Thursday 7th September 2006

Mazda shows off hydrogen car

World first outside Japan for RX-8 RE

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Mazda RX-8

Think hydrogen power for cars and many think of fuel cells. But, like most car makers, who see the future through the lens of their existing technologies and distribution mechanisms, not Mazda.

The Japanese car maker used the opening in August of Norway's first hydrogen filling station near Stavanger as the occasion to show off its RX-8 Hydrogen RE for the first time outside Japan.

Leasing of this model -- a dual-fuel, hydrogen and petrol rotary-engine vehicle -- began earlier this year in Japan, a world first for a passenger car with a hydrogen internal combustion engine. This is the latest step in 15 years of Mazda research into hydrogen vehicles.

Car makers currently are tackling the problems of emissions on two major fronts -- hybrids, which have been available since the turn of the century, and more recently developing engines that can run on hydrogen, which is completely clean.

Few see batteries or electricity as a future direction. Instead, according to Mazda, most engineers believe that these are not stop-gap measures being used until fuel cell engines become affordable but genuine alternative technologies that make cars cleaner and more economical.

“A hydrogen rotary engine only emits water. It is not as efficient as a fuel cell, but structurally it is closer to the petrol engine, hence its manufacturing cost is lower and it has fewer durability issues,” said Mazda’s hydrogen programme manager Akihiro Kashiwagi.

“Compared to fuel cells, hydrogen engines with dual-fuel system are more likely to play a significant role in the initial phase of the hydrogen energy society in the future. That is why Mazda is currently focused on developing dual-fuel system hydrogen engine.”

For Mazda, with its heritage of rotary engines, this has presented a particular challenge, and one it has met with a number of solutions using both hydrogen and hybrid power.

These ideas came together in the Senku concept, first shown at the 2005 Tokyo Motor Show.

Company boss Hisakazu Imakisaid: “Mazda’s creativity and spirit of innovation” helps the company produce these solutions.

The four-seater Senku, he said, is a rotary sports car that “strives to be both eco-friendly and very safe, and makes us ponder the transformation of what we consider to be of value, of thinking about the world we live in...and yet is still compatible with some distinctive Mazda Zoom-Zoom fun.”

There are real world applications: Mazda first used hydrogen power in 1991 and tested a fuel cell in 1992.

This year, Mazda began leasing the RX-8 Hydrogen RE to its first two corporate customers -- both energy-related companies. These vehicles, equipped with a rotary engine, feature a dual-fuel system that allows the driver to select either hydrogen or petrol with the flick of a switch.

By the end of 2006, Mazda plans to lease about 10 RX-8 Hydrogen RE cars to local government and energy companies in Japan.

It took Mazda 29 months from the time it announced the hydrogen concept model at the 2003 Tokyo show to achieve the breakthrough, real-world rotary hydrogen vehicle.

Employing a dual-fuel system, the Mazda RX-8 Hydrogen RE can run on either high-pressure hydrogen gas or gasoline. This means it can be driven in remote areas where hydrogen fuelling stations are not readily available, easing driver concerns about running out of fuel. In addition, this system boasts environmental friendliness at the point of use -- zero emission of carbon dioxide (CO2) gas and near zero nitrogen oxide (NOx) emission when fuelled by hydrogen -- together with the same feel as an internal combustion engine. It uses engine parts and production facilities that already exist in Mazda’s inventory, which gives reliability and reduced manufacturing costs.

While the £2,000 monthly lease is high, it is about half the monthly lease price of a fuel cell vehicle already available in Japan. So think yourself lucky...

[annodomini2]

Yes it doesn't emit CO2 etc out of the exhaust, but it requires 10x as much energy to make the Hydrogen in the first place, where does that energy come from?

Hopeless exercise when it comes to 'Global warming', as all the emissions get shifted to the power station.

In addition, there 'research' also generally states that water vapor in the atmosphere also has a bad impact in 'Global warming', therefore enhancing the effect.

[annodomini2]

benyeats said:

annodomini2 said:

Yes it doesn't emit CO2 etc out of the exhaust, but it requires 10x as much energy to make the Hydrogen in the first place, where does that energy come from?

Hopeless exercise when it comes to 'Global warming', as all the emissions get shifted to the power station.

In addition, there 'research' also generally states that water vapor in the atmosphere also has a bad impact in 'Global warming', therefore enhancing the effect.

But a power station can be more efficient than a car so you get the same energy for less fuel. So yes you do get higher emissions at the power station but less emissions per unit of energy overall.

Ben

*above is pure speculation about power stations but if it is not the case someone in the design department of power stations needs to be shot !

True power stations are more efficient, where a car engine is 25-30% energy efficient a power station may be upto 50%.

But putting in 10x as much energy to begin with means the power station needs to be 300-400% efficient to match the energy efficiency of the car as it is!!! Impossible as it breaks the laws of thermodynamics.

Solar is a waste of time, you only get 15w per square metre if you had a 100% efficient solar cel! It is also unpredictable and unreliable. Given 60hp is ~45kw you'd need 3000 sqm of solar panels to power 1 car at 100% efficiency, given most are 20-30% efficient not likely is it? And you wouldn't have much of a car!

Wind power can produce the energy required although takes up a lot more space and is also unreliable.

Nuclear Fusion would solve these problems, but is still a good 50years away at least for a commercially viable power station and you're still using 10x as much energy!

Fuel Cells are also inefficient, expensive and dangerous! They have been known to explode!

Renewable fuel sources where the crops grown absorb some of the CO2 appear to me to be the most viable solution in the short term.

Better batteries and newer designs of ultra high energy capacitors should be the medium term goal, as they are a lot more efficient to begin with.

My two penneth...

[annodomini2]

GreenV8S said:

Solar power represents roughly 1KW per square meter, where did the 15W come from?

Wind power is a waste of time, since the wind is unreliable you always have to have other power sources available at the drop of a hat, which means you incur all the capital and operating costs for no benefit. Meanwhile even when they *are* working the wind farms are a far more expensive way to produce power than the alternatives. I see them as a sop for the guilty conscience that feels we should be doing something to protect the environment, even if what we do doesn't actually provide any benefit.

Sorry I checked and stand corrected

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_po