Star Wars: The Last Jedi (CONTAINS SPOILERS)
Discussion
Guvernator said:
So what do we think about the critic reviews being so positive? I don’t really put much store in conspiracy theories but I can’t think of another explanation for the almost universally glowing reviews for what is an average film at best. Can Disney really have this much sway or are we reading too much into it?
Seems it TBH. The film is a complete flop. The second part in a trilogy is usually the big one. It does seem that they did the same thing that of which happened to The Matrix i.e the first one was brilliant but they then overcooked the second one by trying to get it to fit a bigger audience.Guvernator said:
So what do we think about the critic reviews being so positive? I don’t really put much store in conspiracy theories but I can’t think of another explanation for the almost universally glowing reviews for what is an average film at best. Can Disney really have this much sway or are we reading too much into it?
Keep in mind it's got 8/10 from 100,000 reviews on IMDB.https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_las...
Massive difference between critics and audience which can only be explained by disingenuous reviews by critics. Audience opinion is really average.
BTW, the audience score is based on nearly 100,000 reviews, so thats a massive poll.
Massive difference between critics and audience which can only be explained by disingenuous reviews by critics. Audience opinion is really average.
BTW, the audience score is based on nearly 100,000 reviews, so thats a massive poll.
zb said:
The blame for this nonsense lies squarely with Johnson, and they've given this chump another 3.
In the case of Star Wars I'd be stunned if the director has final say on anything, they're films by committee and I would guess that Kennedy is basically signing off everything.You only have to look at how they've hired and fired directors so far, I would guess Johnson is a safe pair of hands willing to sacrifice his vision for that of his bosses, little to no noise out of TLJ production and he's now overseeing the next 3, no coincidence there.
ukaskew said:
In the case of Star Wars I'd be stunned if the director has final say on anything, they're films by committee and I would guess that Kennedy is basically signing off everything.
You only have to look at how they've hired and fired directors so far, I would guess Johnson is a safe pair of hands willing to sacrifice his vision for that of his bosses, little to no noise out of TLJ production and he's now overseeing the next 3, no coincidence there.
In that case The Force Awakens and Rogue One would've had the same stench as The Last Jedi, they didn't.You only have to look at how they've hired and fired directors so far, I would guess Johnson is a safe pair of hands willing to sacrifice his vision for that of his bosses, little to no noise out of TLJ production and he's now overseeing the next 3, no coincidence there.
My review.... it dallied with being 'dire'.
The overall plot line with the fuel was laughable. The long drawn out chase where the bad guys couldn't find a way to catch the cruiser was total arse.
Slow moving Heavy bombers in space? Dropping bombs out a bomb bay? In zero gravity? Wtf. Against a massive fleet that can't defend itself adequately?
I got bored at around the two hour mark.
I simply can't understand why it's got such good reviews.
The overall plot line with the fuel was laughable. The long drawn out chase where the bad guys couldn't find a way to catch the cruiser was total arse.
Slow moving Heavy bombers in space? Dropping bombs out a bomb bay? In zero gravity? Wtf. Against a massive fleet that can't defend itself adequately?
I got bored at around the two hour mark.
I simply can't understand why it's got such good reviews.
Chemical Ali said:
https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_the_las...
Massive difference between critics and audience which can only be explained by disingenuous reviews by critics. Audience opinion is really average.
BTW, the audience score is based on nearly 100,000 reviews, so thats a massive poll.
It seems to almost the same scenario as the 2016 version of Ghostbusters - critics being disingenuous and ordinary reviewers (people who actually paid to see the movie) being honest.Massive difference between critics and audience which can only be explained by disingenuous reviews by critics. Audience opinion is really average.
BTW, the audience score is based on nearly 100,000 reviews, so thats a massive poll.
I wonder if the film makers will stoop to insulting the audience who didn't like it so much as they did with Ghostbusters (I haven't seen that one, so can't comment on how good or bad it is..)
I’m just back from seeing it and while I enjoyed it there was just too many questions left about the plot.
One I can’t see in this thread that really got me was when they went into the old rebel mine and closed the giant door. They then were trying to find a way out, R2D2’s schematics showed no other way out. Next thing you know there’s people, guns and ships popping out from openings in the door, the roof and the sides. 10 mins later they’re all back in it again having the same problem if not being able to find another way out. WTF?!
One I can’t see in this thread that really got me was when they went into the old rebel mine and closed the giant door. They then were trying to find a way out, R2D2’s schematics showed no other way out. Next thing you know there’s people, guns and ships popping out from openings in the door, the roof and the sides. 10 mins later they’re all back in it again having the same problem if not being able to find another way out. WTF?!
Went to see this earlier today and I'm in two minds about it.
I enjoyed the parts with Luke and the whole Jedi element of the movie. I also kind of liked the turn against Snoke although I did want to find out more about him, he only gave a slight hint at his force/dark side abilities which would have been good to have seen explored.
I liked how Poe Dameron was used more and shown to be a bit more of a rogue, similar to Han Solo.
Finn seemed a little redundant in this movie, the whole jaunt off to the gambling planet I found a bit boring although the children they showed at the end obviously hints towards future force users.
Thing is this movie left me feeling the same as when I watched The Empire Strikes Back. Which will sound odd but I recall watching that and feeling as though it was a bridge from Episode IV to VI! I watch it now with fondness because there are some incredible scenes and obviously reveals regarding Luke/Vader but in terms of the overall story, it left it completely open ended with as many questions unanswered. That's how The Last Jedi Felt, it opened up so many more questions about what goes where. Obviously Rey will go on to become a Jedi and I hope Kylo Ren will become a proper Sith. This looked the part but felt detached somehow from the feel of Star Wars that the Force Awakens managed to capture.
