RE: Porsche 911 'Black Snake': Showpiece of the Week

RE: Porsche 911 'Black Snake': Showpiece of the Week

Monday 4th February

Porsche 911 'Black Snake': Showpiece of the Week

What happens when you take a 993 RS body, a GT2 powertrain and a need for speed at the Nurburgring?



Saturation has made it very easy to be blasé about the Nurburgring, about the claimed lap times and about what it takes to triumphantly get round there. In 2019 so many very quick cars exist, claiming seven minute this and new record that, all with accompanying videos that make it look so easy, that anything lapping in more than eight minutes looks a bit sluggish. When it most certainly is not.

Combine all that with various theories about hooky tyres, sped up footage and the sheer irrelevance of it all, and what was once seen as a staggering technical achievement for a car is now regarded as little more than a willy-waving PR exercise. There are now hundreds of very fortunate people in the world in possession of cars that can lap the Nordschleife in less than seven minutes. Which is bonkers.

It wasn't always like this. Once upon a time, before YouTube and Gran Turismo, the Nurburgring was a mystical, unfamiliar place; a racetrack of great infamy that precious few knew about. And anything that lapped the track in less than eight minutes was truly a mad machine indeed.


Step forward, then, the Porsche 911 Black Snake. Now, we're all well aware of the innumerable examples of 911 capable of going very fast around you-know-where - a GT2 RS Manthey is the quickest production car there and even a 992 Carrera S will do 7:25 - but the Black Snake was a new one on us.

Devised by SHK Motorsport in the 1990s, it took a 993 Carrera RS - already a very focused 911 - and swapped its engine for the twin-turbo flat-six as found in the GT2 Evo. The gearbox and four-wheel drive system were from a Turbo, the outrageous arch extensions pinched off an RSR and all unnecessary weight jettisoned: the windows were Lexan, the interior stripped and the wheels swapped for these gorgeous Cargraphics cross-spokes. The ad claims the Black Snake was less than 1,400kg at the kerb - and when you bear in mind that an outgoing 991 Turbo S was officially making 580hp, as well as weighing another 200kg, you get some idea of just how stupendously rapid a Black Snake must've been.

In 1998, with sportauto legend Horst von Sauma at the wheel, the Black Snake lapped the Nurburgring in 7min 46sec. Says a lot of what we've come to expect now that it doesn't sound all that fast, but bear in mind this was with the tyre, suspension and brake technology of the mid-1990s; a set of stickier tyres - like the Pirelli Trofeo Rs it now has, in fact - and more modern brakes would surely make the Black Snake quicker still.


Well, that's what you'd assume anyway. But for one reason or another, the car is now running a 530hp version of that GT2 engine and while the tyres no doubt improve cornering performance, it seems a shame that they can't be combined with the full fury of that Evo motor. Perhaps something for the next owner to investigate...

They'll need a quarter of a million quid for the privilege, the Black Snake currently for sale at £244,950. Obviously it's being suggested as a worthwhile addition to a collection, though the temptation to experience just what a 650hp 993 is like must surely be great. Even more so when a regular 993 Turbo can now command more than £200k - yes, really - and the sole GT2 on PH is currently the best part of £1.5m. Given this car is unique, has a fascinating back story and looks - let's be honest about this - absolutely bloody fabulous, that initially alarming asking price does look like rather better value.

Prospective buyers are surely in a win-win situation: for those that want to drive it, this is potentially the fastest, most focused 993 out there (definitely so with 650hp back in business). For the collectors, this is a genuine one-off; not a Porsche one-off, granted, but unique nonetheless. And never underestimate the appeal of exclusivity in the classic car market.

See the full ad here


Author
Discussion

cheddar

Original Poster:

4,087 posts

112 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Snake oil?

Robert-nszl1

265 posts

26 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
I'm not sure how strong that history is, but if it has an appropriate file, and all the modifications are original and in period it makes for quite an interesting special. Certainty a very cool looking car

alorotom

5,750 posts

125 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
If this was any other marque it would be slated and ridiculed with its “parts bin” and oem-plus approach

Hairymonster

389 posts

43 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Macari's is always massively optimistically priced.

Helicopter123

5,072 posts

94 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Bizarrely, that represents good value in today's world of old porsches.
Advertisement

fblm

15,749 posts

201 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Tricky one. I don't know why there's not much love in the current market for quality period conversions and specials with proper provenance. IMO they are far more interesting than standard production cars and the lack of interest means the rest of us can get ourselves in some seriously fun cars for a fraction of the ''investment grade'' OEM equivalent. That said, this one's lost its ''original'' evo engine which is a huge shame.

Gecko1978

2,192 posts

95 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
it looks like something it is not, may even be a better steer than that which it is not but simple fact is its not what it appears to be it hugely taints the demand.

