Can you park in front of someone's 'extended' dropped kerb?

[TheDrownedApe]

J2daG1990 said:

Well if you parked on the new dropped kerb technically he is right. He paid for the dropped kerb so should be able to enter and exit by it, regardless of if you think hes wrong or right to park on grass on his property.

I don't think he is wrong for parking on his grass - not sure why you read it like this?

Fastra said:

This is precisely the same situation as to my OP.
My question is - If the bloke has applied for and got planning permission DOES his new 'driveway' now includes the extended area.

I'm inclined to think yes, so therefore you can't park in front of his drive.

For me it doesn't stop him accessing his "drive" but by getting the kerb dropped it then allows him easier access to his grass across a public right of way. He can access his grassed area from any point off his drive anyway. If he thought by getting the kerb dropped it would allow him carte-blanche use of the pavement to actually park on 90% of the time then he can FO.

This is why i posed mine version as it's slightly different, albeit the same inquiry. still no easy answer i guess but thanks for raising it

[Zarco]

Roofless Toothless said:

Foss62 said:

Zarco said:

jondude said:

One neighbour admitted it was due to the council quote to get it (a dropped kerb)done.

We're getting a drop kerb put in next week. Council quoted us £7k. There is 2m of grass between the edge of pavement and our boundary, so bit more to it than just changing the kerbs and forming ramp in edge of pavement. Still expensive.

We've saved a bit by going to an approved contractor instead.

I'm not surprised people don't see the value.

Bloody Hell £7K!!!
We needed one as the driveway position had been altered when we moved in to our current house about 18 years ago. The local council told me to go to the highway depot that happened to be in the next village. £50 cash to the gang that turned up was all I needed to pay. They said that was their normal practice if they had materials left from other jobs nearby….

I paid not much less than that when I had mine done a year or two back.

I think the first thing you have to remember, and the first thing you learn when you set out on this job, that it is not a ‘dropped kerb’ we are talking about, but a ‘crossover’. There is a need for plans and research into any services that run under the pavement you wish to drive over - and any possible future plans to put them there. That’s why you need a specialist surveyor/architect to do the investigation and draw up the plans for the council. Just bouncing merrily over the pavement could result in a collapsed conduit, and the price of repairing it could run into five figures. I don’t know why people take the risk. I also had to make special provision within my front garden for run off and block pave several metres to keep the gravel the required distance from the carriageway. It all adds up. The cost of just dropping the kerb and relaying the pavement was less than half of the whole.

In the end though, I think I was lucky to get the job done when I did. Shortly after highways decided to respond to popular requests to put a zebra crossing in front of my house. It was much needed as there is a local school and mums and kids need to get over the road. I ended up with the zig zag lines actually in front of my crossover. I wonder if I would have ever got permission to put the crossover in if the zebra crossing had gone in first, leaving me with no legal access to my off road parking area.

This is what we are getting done. What is currently grass between the lines will be pulled out and replaced with pavement. Bit more than just changing the kerb stones.

[donkmeister]

There's someone near my FIL who bumped up and down the kerb onto their front garden... Then the council installed a traffic calming built-out bit in front of their house with a pedestrian crossing point, which they use as a free dropped kerb. It's not uncommon to be halfway across the crossing and have them start reversing out onto the crossing.

I can understand why people don't do it if they're renting, but the landlord should either be stopping the garden parking from happening or paying for the dropped kerb as a value-adding feature of the house. If it's a council house they would be getting a bulk discount.

[cmvtec]

This one tickled me over Christmas, we were visiting a house near here and there was a garage, driveway, and double gates on this house, and now also the one next door to the right. No legal way of accessing either. The owner of the newer one (not shown on Google) was asking another neighbour to move their (legally parked) car so they could drive over the grass to exit their drive.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4543158,0.2334453,...

[Buzz84]

cmvtec said:

This one tickled me over Christmas, we were visiting a house near here and there was a garage, driveway, and double gates on this house, and now also the one next door to the right. No legal way of accessing either. The owner of the newer one (not shown on Google) was asking another neighbour to move their (legally parked) car so they could drive over the grass to exit their drive.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4543158,0.2334453,...

the one to the left with the caravan has cemented their own ram to get up the kerb too

[Roofless Toothless]

Buzz84 said:

the one to the left with the caravan has cemented their own ram to get up the kerb too

That must do wonders for the drainage down that side of the road. At least one of my neighbours puts something less permanent in the gutter to help him up the kerb.

[joropug]

Roofless Toothless said:

That must do wonders for the drainage down that side of the road. At least one of my neighbours puts something less permanent in the gutter to help him up the kerb.

Prime for a cyclist to go over their handlebars and sue!

[Roofless Toothless]

You can see the patches in the pavement where the cable TV and water go through.

