Timing belt failure at 62,000 miles HELP !
Discussion
I have an alfa 156 and this weekend the timing belt snapped whilst driving. Awaiting the diagnosis from the garage but fear the worst.
My issue is that the belt has failed 2000 miles outside of the 3 year Warrenty. The service book states replace timing belt at 72,000 miles. Mine has failed some 10,000 miles short of this. Do I have any chance of getting Alfa to pay for some of this ?
This is the culmination of a series of horrific problems over my 3 years of ownership (since new). Last week (90 miles b4 the belt snapped) I picked up the 156 from the garage after it had the clutch replaced, that failed 2 weeks ago, and 3rd gear rebuilt as it was popping out.
Could ramble for hours with the issues I have had over a miserable 3 years of ownership but here is a short list.
1, Fuse box fell open,repaired twice given up now
2, drivers seat cover replaced when fraid
3, Horn failed, 6 month wait for parts
4, Knocking on susupension, something alfa replaced once but would not do again
5, Windscreen wiper motor failed, Alfa said we will order parts, warrenty expired by time they said they had no record of parts being orderd, charged me 180 quid for the new one
6, Lamda (Spelling) probe failed, garage fixed, failed again 10 mins out of garage on a busy roundabout
7, 3rd gear, popping out of twice
8, Noisy at start up
9, clutch failed at 60,000 miles
10, final straw was timing belt snapping this weekend.
11, constant noises from loose bits inside
12, One of mounting brackets for exhuast (welded on one) has fallen off.
13, Terrible service, often parts spotted at service that needed repairing have never arrived or taken up to six months, see points 2,3,5
Did I get a bad one !
My issue is that the belt has failed 2000 miles outside of the 3 year Warrenty. The service book states replace timing belt at 72,000 miles. Mine has failed some 10,000 miles short of this. Do I have any chance of getting Alfa to pay for some of this ?
This is the culmination of a series of horrific problems over my 3 years of ownership (since new). Last week (90 miles b4 the belt snapped) I picked up the 156 from the garage after it had the clutch replaced, that failed 2 weeks ago, and 3rd gear rebuilt as it was popping out.
Could ramble for hours with the issues I have had over a miserable 3 years of ownership but here is a short list.
1, Fuse box fell open,repaired twice given up now
2, drivers seat cover replaced when fraid
3, Horn failed, 6 month wait for parts
4, Knocking on susupension, something alfa replaced once but would not do again
5, Windscreen wiper motor failed, Alfa said we will order parts, warrenty expired by time they said they had no record of parts being orderd, charged me 180 quid for the new one
6, Lamda (Spelling) probe failed, garage fixed, failed again 10 mins out of garage on a busy roundabout
7, 3rd gear, popping out of twice
8, Noisy at start up
9, clutch failed at 60,000 miles
10, final straw was timing belt snapping this weekend.
11, constant noises from loose bits inside
12, One of mounting brackets for exhuast (welded on one) has fallen off.
13, Terrible service, often parts spotted at service that needed repairing have never arrived or taken up to six months, see points 2,3,5
Did I get a bad one !
You did get a bad one - car and dealer by the sound of it. SGT replaced my timing belt at 36,000 under warranty and recommended that it be replaced every 36,000 thereafter. Your dealer should have seen this coming in my opinion.
Should also have seen the suspension problem. The suspension bushes are prone to wear and should be carefully checked at service. If they are left unchecked they cause wear in the aluminium components.
The rest of the problems you have had are pretty awful - although I too had a clutch suddenly let go at 50,000 and had to replace it at my expense. They aren't all this bad and whilst your experience in unacceptable I would like to say that in general Alfa have got their act together and that yours is the exception to the rule.
>> Edited by Mon Ami Mate on Monday 17th May 18:46
Should also have seen the suspension problem. The suspension bushes are prone to wear and should be carefully checked at service. If they are left unchecked they cause wear in the aluminium components.
The rest of the problems you have had are pretty awful - although I too had a clutch suddenly let go at 50,000 and had to replace it at my expense. They aren't all this bad and whilst your experience in unacceptable I would like to say that in general Alfa have got their act together and that yours is the exception to the rule.
>> Edited by Mon Ami Mate on Monday 17th May 18:46
many thanks for your reply. That was the problem, bushes on the suspension.
Shame I have so much bad luck with this one, I love the looks, the performance, the turned heads.
O well see what the dealer says about the timing belt damage tomorrow. Intresting to hear about your 36,000 mile change.
Shame I have so much bad luck with this one, I love the looks, the performance, the turned heads.
O well see what the dealer says about the timing belt damage tomorrow. Intresting to hear about your 36,000 mile change.
Sorry you've had such a bad time of your 156. Yes, your car has suffered a number of common failures but your dealer really should have fixed those first time round. Possible noises in the suspension may well be the rearmost bushes in the rear suspension trailing arms- they really aren't up to the job- I suggest Powerflex replacements- I'm sure they are now available.
The timing belt should never have failed however. Alfa dealers have been aware of revised intervals for the belt for at least two years as far as I am aware- SO IT SEEMS YOUR DEALER HAS BEEN NEGLIGENT! If you persue this through Alfa Romeo Customer Services, I hope that they will endevour to help.
You should list all the points that you are unhappy about both with the car and the service you recieved and keep a record. If you are still not satisfied with the outcome, you could report the dealers shortcommings to the SMMT or the RMI- I'm can't remember which governing body the may be a member of.
Keep us posted and if you need further help- I may be able to find out some other ways to apply some pressure.