This is a car I have seen when using the auto trader app after playing the lotto and if I had £250k it would be a mint 993 turbo s....and to drive on track a 991 gt3


Its Just Adz

9,250 posts

147 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Lovely, I bet that's a lot of fun.

I've had a few decent drives in a "normal" 993 turbo and loved it, would love to experience this.

And as said, it actually looks good value.

big_rob_sydney

2,208 posts

132 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Hmm. Seems like a bit of a Frankenstein car. That has no bearing on its performance, which I'm sure is decent. But if you're in a position to put 250k into something, why not put it into something that you know has provenance? That will likely appreciate more strongly? There are surely cars from "the usual suspects" built from the factory in limited numbers that you could more easily believe would appreciate.

For me, I'd be looking at a RHD 360 Challenge Stradale, or maybe an early GT3 RS.

JackP1

1,241 posts

100 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Still not sold then

B17NNS

17,824 posts

185 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
Wait. What? £220k 993 Turbos are a thing now? yikes

Mintbird

340 posts

39 months

Monday 4th February
quotequote all
hmm been stripped off its gt2 evo engine, now a standard one in there?

downer

Slippydiff

10,087 posts

161 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
My understanding is the car was never fitted with a factory Evo engine.
The engine was 580hp (IIRC) unit built specially by SHK for the very wealthy owner of German company that supplied components to the motor industry. If in doubt, contact SHK, they’re still in business.

It is a Frankenstein car, but it’s based on a LHD 993 Clubsport, one of the rarest iterations if the 993 produced.

Whilst the original SHK built engine has long since gone, it was replaced by an RS Tuning unit. RS Tuning

http://www.rs-tuning.de

are THE go to company for Porsche RACE engines (both aircooled and watercooled) I think this unit has their 530hp conversion.
Rest assured it will have every one of the claimed horsepower, and a wall of torque too.

The car clearly isn’t as light as a 993 Clubsport, but the weight of its turbo engine and 4WD system will have been nullified by the various lightweight panels and the simply massive increase in Hp and torque over the original wheezy 3.8 unit...

It runs a full Bilstein GT2 race car damper/spring remote canister set up, and IIRC the various suspension wishbones and links are all straight from the Motorsport Dept’s catalogue.
It is a proper piece of kit, and even by today’s standards would be fiercely quick.

I came very close to buying it 2-3 years ago (and rest assured I could have bought it for a LOT less than the current asking price)
I wobbled and bailed out at the eleventh hour, figuring if I should need to sell it, I’d take a bath financially (even at the price I could have bought it for)
Much as I still lust over it, I think with hindsight I made the right decision.
It’s provenance is unquestionable, as is its build spec. The only sticking point is it’s value ...
The car was featured in a well known UK Porsche magazine. If you want to know anymore about what is a very unique 911, speak to Matt at Fearnsport, he maintained it for a previous owner for several years up until 2-3 years ago.


964Cup

629 posts

175 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
I don't see it myself. I had a 964 Cup car (hence the username). I modified it in a similarly extreme way (plastic panels, plastic glass, 3.8 litre motor with a GT3 bottom end on Motec with throttle bodies, GT2 brakes etc etc and, indeed, etc). It was really very fast indeed - but apparently not worth very much. It was up for sale at Malton, very optimistically priced, for more than a year with no interest. Eventually I sold it to an old racing mate, who apparently flogged off all the go-faster bits and took it back to original Cup spec. I expect he covered his costs, as the base car had excellent provenance as a proper factory racer; my mods, however much quicker they made it, removed that originality and destroyed value in the process.

Likely this will sell (for less) to someone who will either take it back to 993RS spec or (more likely) turn it into a proper GT2 replica. Either one would take deep pockets and you'd need, what, £100k minimum off the price for it to make sense.

fblm

15,749 posts

201 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
Slippydiff said:
My understanding is the car was never fitted with a factory Evo engine.
The engine was 580hp (IIRC) unit built specially by SHK for the very wealthy owner of German company that supplied components to the motor industry. If in doubt, contact SHK, they’re still in business.

It is a Frankenstein car, but it’s based on a LHD 993 Clubsport, one of the rarest iterations if the 993 produced.

Whilst the original SHK built engine has long since gone, it was replaced by an RS Tuning unit. RS Tuning

http://www.rs-tuning.de

are THE go to company for Porsche RACE engines (both aircooled and watercooled) I think this unit has their 530hp conversion.
Rest assured it will have every one of the claimed horsepower, and a wall of torque too.

The car clearly isn’t as light as a 993 Clubsport, but the weight of its turbo engine and 4WD system will have been nullified by the various lightweight panels and the simply massive increase in Hp and torque over the original wheezy 3.8 unit...