[48k]

Buzz84 said:

cmvtec said:

This one tickled me over Christmas, we were visiting a house near here and there was a garage, driveway, and double gates on this house, and now also the one next door to the right. No legal way of accessing either. The owner of the newer one (not shown on Google) was asking another neighbour to move their (legally parked) car so they could drive over the grass to exit their drive.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4543158,0.2334453,...

the one to the left with the caravan has cemented their own ram to get up the kerb too

That's quite special.

Bet I can guess what the 4 traffic cones on their drive are used for as well.

[cmvtec]

The concrete ramp had been removed when we were there - relative told us the council came and removed it, but he still goes apest if someone parks in front.

Obviously, being a visitor to the area, and that at Christmas it was quite busy, I left my massive Jag right across his "driveway" each time we went.

[anonymous-user]

Roofless Toothless said:

Buzz84 said:

the one to the left with the caravan has cemented their own ram to get up the kerb too

That must do wonders for the drainage down that side of the road. At least one of my neighbours puts something less permanent in the gutter to help him up the kerb.

That was my first thought but to be quite fair they have been quite neighbourly and put a white drain pipe thru it

Not that that would make a jot of difference in our council area with their complete 'lack of highway drains maintenance' programme

[anonymous-user]

Killer2005 said:

donkmeister said:

I must applaud the person who has gone to the effort and expense of actually extending their dropped kerb to fit their driveway.

We spent £2,500 (approx) on extending the driveway and dropped kerb but still we get people parking over it.

10 odd years ago, a neighbour left his st heap outside my house, for days on end.

I recall it cost me around £600 to have my dropped kerb officially extended, giving me parking for 2 cars side by side.

Was the best £600 i’ve spent, eliminated the annoyance.

He didn’t talk to me for a couple of years after that. He’s fallen out with other neighbours since then !

[austinsmirk]

cmvtec said:

This one tickled me over Christmas, we were visiting a house near here and there was a garage, driveway, and double gates on this house, and now also the one next door to the right. No legal way of accessing either. The owner of the newer one (not shown on Google) was asking another neighbour to move their (legally parked) car so they could drive over the grass to exit their drive.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4543158,0.2334453,...

I deal with these special people every other day at work in housing. The vast majority of housing isn’t council: it’s housing association plus an awful lot of houses are sold.

So either the association owns the house and front garden. Or the the owner.

In both scenarios it’s the council that own the road/ pavement/ grass verge etc. They have very little interest in enforcement of all the nightmare parking. Add to that people really couldn’t care less about where they park their cars, they’ll destroy the environment into a mass mud bath. Even worse is the volume of abandoned and illegal cars everywhere where people have to get off road otherwise the police/ dvla do them. Occasionally they’ll drop onto an estate and honestly it’s like every 10th car is clamped.

Landlords can only enforce the “ smashing of a fence and parking a car in the garden “ so far. Everyone has a car. No one ever has the money to do a dropped kerb and build a proper driveway.

You’d think the council would invest into enforcement to make money from fines etc but no. I know categorically in my city even the planning dept is so woefully understaffed that virtually all planning breaches will never be dealt with.

[cmvtec]

austinsmirk said:

cmvtec said:

This one tickled me over Christmas, we were visiting a house near here and there was a garage, driveway, and double gates on this house, and now also the one next door to the right. No legal way of accessing either. The owner of the newer one (not shown on Google) was asking another neighbour to move their (legally parked) car so they could drive over the grass to exit their drive.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4543158,0.2334453,...

I deal with these special people every other day at work in housing. The vast majority of housing isn’t council: it’s housing association plus an awful lot of houses are sold.

So either the association owns the house and front garden. Or the the owner.

In both scenarios it’s the council that own the road/ pavement/ grass verge etc. They have very little interest in enforcement of all the nightmare parking. Add to that people really couldn’t care less about where they park their cars, they’ll destroy the environment into a mass mud bath. Even worse is the volume of abandoned and illegal cars everywhere where people have to get off road otherwise the police/ dvla do them. Occasionally they’ll drop onto an estate and honestly it’s like every 10th car is clamped.

Landlords can only enforce the “ smashing of a fence and parking a car in the garden “ so far. Everyone has a car. No one ever has the money to do a dropped kerb and build a proper driveway.

You’d think the council would invest into enforcement to make money from fines etc but no. I know categorically in my city even the planning dept is so woefully understaffed that virtually all planning breaches will never be dealt with.

I can well imagine - I've seen some of your brilliant anecdotes.

I resolved with my O/H that we will absolutely not consider buying a house ANYWHERE that people park on the grass.

[Ian Geary]

If I was your neighbour, I would be dismayed wih your lack of conversation skills.

Why did you close the door before making any meaningful point to justify your behaviour? Was it because you knew you were in the wrong?

Very odd

TheDrownedApe said:

we have an interesting neighbour who dropped this kerb here and removed the bush.



They own multiple cars and often park on the grass against the neighbours fence as well as 3 cars on the drive and, often, a fifth on this pavement.

a few occasions we have parked one of our cars on this pavement not obstructing their drive but infront of the grassed area.