>> Edited by Alfa Mad on Monday 17th May 21:58
The timing belt should never have failed however. Alfa dealers have been aware of revised intervals for the belt for at least two years as far as I am aware- SO IT SEEMS YOUR DEALER HAS BEEN NEGLIGENT! If you persue this through Alfa Romeo Customer Services, I hope that they will endevour to help.
You should list all the points that you are unhappy about both with the car and the service you recieved and keep a record. If you are still not satisfied with the outcome, you could report the dealers shortcommings to the SMMT or the RMI- I'm can't remember which governing body the may be a member of.
Keep us posted and if you need further help- I may be able to find out some other ways to apply some pressure.
>> Edited by Alfa Mad on Monday 17th May 21:58
First of all, the belts failing before 72000 is a common problem. A colleague looking for a GTV (2.0) was told that it was better to change them early around 50000 miles.
However, if you have a FSH from an Alfa dealer and the schedule says 72000, then you should be able to get something out of Alfa. You probably wont get it for free, but they may waive labour or certain parts. Talk to the service manager first to see if he is on your side.
If Alfa refuse to help, consider taking the car to a specialist, they will do a better job and it will cost you a lot less. Make sure work doesn't start until the financial side is sorted out.
However, if you have a FSH from an Alfa dealer and the schedule says 72000, then you should be able to get something out of Alfa. You probably wont get it for free, but they may waive labour or certain parts. Talk to the service manager first to see if he is on your side.
If Alfa refuse to help, consider taking the car to a specialist, they will do a better job and it will cost you a lot less. Make sure work doesn't start until the financial side is sorted out.
Checked at 36k...and replaced at 72k....
So to check a belt properly, it needs to be removed completely to inspect both sides of the belt for cracks, missing chunks of teeth, etc. If the belt is removed, why the hell isn't a new one fitted for the sake of £30?!!!! Or... do Alfa do a full visual inspection of the belt, with it still on the car?! Hardly a lengthy check if that is the case!
Also get the tensioners changed as the bearings/teeth in those can disintegrate as well.
Me, I never let a belt go over 36k/3yrs.... not much has changed since the older fiat days!
So to check a belt properly, it needs to be removed completely to inspect both sides of the belt for cracks, missing chunks of teeth, etc. If the belt is removed, why the hell isn't a new one fitted for the sake of £30?!!!! Or... do Alfa do a full visual inspection of the belt, with it still on the car?! Hardly a lengthy check if that is the case!
Also get the tensioners changed as the bearings/teeth in those can disintegrate as well.
Me, I never let a belt go over 36k/3yrs.... not much has changed since the older fiat days!
ocks. 
I wonder if you recieved a report on the condition of the old belt @36000 miles? Yes, it is classic get out, but you should still be able to get more from them. Did they consult you as to the condition of the belt. Remember, it is usually a belt guide, or tensioner which fails, which it turn, results in belt failure. Was this reported to you? In fairness though, a tensioner can disentegrate within a few miles of a visual fault occuring. EVERY Alfa owner in the know will change belts @36000 miles or 48000 at ABSOLUTE most- wonder why you weren't told this?
Don't blame the car though, Ford, Vauxhaull etc are in exactly the same situation. Try to keep your dealer on you side and to some degree sympathetic to your cause, it will only help your negotiations. Threatening is a last resort. Remember that Alfa's revisions have shifted the responsibility from Alfa themselves to their dealers. Good luck.
Don't blame the car though, Ford, Vauxhaull etc are in exactly the same situation. Try to keep your dealer on you side and to some degree sympathetic to your cause, it will only help your negotiations. Threatening is a last resort. Remember that Alfa's revisions have shifted the responsibility from Alfa themselves to their dealers. Good luck.
My mates Punto HGT belt failed @ 50k, he was a bit annoyed as it was out of warrenty and as said in service schedule should be done @ 72k 
To do the job he was advised it was impossible to do DIY but after a bit of research and 8 exhaust valves later (only exhaust?
) we managed to rebuild it and get it running for less than £300 
Bring back the chains!
To do the job he was advised it was impossible to do DIY but after a bit of research and 8 exhaust valves later (only exhaust?
) we managed to rebuild it and get it running for less than £300 Bring back the chains!
the TS engines in Italy are chain driven...
a mate has a gtv 2.0 ts in Italy, he showed me some pics, it's defo twin chain. I showed him some pics of belts, and he just laughed... as their 72k service includes a retension of the chains, then thats it. He said we must have fun with lots of belt failures..he's spot on!
Twin chains, even though on idle they sound a bit lumpy, not too dis-similar from the noise of a socket set having a gang bang in a filing cabinet, they are damn reliable! Only downside is if they go slack, they eat the block big time, and if one snaps, it can go a bit overkill!
a mate has a gtv 2.0 ts in Italy, he showed me some pics, it's defo twin chain. I showed him some pics of belts, and he just laughed... as their 72k service includes a retension of the chains, then thats it. He said we must have fun with lots of belt failures..he's spot on!
Twin chains, even though on idle they sound a bit lumpy, not too dis-similar from the noise of a socket set having a gang bang in a filing cabinet, they are damn reliable! Only downside is if they go slack, they eat the block big time, and if one snaps, it can go a bit overkill!
alfa145uk said:
the TS engines in Italy are chain driven...
Surely not AJ?
I mean they wouldn't build different engines just for the home market?
The old all alloy 8 valve Twin Cam was on chains but all the 16v were on belts I thought?
There was a 2.0 V6 Turbo tax break special in the Italian GTV - is that what your mate has got?
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