It runs a full Bilstein GT2 race car damper/spring remote canister set up, and IIRC the various suspension wishbones and links are all straight from the Motorsport Dept’s catalogue.
It is a proper piece of kit, and even by today’s standards would be fiercely quick.

I came very close to buying it 2-3 years ago (and rest assured I could have bought it for a LOT less than the current asking price)
I wobbled and bailed out at the eleventh hour, figuring if I should need to sell it, I’d take a bath financially (even at the price I could have bought it for)
Much as I still lust over it, I think with hindsight I made the right decision.
It’s provenance is unquestionable, as is its build spec. The only sticking point is it’s value ...
The car was featured in a well known UK Porsche magazine. If you want to know anymore about what is a very unique 911, speak to Matt at Fearnsport, he maintained it for a previous owner for several years up until 2-3 years ago.
HI Henry, thanks for that. Hope you're well! Back in a Porsche yet?

rampageturke

910 posts

100 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
JackP1 said:
Still not sold then
It'll be put up for sale again in half a years time with a higher price tag, and PH will give them an article again, to try and shill for these stty dealers.

Slippydiff

10,087 posts

161 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
fblm said:
HI Henry, thanks for that. Hope you're well! Back in a Porsche yet?
Morning Francis, Yep all well thanks !! You ??

“Back in a Porsche yet ?”

Trying ...










very, very trying (indeed) biggrin

Updates to follow, sometime, somewhere ...

Slippydiff

10,087 posts

161 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
964Cup said:
I don't see it myself. I had a 964 Cup car (hence the username). I modified it in a similarly extreme way (plastic panels, plastic glass, 3.8 litre motor with a GT3 bottom end on Motec with throttle bodies, GT2 brakes etc etc and, indeed, etc). It was really very fast indeed - but apparently not worth very much. It was up for sale at Malton, very optimistically priced, for more than a year with no interest. Eventually I sold it to an old racing mate, who apparently flogged off all the go-faster bits and took it back to original Cup spec. I expect he covered his costs, as the base car had excellent provenance as a proper factory racer; my mods, however much quicker they made it, removed that originality and destroyed value in the process.

Likely this will sell (for less) to someone who will either take it back to 993RS spec or (more likely) turn it into a proper GT2 replica. Either one would take deep pockets and you'd need, what, £100k minimum off the price for it to make sense.
It’s a tricky one, it’s an amazing piece of kit in its current spec, and it seems a shame to return it back to a standard 993 Clubsport, all the more so when it has such good/interesting and documented provenance. But you’re right, it’s true value lays in being returned to it how it left the factory.
I suspect you’re not a million miles off in your estimate of what it would need to be purchased for to make any project to return it back to standard, viable.
But finding parts such as the correct closer ratio gearbox would be neither easy or cheap (unless you’re happy to pay Freisinger’s exorbitant prices).

With the initial purchase price, the cost of parts and the labour to rebuild it (including what would be a huge bill to return the shell back to its former glory)
I’m doubtful the numbers would stack up, all the moreso as it’s never going to be an “original” car that the collectors now seek.

I did a similar project on the yellow ex-Techart Essen Show 964 RS. It was a labour of love, the end result was stunning, and whilst I made money in what was a rapidly rising market that had just gone past its peak come sale time, it was always going to be a limited market as the car was not original panel.

If as you say, if the Black Snake was £150k it would find it’s way into the hands of an enthusiast who wouldn’t be bothered by its lack of originality, and would actually use and enjoy it for road and track use.


Edited by Slippydiff on Tuesday 5th February 09:16

Desert Dragon

383 posts

22 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
Nice thing about this car is it is both collectable and useable. Not one for the purist. One more for the driver enthusiast...

The minute the RS engine was upgraded to GT2 spec and 4wd added all originality was lost. The fact it has a detuned RS Tuning engine is a bonus as it will run better than the original unit which was designed for setting a lap record not longevity.

How people can drop £250k in to a new GT3 RS and feel this is over priced? This is much nicer or am I missing something? Magnus Walker should buy her smile

Slippydiff

10,087 posts

161 months

Tuesday 5th February
quotequote all
Desert Dragon said:
Nice thing about this car is it is both collectable and useable. Not one for the purist. One more for the driver enthusiast...

The minute the RS engine was upgraded to GT2 spec and 4wd added all originality was lost. The fact it has a detuned RS Tuning engine is a bonus as it will run better than the original unit which was designed for setting a lap record not longevity.

How people can drop £250k in to a new GT3 RS and feel this is over priced? This is much nicer or am I missing something? Magnus Walker should buy her smile
Two very different animals. I'd love a new GT3 RS ....













for about 10 minutes, before I got very bored. Whereas I'd suggest I'd never get bored of this 993smile