuel (about 75 quid) stretching to 540 miles when brimmed. Not bad at todays prices especially considering the performance. (real-world MPG average is 45.82, covering 540 miles using 11.78 gallons of fuel) but this is driving in rush hour over a 110 mile round trip each day with a good mixture of speeds and is without even trying to be economical.
I have had lots of commuting cars and this is BY FAR the best;
Many Pug 2.0 HDI's, Citroen 2.0 HDI's, VW Passat 1.9tdi's, Laguna 1.9 DCi (nasty).
I also run a BMW 530D Sport which we've had from new and in another life I also owned Porsches (911 RSL Rep, Boxster), Scoobies and plenty-a-tweaked turbo - so have a good background to compare against.
In terms of my commuting vehicle this is the best of the bunch by a LONG way. It is fast (not just "quick for a diesel"...I mean actually quite fast and continues to pull way, way over any speed you will realistically want to drive at - and amusingly embarrases a LOT of other cars competing in the morning Diesel Derby! Great torque thorughout the gears and rev range - brilliant engine.
I havent had a SAAB but the engines are the same I believe. Things to watch for as already mentioned are EGR issues (but Fiat have designed a revised EGR Gasket which cures this I believe, and there are plentiful DIY guides to strip and clean the EGR valve and replace the gaskets which would take anybody around 1 hour if ever needed). Dual Mass Flywheels can rattle a bit so check for this. Depress the clutch and slowly release it - it can be rather like a thrust bearing rattle. I think they can have a problem with the ?3rd? injector but Ive been ok so cant go any further on this. I had a cambelt done as soon as I bought mine. The Vectras also suffer from Thermostats - easy and cheap fix but the symptoms cause the temp guage to sit well below what it should, indicating that its not heating up to running temp (need to get mine done at some point) but Ive been quoted less £100 fitted.
Do take a look at the Vectra 1.9CDTi - You should get a nice facelifted SRi for your budget wich will come with all the toys, nice alloys as standard and decent suspension. (Mine's an SXi which is practically the same, minus electric rear windows and trip computer - but I've fitted the latter as all the wiring is already in there so its just plug in and go!).
If you go with Saab, I reckon you will love the performance of the engine - but do look to go DTUK (or similar i.e Bluefin etc) in order to release it to it's full potential. When I first got in my Vectra it felt spritely at 150BHP but the DTUK box totally transformed the vehicle and without it, it feels heavy.
The Vectra gets cheap tax too - so maybe the case for the Saab.
G.
Edited by Gallen on Wednesday 4th May 09:49
The older 9-3 used the Vauxhall 2.2 diesel unit which is a rattly and can get through a surprising amount of oil. Additionally, I believe that there have been problems with the fuel pumps (certainly on Vectra's where this engine is fitted) which can be very expensive to fix as there is an ECU as part of the pump.
The later FIAT/Vauxhall 1.9 diesel is a very good diesel though I am not sure about Saabs of this period as the build quality seems to be poorer than previously.
The later FIAT/Vauxhall 1.9 diesel is a very good diesel though I am not sure about Saabs of this period as the build quality seems to be poorer than previously.
mgmrw2003 said:
DTUK box fit the 150 9-3 on a 2006? If so, I've just found my birthday present..... Been looking at chip options for a while, but want a reccommended one.
(apologies for Fred Drift turning up)
http://www.diesel-performance.co.uk/saab-diesel-tu...(apologies for Fred Drift turning up)
You'll be looking at 150ps to 206ps and torque going from 320nm to 430nm
I'm running the "anarchy map" (the boxes are configurable) with a quoted 197 BHP.
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