We get notes saying "please don't park here again", "please don't park on our drive" and he even popped over the other week.

Me: hi

Him: Please don't park on our drive

me: it's not your drive it's a public pavement

Him: Well i had the dropped kerb installed

me: bye [close door]

One assumes in this scenario i as well within my right to tell him to FO - (yes i know i shouldn't block pavements)

[0ddball]

TheDrownedApe said:

we have an interesting neighbour who dropped this kerb here and removed the bush.



They own multiple cars and often park on the grass against the neighbours fence as well as 3 cars on the drive and, often, a fifth on this pavement.

a few occasions we have parked one of our cars on this pavement not obstructing their drive but infront of the grassed area.

We get notes saying "please don't park here again", "please don't park on our drive" and he even popped over the other week.

Me: hi

Him: Please don't park on our drive

me: it's not your drive it's a public pavement

Him: Well i had the dropped kerb installed

me: bye [close door]

One assumes in this scenario i as well within my right to tell him to FO - (yes i know i shouldn't block pavements)

We have a few like that round here. Can afford all the cars but can't afford a bigger property to keep them on. Just looks very scruffy and dare I say it, 'council'.

They are not cheap cars either. One round the crescent has £300k worth of cars and motor home crammed into every spare inch of land outside their £120k house. The mind boggles.

It's like going to a wedding wearing a knackered charity shop suit so you can have the diamond cufflinks you wanted.

[danashby]

0ddball said:

TheDrownedApe said:

we have an interesting neighbour who dropped this kerb here and removed the bush.



They own multiple cars and often park on the grass against the neighbours fence as well as 3 cars on the drive and, often, a fifth on this pavement.

a few occasions we have parked one of our cars on this pavement not obstructing their drive but infront of the grassed area.

We get notes saying "please don't park here again", "please don't park on our drive" and he even popped over the other week.

Me: hi

Him: Please don't park on our drive

me: it's not your drive it's a public pavement

Him: Well i had the dropped kerb installed

me: bye [close door]

One assumes in this scenario i as well within my right to tell him to FO - (yes i know i shouldn't block pavements)

We have a few like that round here. Can afford all the cars but can't afford a bigger property to keep them on. Just looks very scruffy and dare I say it, 'council'.

They are not cheap cars either. One round the crescent has £300k worth of cars and motor home crammed into every spare inch of land outside their £120k house. The mind boggles.

It's like going to a wedding wearing a knackered charity shop suit so you can have the diamond cufflinks you wanted.

I don't see any issue if they had the relevant permissions and paid the council to do all the work.
Besides, maybe they do not want to or can't afford to move and cars are on PCP?

[AJL308]

joropug said:

As far as I know it’s irrelevant whether there is a drive there you shouldn’t park in front of a dropped kerb as it is used for access. Whether that be cars or pedestrians/bicycles.

I don’t think you need planning permission in the average road but the person who does the job has to be licensed and surveys it beforehand to make sure it meets a criteria.

You definitely can't park in front of a dropped kerb. Technically that even applies to the person living in the house who's drive it serves. Councils, however won't enforce it unless the resident asks them to.

Planning permission isn't needed but you need permission from the council to install a dropped kerb. The permission will stipulate how wide it can be. Different councils have different rules about who can do the work.

It annoys the st out of me that lots of people widen their drives but don't bother getting the dropped kerb widened - or even installed at all in some cases - which means the kerb gets smashed to hell by them driving over it. It's also worth noting that the OP mentioned that his neighbor had had his driveway "tiled" - presumably he means block paved or similar. I'm pretty sure that you do need planning for this as it can impact the drainage system due to the much increased water running off your drive rather than soaking away.

[AJL308]

jondude said:

konark said:

Problem is when everyone turns their front gardens into a car lot the whole street becomes one long dropped kerb where does anyone ( say people making deliveries) park without upsetting someone.

We are getting more that people get the front of the house paved but they bounce up the standard kerb to get in (as in the picture above). Some kerbs are cracking because of it.

One neighbour admitted it was due to the council quote to get it (a dropped kerb)done.

In most cases you get get pretty much anyone to do it. I've never had one done on its own but mine was widened when I got my garden tarmaced over (mostly) and they just did it in the original price.

[AJL308]

jondude said:

Zarco said:

jondude said:

One neighbour admitted it was due to the council quote to get it (a dropped kerb)done.

We're getting a drop kerb put in next week. Council quoted us £7k. There is 2m of grass between the edge of pavement and our boundary, so bit more to it than just changing the kerbs and forming ramp in edge of pavement. Still expensive.

We've saved a bit by going to an approved contractor instead.

I'm not surprised people don't see the value.

Man yes, that's expensive.

My whole front garden and existing one car concrete drive was ripped up and replaced with tarmac, including the extended dropped kerb, for £6k about 5 years back. And that was by a big national company which builds actual roads, not someone resident in a caravan.