I enjoyed the parts with Luke and the whole Jedi element of the movie. I also kind of liked the turn against Snoke although I did want to find out more about him, he only gave a slight hint at his force/dark side abilities which would have been good to have seen explored.
I liked how Poe Dameron was used more and shown to be a bit more of a rogue, similar to Han Solo.
Finn seemed a little redundant in this movie, the whole jaunt off to the gambling planet I found a bit boring although the children they showed at the end obviously hints towards future force users.
Thing is this movie left me feeling the same as when I watched The Empire Strikes Back. Which will sound odd but I recall watching that and feeling as though it was a bridge from Episode IV to VI! I watch it now with fondness because there are some incredible scenes and obviously reveals regarding Luke/Vader but in terms of the overall story, it left it completely open ended with as many questions unanswered. That's how The Last Jedi Felt, it opened up so many more questions about what goes where. Obviously Rey will go on to become a Jedi and I hope Kylo Ren will become a proper Sith. This looked the part but felt detached somehow from the feel of Star Wars that the Force Awakens managed to capture.
R8Steve said:
I’m just back from seeing it and while I enjoyed it there was just too many questions left about the plot.
One I can’t see in this thread that really got me was when they went into the old rebel mine and closed the giant door. They then were trying to find a way out, R2D2’s schematics showed no other way out. Next thing you know there’s people, guns and ships popping out from openings in the door, the roof and the sides. 10 mins later they’re all back in it again having the same problem if not being able to find another way out. WTF?!
I assumed they meant no other door that didn't lead head on into the enemy. The trench they took cover in was in front of the door, after all. One I can’t see in this thread that really got me was when they went into the old rebel mine and closed the giant door. They then were trying to find a way out, R2D2’s schematics showed no other way out. Next thing you know there’s people, guns and ships popping out from openings in the door, the roof and the sides. 10 mins later they’re all back in it again having the same problem if not being able to find another way out. WTF?!
A better question would be why didn't they close it straight away? They kept it open so Leia could look out and check for the first order, but as a result tie fighters blew their s
t up, killed rebels and what they presumed was an enemy ship entered. Did Leia seriously not have a window to look out of. Tobias Funke said:
Saw it last night and thought it was a massive disappointment, felt like all the setup in TFA was for nothing.
Made TFA seem like a really good film.I've never been actually bored in a Star Wars film before, even in Episodes 1-3.
6/10 for TLJ, and that's generous.
9/10 for SuperLeia. Fabulous stuff!
Whilst you're right I see it a bit like in every Bond film I could sit there thinking "But why didn't you just shoot Bond in the head rather than let him escape?".
The whole franchise is based on hokey religions and ancient weapons so maybe just suspend your disbelief for a couple of hours when watching
The whole franchise is based on hokey religions and ancient weapons so maybe just suspend your disbelief for a couple of hours when watching
bhstewie said:
hstewie said: Whilst you're right I see it a bit like in every Bond film I could sit there thinking "But why didn't you just shoot Bond in the head rather than let him escape?".
The whole franchise is based on hokey religions and ancient weapons so maybe just suspend your disbelief for a couple of hours when watching
I agree. I hate poking plot holes, some of my favourite films have them. Rich characters and a good story make up for it. Since this film had neither of those things, I feel it fair to be annoyed by the various stupid bits. The whole franchise is based on hokey religions and ancient weapons so maybe just suspend your disbelief for a couple of hours when watching
Pebbles167 said:
I agree. I hate poking plot holes, some of my favourite films have them. Rich characters and a good story make up for it. Since this film had neither of those things, I feel it fair to be annoyed by the various stupid bits.
^^^ This, if the story and characters are good enough you are so engrossed you can usually ignore or allow for hokey plots. However when they don’t you can’t help but notice the other inconsistencies of which this film had far too many, even for a film of this genre.What’s worse is that it not only poo-pooed pretty much everything in the Orignal trilogy, it did away with nearly every single interesting story element or good will that had been built up in TFA and they are meant to be part of the same trilogy!
I really don’t think they had any clue about where they were going to take this trilogy or even if they did, it’s as if someone suddenly decided between TFA and this that they were going to do something totally different. I really don’t see how they recover it from here. Come next year I really can’t see me being at all excited about the final installment.
Guvernator said:
What’s worse is that it not only poo-pooed pretty much everything in the Orignal trilogy, it did away with nearly every single interesting story element or good will that had been built up in TFA and they are meant to be part of the same trilogy!
I really don’t think they had any clue about where they were going to take this trilogy or even if they did, it’s as if someone suddenly decided between TFA and this that they were going to do something totally different. I really don’t see how they recover it from here. Come next year I really can’t see me being at all excited about the final installment.
To be fair, they had no idea where the original trilogy was going, when Star Wars was released it wasn't even part of a greater story. There was no plan for trilogy. Vader wasn't Luke's Father when Star Wars was released. You can drive a bus through the inconsistencies between what is now 4 and 5 because the story was developed afterwards and fudged together which is strikingly obvious when you watch the films.I really don’t think they had any clue about where they were going to take this trilogy or even if they did, it’s as if someone suddenly decided between TFA and this that they were going to do something totally different. I really don’t see how they recover it from here. Come next year I really can’t see me being at all excited about the final installment.
I like the fact they didn't take the well trodden path of Rey being part of the 'family' for example. It has been done. I'm glad Luke didn't take the obvious path.
I enjoyed it. The packed cinema that I was in seemed to have a positive, engaged reaction. There were things I didn't like but I think some of the reviews are people just being a little bit too precious. I am probably seeing it again next week so I'll see how it stands up to a second viewing.
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